Amanda Palmer On Abortion, Rape, Art, And Humour (and Censorship)

[takebacktonight]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1795305' date='Mar 2 2009, 04:24 PM']And how does what I said suggest that everyone else on Phatmass is the above?[/quote]


I don't think that you suggested anything of the sort.



Feminism is cool... Catholic feminists are cool... Catholic non-feminists are cool, non-Catholic non-....well you get it.


If I thought people here weren't intelligent, critical thinkers I wouldn't have posted here. I also wouldn't post here if I didn't want to hear opposing viewpoints.

[Hassan]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1795225' date='Mar 2 2009, 02:54 PM']Very nice, Hassan. I like how you were sure to include this.[/quote]


It was not for you, that was just part of her statment. Take offense to it if you want, I already said I felt like it was in the vein of British dark humor which is something you need to have a cultural taste for. It's like how a lot of my friends don't get British sitcoms, I was introduced to them from my moms family and get the jokes, a lot of them don't, it has nothing to do with inteligence, it's just culture.

I don't get a lot of Eastern European jokes.

Let me say it this way, if you took offense to it I am sorry, but it was not aimed at you or anyone else, it was simply what I felt to be relevent in her thing to the discussion.

[Hassan]

[quote name='TotusTuusMaria' post='1795263' date='Mar 2 2009, 03:47 PM']He already said what it meant on page 1. He said it so that the OP would not think we were all non-shoe wearing hillbillies who think women should be at home and Jesus hates those who are raped and have abortions....

.... I got it. [/quote]


I don't care what Pio and Maria say, you're pretty bright

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1795305' date='Mar 2 2009, 04:24 PM']And how does what I said suggest that everyone else on Phatmass is the above?[/quote]

What I said did not take into consideration what you said. Actually, I don't even remember what you said. It just took into consideration what USAirways said and Madame's comments on what he said.

I was just pointing out that USAirways already said what they meant, so the whole "What is that suppose to mean?" has already been answered.

I think your reading to much into what I said. It certainly had nothing to do with you or what you said.

Edited March 6, 2009 by TotusTuusMaria

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1795306' date='Mar 2 2009, 04:26 PM']I have to say that I expected a much different opinion from you.[/quote]

Well... what can I say? I am full of surprises.

Seriously though, what opinion would that be?

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='takebacktonight' post='1795307' date='Mar 2 2009, 04:26 PM']Trust me...I didn't laugh either. I actually cried when I first saw it. Although she does defend the use of humour when dealing with hard stuff, I think her intentions were deeper than that.

As for changing hearts and minds...it's hard to say... It seemed to generate a lot of response and reflection on her site and I know other people are blogging about the censorship aspect of it...[/quote]

I think it will touch very few that need to be touched the most. Those that need to be touched and helped by this are the ones who have actually gone through what she has gone through and try daily to repress memories and emotions related to being raped/having an abortion. What this video does is show the insanity behind being raped, having an abortion, and caring the utmost about a concert or other "frivolous" thing in the end. These people are not dealing with what they are going through. It's insane. And you said you were a teacher and see this all of the time. You also can sympathize with the hurt and pain they are going through. So, this video touched you as it showed how pitiful and insane they are living. However, someone that is living this way... I don't know if it will make them think about how they are living though or even clue them in to the insanity of their actions (have an abortion and then swoon over a concert).

Anyone who laughs at it in a "hahaha" way truly is cruel. I think by her making this video she is even more so "laughing up" what she has gone through and not properly dealing with it. She could do a lot more for women in her situation.

I haven't come to a conclusion on what she is trying to do really. Is she trying to prove a point or is she laughing it up... I don't know. One is tolerable... the other is sick.

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1796061' date='Mar 3 2009, 02:57 AM']I don't care what Pio and Maria say, you're pretty bright












[/quote]

always belittling me.

