Lilllabettt Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 (edited) [quote name='HisChildForever' date='18 February 2010 - 08:10 PM' timestamp='1266538259' post='2059030'] How do you define "devout Muslim" and on what do you base this definition? [/quote] This is a question that has troubled Islamic thinkers themselves from the beginning. According to the Kharijites a Muslim who committed a grave sin would cease to be a Muslim; he could be killed. The Murji’ah, on the other hand, said that verbally professing the most heterodox beliefs (such as tritheism) does not necessarily entail infidelity The Isma’ilis and the Twelvers and other Shi'i think that the Imam (I mean [u]the[/u] Imam not an imam) is the infallible interpreter of the Word of God ([i]kalam[/i]), God preservers his interpretation from error. His interpretation is the correct one. The Sufis say that a true Muslim is one who has transcended the material world (and the Sharia) through contemplation. Take your pick. It's a diverse and vibrant intellectual cornucopia. I think all interpretations of "true Islam" deserve serious consideration ... except those interpretations which are actually just cheap political beefs masquerading in religious dress. Do you know the Sufis consider that a form of blasphemy? I didn't watch the video. I know what it is, some sick twisted deforming of an innocent child's mind. There are some real power-thirsty psychopaths in this world. Edited February 19, 2010 by Lilllabettt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilllabettt Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 [quote name='cmotherofpirl' date='18 February 2010 - 08:14 PM' timestamp='1266538459' post='2059032'] It can be useful to have a teacher who is unbiased in regard to his subject matter. Maybe that is the difference between the 2 professors. [/quote] There is no such thing as an "unbiased professor," especially where religion is concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veridicus Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 [quote name='HisChildForever' date='18 February 2010 - 06:24 PM' timestamp='1266539071' post='2059036'] Would you like to discuss the video? [/quote] I think it speaks for itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeenanParkerII Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 (edited) Didn't answer my questions, or my inferences for that matter. Besides, the Ka'bah is a historical structure before it is a religious structure, otherwise it wouldn't extend through a number of religious practices. [quote]HCF, you post a lot about the issue of Islam.[/quote] I wish more people were as devout in exposing the wrongs of the falsity that is Islam. Edited February 19, 2010 by KeenanParkerII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veridicus Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 (edited) [quote name='KeenanParkerII' date='18 February 2010 - 06:46 PM' timestamp='1266540394' post='2059046'] Didn't answer my questions, or my inferences for that matter. Besides, the Ka'bah is a historical structure before it is a religious structure, otherwise it wouldn't extend through a number of religious practices. [/quote] Similar criticisms could be leveled against Catholic traditions and its syncretism with the antecedent pagan culture that it was surrounded by while it grew and assimilated more people. Just playing devil's advocate to your point. Edited February 19, 2010 by Veridicus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted February 19, 2010 Author Share Posted February 19, 2010 [quote name='Lilllabettt' date='18 February 2010 - 07:29 PM' timestamp='1266539343' post='2059037'] I didn't watch the video. I know what it is, some sick twisted deforming of an innocent child's mind. There are some real power-thirsty psychopaths in this world. [/quote] The topic of this thread [i]is[/i] that video. Why are you posting here if you would prefer not to watch it? Perhaps if you did watch the video, you could tell me what group these particular Muslims belong to - the ones who teach their children that the Jews "apes and pigs" and, to further quote the video, "Because they are apes and pigs? Who said that about them?" "Our God." "Where did he say that about them?" "In the Koran." "He said this about them in the Koran. That's right." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted February 19, 2010 Author Share Posted February 19, 2010 [quote name='KeenanParkerII' date='18 February 2010 - 07:46 PM' timestamp='1266540394' post='2059046'] I wish more people were as devout in exposing the wrongs of the falsity that is Islam. [/quote] I like you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted February 19, 2010 Author Share Posted February 19, 2010 Anyway, to slightly derail this thread myself, here is a video of an Egyptian cleric who is preaching, and I quote, "In a few days time, a very dangerous virus will attack the body of the nation. What virus? Is it AIDS? No, something more dangerous. Something more dangerous than Ebola, which dissolves the human body, more dangerous than cholera, which killed half of Europe a few centuries ago. I am talking about the Valentine virus, people." Apparently the day