TotusTuusMaria Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 (edited) [quote name='Excelsior1027' post='1886805' date='Jun 8 2009, 10:14 PM']I never thought that the relationship between Edward and Bella was real love. It seems more like obsession to me.[/quote] Well I say no at first because it does remind me of obsession and infatuation too, but then again on the other hand, in some instances, it even looks like "agape love." C. S. Lewis describes agape love as a selfless love, a love that was passionately committed to the well-being of the other. And, in many respects, Edward shows that toward Bella. Then, Edward turns around and does something so extreme and odd that what he has for Bella can't be termed "sacrifical, thoughtful, selfless love" but ... a sick obsession. And I honestly do not think Bella's love resembles anything but an obsession and infatuation. But, Edward's I question and say "I don't know" because it goes both ways... Edited June 9, 2009 by TotusTuusMaria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elizabeth09 Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 I do not even believe in vampires. I even try to read the first book, but I only gotten to the forth chapter before I giving up. Also, I never seen the movie. I only try to read the books because I just to see what was all the fuss was about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenchild17 Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='Hassan' post='1886797' date='Jun 8 2009, 09:07 PM']The Hannibal Lecter stories had some subtle Vampire mythology in them. Or so I leadned after getting really bored and reading an Engligh Master's Thesis on the subject The stories are a reflection of pop culture. Yeah, they are prolly gonna be shallow and intellectually deep enough to wade in. I don't see what the big deal is for Catholics though.[/quote] I haven't seen the hannibal movies in a long time, before I ever got interested in vampires. But I suppose that's probably true, probably quite easy to mesh a cannibalistic story with vampirism. And I agree, I think there are some problematic things in her story, but to me I just didn't find her writing particularly very good and part of this was that the disturbing parts of the stories were very easy to spot and were, as you say, just shallow. There are far more stories that are considered great classics that I would be far more worried about because they are written far better and are able to hide their troubling doctrines within their story so that they aren't easy to spot, but are easily accepted (and in fact have ended up on the list of forbidden books for this reason.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitty Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 While I hate the books and Stephanie Myers with a passion, I don't think the books are "dangerous". What's wrong with fantasizing, after all. I know I do. I think it's safe to say only the most naive and ridiculous of people would actually think that these books could be translated into real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luthien Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='Hassan' post='1886804' date='Jun 9 2009, 12:12 AM']Like Romeo and Juliet?[/quote] Overrated. Just a couple of lovesick hormonal teenagers. Call me a pessimist, I prefer realist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinytherese Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='Hassan' post='1886804' date='Jun 8 2009, 10:12 PM']Like Romeo and Juliet?[/quote] Actually, in the second book there is a Romeo and Juliet theme. Both Edward and Bella both almost kill themselves because they cannot be together. That's not love. That's selfishness. In the words of one of my english teachers in high school, it is selfish because doing that you are saying, "My happiness is completely dependent on you. If you are not here to make me happy then there is no point in me living and it is your fault that I am killing myself." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinytherese Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='princessgianna' post='1886816' date='Jun 8 2009, 10:30 PM']I haven;t read the book nor do I really care to. I personally didn't like the vampires. However after reading Tinytherese post I know that I won't read it.[/quote] Looking back, I realize that I left some other even more disturbing things that happened in the series. WARNING, spoiler alert and I can't get the SPOILER to work on this computer. So here it goes... Jacob assaults Bella and later tricks her into passionately making out with him. Edward convinces Jacob to try to persuade Bella to have an abortion and to have a baby with Jacob so that her life will be saved and she can still have a baby. Fortunately it doesn't work. Bella stands firm, yet endures a simply horrific pregnancy that is sickening and if she was not turned into a vampire after child birth then she would have died because the vampire strength of the baby was tearing Bella's body apart. Then Jacob "imprints" which means that he as a werewolf has love at first sight with Bella baby girl. He will wait for her until she is old enough for him to be with her. Another werewolf imprints with a two year old girl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotusTuusMaria Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='tinytherese' post='1887198' date='Jun 9 2009, 02:43 PM']Actually, in the second book there is a Romeo and Juliet theme. Both Edward and Bella both almost kill themselves because they cannot be together. That's not love. That's selfishness. In the words of one of my english teachers in high school, it is selfish because doing that you are saying, "My happiness is completely dependent on you. If you are not here to make me happy then there is no point in me living and it is your fault that I am killing myself."