A Civilized And Focused Discussion On Life Teen

[MissScripture]

[quote name='TeresaBenedicta' timestamp='1311622029' post='2275809']
A general comment, outside of the context of this discussion: As the only Catholic in my family, I have to admit I sometimes feel uncomfortable going to Mass by myself. Seeing everybody else together with their families, and me all by my lonesome. I mean, obviously it's not what Mass is all about. But, on a very natural level, one can feel quite left out.
[/quote]
Especially when one is a teenager. It was always weird enough when I had to go by myself for some reason, and I would always sit with another family that we knew. If a teen didn't know anyone, I can see how that would be that much harder.

[Papist]

[quote name='TeresaBenedicta' timestamp='1311622029' post='2275809']
A general comment, outside of the context of this discussion: As the only Catholic in my family, I have to admit I sometimes feel uncomfortable going to Mass by myself. Seeing everybody else together with their families, and me all by my lonesome. I mean, obviously it's not what Mass is all about. But, on a very natural level, one can feel quite left out.
[/quote]
My point is that, that is not how it should be. Altering the Mass is not going to change that. Learning what the Mass is and why we go/participate is the key. Teens are not the only demographic with such a scenario. I lived by myself away from family for many years. And during those years I attended mass alone. So I am curious to what was/is causing the uncomfortableness.

[TeresaBenedicta]

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1311634680' post='2275901']
My point is that, that is not how it should be. Altering the Mass is not going to change that. Learning what the Mass is and why we go/participate is the key. Teens are not the only demographic with such a scenario. I lived by myself away from family for many years. And during those years I attended mass alone. So I am curious to what was/is causing the uncomfortableness.
[/quote]

Hence my qualifier that my comment was outside of the context of the current conversation.

But I'll play devil's advocate for a bit. Teens may not be the only demographic with such a scenario, but they are the most likely to be adversely affected by such a scenario. And less likely to be capable of a mature and rational response. Teens struggle between emotional response and allowing their reason to rule their emotions. It's just part of their development.

All that being said... I don't think it's a strong reason to have a Lifeteen Mass or have the teens sit together. But I can see it as a contributing factor.

Having Masses for a particular group of people is not unheard of. Even at the seminary! Every once in a while they will have a "diocesan brother" Mass- yes, even on Sunday! Where just the DB's will get together for their own Mass. The rest of the seminary has the regular Sunday Mass together.

Regardless... I don't think Lifeteen is as isolating as you seem to make it out to be. Sure, there are particular elements that focus on developing the youth. But not to the exclusion of the rest of the parish or of the family.

Everyonce in a while I go to the local Lifeteen Mass on Sunday evening. And believe it or not, there are a LOT of families there. And the teens generally sit with their families. Granted, there is a group of teens that do the music, and usually the teens usher and serve as EMHC's. But it's a lot of family worship. This is great for a weekly basis.

While perhaps not on a weekly basis, I do think an even more focused Mass for teens is helpful and good. Including sitting together, a specified homily, teen prepping and planning of the liturgy, etc.

[BG45]

[quote name='TeresaBenedicta' timestamp='1311622029' post='2275809']
A general comment, outside of the context of this discussion: As the only Catholic in my family, I have to admit I sometimes feel uncomfortable going to Mass by myself. Seeing everybody else together with their families, and me all by my lonesome. I mean, obviously it's not what Mass is all about. But, on a very natural level, one can feel quite left out.
[/quote]

Also outside of the discussion context, I agree whole heartedly. I'm the only Catholic in my family, and when it's summer up here, I'm one of the few Catholics under 40 and above 12 at Mass at my parish. I always sit alone and get the same stares from people, be they amazed that someone my age would come, or accusatory, as if to say, "It's summer, we're not supposed to have to deal with your kind". Then at the Sign of Peace, all the people who are amazed tend to flock happily toward you to shake your hand while alone.