will "destroy our relations with God." He also claims that the more you celebrate the day, the happier you make Christians and Jews and the more you upset Muhammad; therefore the Christians and Jews will "gloat at us" which causes Muhammad to cry. Is Islam not a religion of peace and love? Why is this cleric preaching that a day that celebrates love is dangerous, a "virus"? [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvVXJaASp64&feature=related[/media] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus_lol Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 [quote name='HisChildForever' date='18 February 2010 - 05:08 PM' timestamp='1266541707' post='2059062'] Is Islam not a religion of peace and love? Why is this cleric preaching that a day that celebrates love is dangerous, a "virus"? [media][url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvVXJaASp64&feature=related"]http://www.youtube.c...feature=related[/url][/media] [/quote] it may be because of his massive neck beard. he cant have much success with the ladies, of course his views on love are skewed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeenanParkerII Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 (edited) [quote]Similar criticisms could be leveled against Catholic traditions and its syncretism with the antecedent pagan culture that it was surrounded by while it grew and assimilated more people. Just playing devil's advocate to your point. [/quote] I disagree. Following his flight to Medina, we see the systematic development of Islamic institutions from pagan tradition, specifically: Jihad - Which developed from inter-tribal warfare, Ghazw. Ummah - Super-tribal confederation, based on the practice of subsidiary tribes. Dhimmah - Another extension of subsidiary tribes, but reformed and extended to non-Muslim tribes. A single Prophetic Leader - Developed from Hakim and Shaykhs. Muhammad didn't begin to claim legacy from Abraham until after his flight to Medina. Even the 'Satanic verses' of the Qur'an, in which Muhammad attempted to incorporate the Meccan Gods into Islam, are testament to the gradual growth of pagan practice to Muslim practice; or rather, the effect, which is Islam, is a result of those pagan traditions which preceded it, a thing which cannot be said of Christianity. (The instigation is another matter, but it's part of my studies if you're interested.) Christianity effected change in whatever religion it encountered, and indeed many religions sprang from Christianity. The only causal factor in Christianity is Judaism, which was still retains the principles of monotheism and a continuation of one, single, chronological God. Thus, Islam is one of those religious and cultural synthesis' of Christianity, Judaism, and pagan tradition, while Christianity is a synthesis of a single man influenced only by Judaism, and other proxy men also only influenced by Judaism. Therein lies the difference between them, and of course a number of problems of communication, where Muhammad argues against things he perceives to be Christian which were not. Telephone tag anyone? And if we really wanted to, we can get into the obvious influence of Muhammad's personal life on his divine dispensation, like the revelation which reveals his wife did not really cheat on him with that young man in the desert. Things are getting personal. Edited February 19, 2010 by KeenanParkerII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seven77 Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 [quote name='HisChildForever' date='18 February 2010 - 08:08 PM' timestamp='1266541707' post='2059062'] Anyway, to slightly derail this thread myself, here is a video of an Egyptian cleric who is preaching, and I quote, "In a few days time, a very dangerous virus will attack the body of the nation. What virus? Is it AIDS? No, something more dangerous. Something more dangerous than Ebola, which dissolves the human body, more dangerous than cholera, which killed half of Europe a few centuries ago. I am talking about the Valentine virus, people." Apparently the day will "destroy our relations with God." He also claims that the more you celebrate the day, the happier you make Christians and Jews and the more you upset Muhammad; therefore the Christians and Jews will "gloat at us" which causes Muhammad to cry. Is Islam not a religion of peace and love? Why is this cleric preaching that a day that celebrates love is dangerous, a "virus"? [/quote] What are you trying to accomplish by these posts if I may ask? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 meet the new muslim thread..... same as the old muslim thread...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted February 19, 2010 Author Share Posted February 19, 2010 I appreciate Keenan and Lilllabettt for actually participating in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 meet the new passive agressiveness. same as the old passive agressiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted February 19, 2010 Author Share Posted February 19, 2010 And how would you define your behavior in this thread so far, MIKolbe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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