HisChildForever Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='Hassan' post='1642811' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:20 PM']You ask me to understand your schedule, which I am fine with. You also accuse me of sticking with my modus operandi of running off etc when I left to sleep, I find that a bit hypocritical. Or when I must leave because I have a busy week ahead of me. I only ask you extend me the same consideration and understanding that you ask I extend you.[/quote] You were in the middle of a busy, active debate and you just left without excusing yourself. It made you look bad. You should have said that you were turning in and would respond tomorow. In the future you should. [quote]He did not lead Abraham to believe that he would be sacraficing his son Isaac?[/quote] He told Abraham to do something, and Abraham did it to the point where he almost killed Isaac. Then, God sent a messenger and told Abraham to stop. God was testing Abraham's faith. He could have done it any way He wanted. But since He knew how much Isaac meant to Abraham, He chose this path.
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 (edited) double post Edited August 31, 2008 by Hassan
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='HisChildForever' post='1642817' date='Aug 30 2008, 09:26 PM']You were in the middle of a busy, active debate and you just left without excusing yourself.[/quote] You had left, that other guy was refusing to answer my question, and had not responded for 20 minutes so I left. [quote]It made you look bad. You should have said that you were turning in and would respond tomorow.[/quote] When I did excuse myself and promised to return Friday I was charged with the exact same things. [quote]In the future you should.[/quote] As I said, I have, with the exact same results. I do not ask anyone here to like me. I [i]do[/i] ask is that if you ask me to understand your busy day, you extend the same understanding. [quote]He told Abraham to do something, and Abraham did it to the point where he almost killed Isaac. Then, God sent a messenger and told Abraham to stop. God was testing Abraham's faith. He could have done it any way He wanted. But since He knew how much Isaac meant to Abraham, He chose this path.[/quote] with all due respect you are dancing is the following question true or false God gave Abraham strong reason to believe that it would be required of him to sacrafice Isaac to God
Fidei Defensor Posted August 31, 2008 Author Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='HisChildForever' post='1642817' date='Aug 30 2008, 08:26 PM']You were in the middle of a busy, active debate and you just left without excusing yourself. It made you look bad. You should have said that you were turning in and would respond tomorow. In the future you should. He told Abraham to do something, and Abraham did it to the point where he almost killed Isaac. Then, God sent a messenger and told Abraham to stop. God was testing Abraham's faith. He could have done it any way He wanted. But since He knew how much Isaac meant to Abraham, He chose this path.[/quote] But technically, God deceived him if he knew all along he would be stopping Abraham.
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='fidei defensor' post='1642851' date='Aug 30 2008, 09:39 PM']But technically, God deceived him if he knew all along he would be stopping Abraham.[/quote] Why are we arguing about this anyway?
KnightofChrist Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 God cannot deceive us, merely test us. God did not deceive Abraham, deception could have only happened if God had allowed Abraham to kill Isaac, which would have made God's earlier promise of covenant blessing a deception.
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1642891' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:53 PM']God cannot deceive us, merely test us. God did not deceive Abraham, deception could have only happened if God had allowed Abraham to kill Isaac, which would have made God's earlier promise of covenant blessing a deception.[/quote] how do you define deception?
HisChildForever Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='Hassan' post='1642842' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:37 PM']God gave Abraham strong reason to believe that it would be required of him to sacrafice Isaac to God[/quote] Yes. But how is this a lie? God told Abraham to sacrifice Isaac. Since Abraham trusted God's promise - that he would be a father of many nations -and knew that God would never lie, one could even argue that Abraham knew that God would intevene before the knife cut Isaac. [quote name='fidei defensor' post='1642851' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:39 PM']But technically, God deceived him if he knew all along he would be stopping Abraham.[/quote] He tested him. [quote name='Hassan' post='1642856' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:40 PM']Why are we arguing about this anyway?[/quote] You tell me. I tried to explain why God was not lying, and it went from there.
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='HisChildForever' post='1642899' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:56 PM']Yes. But how is this a lie? God told Abraham to sacrifice Isaac. Since Abraham trusted God's promise - that he would be a father of many nations -and knew that God would never lie, one could even argue that Abraham knew that God would intevene before the knife cut Isaac. He tested him. You tell me. I tried to explain why God was not lying, and it went from there.[/quote] Then if I say you are correct may we move on?
KnightofChrist Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='Hassan' post='1642896' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:55 PM']how do you define deception?[/quote] Apparently the answer has gone over your head, and whats the deal with you always playing 20 questions, this is a debate. God did not deceive Abraham.
HisChildForever Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='Hassan' post='1642903' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:59 PM']Then if I say you are correct may we move on?[/quote] It's not like I was the one who pushed this issue to the breaking point.
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1642904' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:00 PM']Apparently the answer has gone over your head, and whats the deal with you always playing 20 questions, this is a debate. God did not deceive Abraham.[/quote] I am only asking how you define "deception"
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='HisChildForever' post='1642906' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:01 PM']It's not like I was the one who pushed this issue to the breaking point.[/quote] ok, it was all my fault and you were correct in every respect. May we now move on?
KnightofChrist Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='Hassan' post='1642922' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:11 PM']I am only asking how you define "deception"[/quote] I do not define what God asked of Abraham as deception.
HisChildForever Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='Hassan' post='1642924' date='Aug 30 2008, 11:12 PM']ok, it was all my fault and you were correct in every respect. May we now move on?[/quote] Yes, we can move on. Which means you can stop asking KoC variations of what you were asking me.
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1642925' date='Aug 30 2008, 11:12 PM']I do not define what God asked of Abraham as deception.[/quote] I know that is your claim. How do you define deception in general?
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='HisChildForever' post='1642926' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:14 PM']Yes, we can move on. Which means you can stop asking KoC variations of what you were asking me.[/quote] If he would like to I am happy to move on
KnightofChrist Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='Hassan' post='1642927' date='Aug 30 2008, 10:14 PM']I know that is your claim. How do you define deception in general?[/quote] "To cause to believe what is not true" which if you understood the answer I gave earlier is not what God did in the case of testing Abraham.
Hassan Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1642932' date='Aug 30 2008, 11:16 PM']"To cause to believe what is not true" which if you understood the answer I gave earlier is not what God did in the case of testing Abraham.[/quote] would you like to move on?
HisChildForever Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 [quote name='Hassan' post='1642938' date='Aug 30 2008, 11:19 PM']would you like to move on?[/quote] How patronizing.
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