[dells_of_bittersweet]

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1311620891' post='2275788']
The question is, why would they feel very uncomfortable? I believe making them feel comfortable needs to be worked on outside the Mass. And more so, the homily/preaching ought not be diluted to make everyone comfortable.
[/quote]

So what if you feel that the comfortable issue needs to be worked out outside Mass. We're all supposed to be coming together as one at the Mass, and if people feel uncomfortable that's a legitimate problem. We should do everything within our power, as long as we don't break any liturgical norms, to make everyone feel comfortable.

I have never seen a diluted Lifeteen homily. My experience is that although the homilist will occasionally reference the teens at certain points in his homily the Lifeteen homily is usually deeper than I get from other parishes.

[dells_of_bittersweet]

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1311620891' post='2275788']
The question is, why would they feel very uncomfortable? I believe making them feel comfortable needs to be worked on outside the Mass. And more so, the homily/preaching ought not be diluted to make everyone comfortable.
[/quote]

So what if you feel that the comfortable issue needs to be worked out outside Mass. We're all supposed to be coming together as one at the Mass, and if people feel uncomfortable that's a legitimate problem. We should do everything within our power, as long as we don't break any liturgical norms, to make everyone feel comfortable.

I have never seen a diluted Lifeteen homily. My experience is that although the homilist will occasionally reference the teens at certain points in his homily the Lifeteen homily is usually deeper than I get from other parishes.

[Vincent Vega]

I think it's a flaw of our society that it teaches us that we should always be comfortable.

[TeresaBenedicta]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' timestamp='1311652279' post='2276058']
I think it's a flaw of our society that it teaches us that we should always be comfortable.
[/quote]

In general, I agree.

In this particular situation, I disagree.

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='TeresaBenedicta' timestamp='1311653690' post='2276070']
In general, I agree.

In this particular situation, I disagree.
[/quote]
I could see it going either way in this instance.

[TeresaBenedicta]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' timestamp='1311654438' post='2276075']
I could see it going either way in this instance.
[/quote]

True.

I guess I'm a bit biased because of my own experience. But, especially with teens... logic isn't always at the forefront yet. It's that struggle between emotion and logic. Logically, it's okay to be uncomfortable at Mass and, logically, you get over it because there are far more important reasons to be at Mass (like, real worship and true active participation). But. Again. With teens we need to be aware of their developmental transitions.

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='TeresaBenedicta' timestamp='1311654916' post='2276079']
True.

I guess I'm a bit biased because of my own experience. But, especially with teens... logic isn't always at the forefront yet. It's that struggle between emotion and logic. Logically, it's okay to be uncomfortable at Mass and, logically, you get over it because there are far more important reasons to be at Mass (like, real worship and true active participation). But. Again. With teens we need to be aware of their developmental transitions.
[/quote]
And the whole "come for the friendship, stay in for the Truth" thing is why I can see Lifeteen et al being useful. But I too was once a 16 year old convert who spent Sundays at Mass by myself and I think it led to a much keener appreciation for what I had in the Mass than many of my contemporaries.

[TeresaBenedicta]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' timestamp='1311655040' post='2276081']
And the whole "come for the friendship, stay in for the Truth" thing is why I can see Lifeteen et al being useful. But I too was once a 16 year old convert who spent Sundays at Mass by myself and I think [b]it led to a much keener appreciation for what I had in the Mass than many of my contemporaries.[/b]
[/quote]

Definitely the same for me as well. But I also know of a few teen converts who... fell off the bandwagon, so to say. And part of it was never finding an "in" or really feeling a part of the parish.

Heck, I [i]still[/i] don't feel like a member of my home parish.

[Luigi]

[quote name='TeresaBenedicta' timestamp='1311655731' post='2276085']
Definitely the same for me as well. But I also know of a few teen converts who... fell off the bandwagon, so to say. And part of it was never finding an "in" or really feeling a part of the parish.

Heck, I [i]still[/i] don't feel like a member of my home parish.
[/quote]

I'm a cradle Catholic but I get the same feeling at my parish. There are the"old families" - descended from the 1850's immigrants; there are the Baby Boom families - they've been in the parish for only ffity or sixty years, so the "old families" consider them to be newcomers still; and there are the rest of us. We're good for staffing tables/booths at events, but we'll never be elected to positions of authority... unless, of course, you have the backingof three or four "old families" who would rather direct than serve.