[takebacktonight]

[quote name='TotusTuusMaria' post='1799283' date='Mar 6 2009, 08:00 PM']However, someone that is living this way... I don't know if it will make them think about how they are living though or even clue them in to the insanity of their actions (have an abortion and then swoon over a concert).[/quote]

There is no way I could or would show this to a group of teenagers (nor could I show them any anti/pro-abortion videos period.) I meant that if they happened to see it on tv or on the internet, they would 'get it'.

I just don't know...like those companies said, that it makes a mockery of abortion and rape.

In terms of my girls, they are lower-level and underprivileged. The video does, as you mention, imply the lunacy of the character's life. The exaggerated approach of the video might be just what they need to wake themselves up and realize "hey, I need help, and I need it now". I think they would get the irony of the abortion/rape/ Oasis autograph situation.

Of course, I can only presume about the young people I have worked with. (One of my former student was incredulous when I told her that no, I had never been in a fistfight!)

The video doesn't show people dealing with their issues no... but I think the first step is actually getting these girls to realize that they need to stop hiding, reach out, and talk.


Any recommendations for other videos that are maybe less provocative but would still pack a dramatic punch?

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='TotusTuusMaria' post='1799267' date='Mar 6 2009, 06:40 PM']Seriously though, what opinion would that be?[/quote]

I expected you to speak of the dignity of women, how crude the music video was, and regardless of the "positive" message the video is trying to convey, issues such as rape and abortion should not be expressed as routine daily activities.

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='takebacktonight' post='1799295' date='Mar 6 2009, 07:34 PM']The video does, as you mention, imply the lunacy of the character's life. The exaggerated approach of the video might be just what they need to wake themselves up and realize "hey, I need help, and I need it now". I think they would get the irony of the abortion/rape/ Oasis autograph situation.[/quote]

The exaggerated approach of the video might also be for shock value and publicity.

[takebacktonight]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1799540' date='Mar 7 2009, 01:11 AM']The exaggerated approach of the video might also be for shock value and publicity.[/quote]

Shock value can be an important tool for change. I've seen anti-abortion protest signs that are incredibly shocking.

I guess my whole intention in posting this at all was to kind of ask... is there alternative way to open up dialoge with young people about the psychological damage of rape, abortion, etc and is this video an example of that? Let me stress, when I say young people I am talking about the ones that lack stability and faith in their lives, the ones with few role models, arguably the ones most at risk of these heinous things happening to them.

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1799536' date='Mar 7 2009, 01:08 AM']I expected you to speak of the dignity of women, how crude the music video was, and regardless of the "positive" message the video is trying to convey, issues such as rape and abortion should not be expressed as routine daily activities.[/quote]

I did say I wouldn't want to watch it again. I didn't care for it. It certainly was crude.

I don't think what she was trying to express though was that abortion and rape are routine daily activities...

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='TotusTuusMaria' post='1799560' date='Mar 7 2009, 12:41 AM']I don't think what she was trying to express though was that abortion and rape are routine daily activities...[/quote]

The lead character's bored facial expressions during each traumatic "chapter" of the video implied a "nothing new here" attitude.

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1799540' date='Mar 7 2009, 01:11 AM']The exaggerated approach of the video might also be for shock value and publicity.[/quote]

I am not getting that vibe from the video. Yes it is shocking, but I don't think she made the video just for that. I mean, this is a woman who has been raped. She has had an abortion. She also considers herself an artist (not saying I agree, but eh...). She is not going to make something without trying to get a point across, especially something that affects her so closely. If she did make it just for shock value and publicity then it is even more ironic because she herself is doing the exact same thing by making the video that she kind of mocks people for doing in the video.

Edited March 7, 2009 by TotusTuusMaria

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1799563' date='Mar 7 2009, 01:43 AM']The lead character's bored facial expressions during each traumatic "chapter" of the video implied a "nothing new here" attitude.[/quote]

Yes, but that goes along with the message of the video that people are treating these experiences in a disordered manner.