[/quote] I think I remember Stephanie Meyer saying that she used other works as "themes" for each book. I have forgotten where I read this/heard this. I think maybe it was an interview by her. I believe she might have used Romeo and Juliet. [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVEvEtF08S8&feature=related"]Here[/url] is it. Skip to 2:04. "All of the books in the saga have a classical inspiration. With Twilight it was Pride and Prejudice. Very loosely related, but there was definitely an element of Mr. Darcy in Edward and an element of Elizabeth Bennett in Bella. [u]Um, then New Moon was much more closely tied to Romeo and Juliet. It's really the theme of the novel.[/u] Eclipse, for me, was my Wuthering Heights amash, and ah, now with Breaking Dawn there is actually two novels that I have loosely worked with. One is Mid-Summer Nights Dream, and ah, I can't say what the other is!" - Stephanie Meyer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotusTuusMaria Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='Kitty' post='1886950' date='Jun 9 2009, 02:12 AM']I think it's safe to say only the most naive and ridiculous of people would actually think that these books could be translated into real life.[/quote] A lot of girls think right now that an un-vampire like Edward is out there waiting to bump into them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinytherese Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='TotusTuusMaria' post='1887257' date='Jun 9 2009, 04:12 PM']I think I remember Stephanie Meyer saying that she used other works as "themes" for each book. I have forgotten where I read this/heard this. I think maybe it was an interview by her. I believe she might have used Romeo and Juliet. [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVEvEtF08S8&feature=related"]Here[/url] is it. Skip to 2:04. "All of the books in the saga have a classical inspiration. With Twilight it was Pride and Prejudice. Very loosely related, but there was definitely an element of Mr. Darcy in Edward and an element of Elizabeth Bennett in Bella. [u]Um, then New Moon was much more closely tied to Romeo and Juliet. It's really the theme of the novel.[/u] Eclipse, for me, was my Wuthering Heights amash, and ah, now with Breaking Dawn there is actually two novels that I have loosely worked with. One is Mid-Summer Nights Dream, and ah, I can't say what the other is!" - Stephanie Meyer[/quote] I don't see how the first one was like Pride and Prejudice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotusTuusMaria Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='tinytherese' post='1887260' date='Jun 9 2009, 04:16 PM']I don't see how the first one was like Pride and Prejudice. [/quote] lol, I was thinking the same thing as I was typing. I haven't read the books, but I have read a lot about them and seen the movie. I really don't see it either. I wanted to do that little unsure and roll eyes face in that quote, but then I thought, "No, Marie, just type what she said." lol. Yeah, I don't see it either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Vega Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='TotusTuusMaria' post='1887257' date='Jun 9 2009, 03:12 PM']"All of the books in the saga have a classical inspiration. With Twilight it was Pride and Prejudice. Very loosely related, but there was definitely an element of Mr. Darcy in Edward and an element of Elizabeth Bennett in Bella. [u]Um, then New Moon was much more closely tied to Romeo and Juliet. It's really the theme of the novel.[/u] Eclipse, for me, was my Wuthering Heights amash, and ah, now with Breaking Dawn there is actually two novels that I have loosely worked with. One is Mid-Summer Nights Dream, and ah, I can't say what the other is!" - Stephanie Meyer[/quote] You know, everyone is saying what a bad writer she is, but I say it takes real talent to take classic literature and transform it into rubbish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotusTuusMaria Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 [quote name='USAirwaysIHS' post='1887267' date='Jun 9 2009, 04:21 PM']You know, everyone is saying what a bad writer she is, but I say it takes real talent to take classic literature and transform it into rubbish.[/quote] I don't know about that... I really don't think it takes much skill at all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotusTuusMaria Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 Something interesting... ok, I am talking to my friend (one who is in love with Edward) and I was reading her the article (which she agreed with, ty) and what I wrote about and she was saying that she had been talking about it at work with her boss (a guy). He is a really good Baptist, and he pointed out something about Edward. Edward shines likes diamonds, but in reality he is evil and is bad. Like the devil... he appears good and beautiful, but he is not. "I’m the world’s best predator, aren’t I? Everything about me invites you in — my voice, my face, even my smell. As if I need any of that!" - Edward, the movie Kind of like the devil/evil... or even exactly like him. Anyway, something interesting about the character that I never caught on to that he pointed out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 To be fair, when he said lines like [quote]"I’m the world’s best predator, aren’t I? Everything about me invites you in — my voice, my face, even my smell. As if I need any of that!"[/quote], he was referring to why it was dangerous for Bella to be around him, and why she should have nothing to do with him. He did try to convince her not to become attached to him. Let's not take things out of context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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