Parishes are [i]at least [/i]as social as they are liturgical - all God's children are human, after all. And the social aspects of life are probably even more important to most of God's younger children.

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='TeresaBenedicta' timestamp='1311655731' post='2276085']
Heck, I [i]still[/i] don't feel like a member of my home parish.
[/quote]
Same. I'm not saying it wasn't difficult or that I wouldn't have liked to have some fellowship, but it wasn't completely devoid of benefit.
And I'm sure that if I walked into Sunday Mass at my parish back in my home town, I wouldn't be recognized by anyone (the pastors who were there when I went through RCIA are both gone and if there would be anyone who would remember me, it would be the RCIA coordinator...and I wouldn't put money on that).

[Papist]

[quote name='TeresaBenedicta' timestamp='1311636347' post='2275910']
Hence my qualifier that my comment was outside of the context of the current conversation.

But I'll play devil's advocate for a bit. Teens may not be the only demographic with such a scenario, but they are the most likely to be adversely affected by such a scenario. And less likely to be capable of a mature and rational response. Teens struggle between emotional response and allowing their reason to rule their emotions. It's just part of their development.

All that being said... I don't think it's a strong reason to have a Lifeteen Mass or have the teens sit together. But I can see it as a contributing factor.

Having Masses for a particular group of people is not unheard of. Even at the seminary! Every once in a while they will have a "diocesan brother" Mass- yes, even on Sunday! Where just the DB's will get together for their own Mass. The rest of the seminary has the regular Sunday Mass together.

Regardless... I don't think Lifeteen is as isolating as you seem to make it out to be. Sure, there are particular elements that focus on developing the youth. But not to the exclusion of the rest of the parish or of the family.

Everyonce in a while I go to the local Lifeteen Mass on Sunday evening. And believe it or not, there are a LOT of families there. And the teens generally sit with their families. Granted, there is a group of teens that do the music, and usually the teens usher and serve as EMHC's. But it's a lot of family worship. This is great for a weekly basis.

While perhaps not on a weekly basis, I do think an even more focused Mass for teens is helpful and good. Including sitting together, a specified homily, teen prepping and planning of the liturgy, etc.
[/quote]
[font="Arial"][size="2"]No. I am inside the context. If I would have attended LT mass, with all its embellishments, for 5 years[8[sup]th[/sup]-12[sup]th[/sup]grades], I would have gotten accustomed to the LT mass as that is what mass is for me. Then when I move on to college and further on where there is no LT mass. What do I do if there is no LT mass around b/c I now require all the hip, upbeat music and youth physical involvement. I see this non-LT mass as a mundane, lack of enthusiasm mass. The mass is now foreign to me.[/size][/font]


[quote name='dells_of_bittersweet' timestamp='1311646237' post='2276000']
So what if you feel that the comfortable issue needs to be worked out outside Mass. We're all supposed to be coming together as one at the Mass, and if people feel uncomfortable that's a legitimate problem. We should do everything within our power, as long as we don't break any liturgical norms, to make everyone feel comfortable.

I have never seen a diluted Lifeteen homily. My experience is that although the homilist will occasionally reference the teens at certain points in his homily the Lifeteen homily is usually deeper than I get from other parishes.
[/quote]
[font="Arial"][size="2"]Obviously, there is no wrong doing with sitting with your friends in mass. My sister-in-law meets her friends for mass all the time. What I am trying to understand is why one's comfortableness is determined by if they sit with friends/peers or not. [/size][/font][font="Arial"][size="2"]If there are going to be changes to make one group comfortable, should it be at the expense of making another uncomfortable? Is it being said one group is more essential than the others?[/size][/font]

[font="Arial"][size="2"]Also, the same applies for the old folks Sunday early morning mass. [/size][/font]

Edited July 26, 2011 by Papist