The Whosoevers: Murder Your Flesh

[Papist]

[quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330391696' post='2393815']
Is this your interpretation of this verse? Did I say that His flesh profits nothing? Do not assume to know what I think or believe.
[/quote]

Yet you know what I am thinking and know better than me. I just don't understand why your interpretations are right and mine are wrong, if we both claim the Holy Spirit is guiding us. I don't understand why you have authority to decide which of us is right, and I don't.

[Papist]

[quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330392484' post='2393830']
Where in the bible does it say this? I believe it is the Spirit that guides not the church. Can you back up your claim biblically...I can
[/quote]
[quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330392945' post='2393840']
Where did it speak as the church being the only way to interpret the bible..,sorry did not get that from those verses...it's just not there...I'll read over it again and again to see if I can find that there...I'll be back
[/quote]

[img]http://terribleanalogies.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Bert-Facepalm.jpg[/img]
Argh! We are back where we started. This goes back to my original question. Where in the Bible does it say that all Truth/Revelation is contained in the Bible, and only in the Bible? And why should we believe the Bible[as we know it today] is the inspired word of God?

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330392484' post='2393830']
Where in the bible does it say this? I believe it is the Spirit that guides not the church. Can you back up your claim biblically...I can
[/quote]

Ok did you miss the part about the Jesus founded a Church, He didn't write a book?

The New Testament never claims to be the final authority , it can't. The Church existed before the New Testament was written, the Church compiled the New Testament, its is a CATHOLIC set of books.

[BG45]

[quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330396910' post='2393871']
Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ. 9 For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily; 10 and you are complete in Him, who is the head of all principality and power. Colossians 2
[/quote]

Except when you quote Colossians 2: 8-10, you neglect the context of Colossians 2:6-7. "So then, just as you received Christ Jesus as Lord, continue to live your lives in him, rooted and built up in him, [b]strengthened in the faith as you were taught[/b], and overflowing with thankfulness."

Notice what I bolded there; the teaching of faith is more than just the reading of Scripture, it's the passing down of tradition. I don't use a big T, because we had traditions we passed down in my Baptist church too, they just weren't call such. So while I appreciate you indirectly calling me a slave of false prophets with an out of context Scripture citation, I assure you that Jesus is my Lord. Again, as so many others have said, we return to the question of who is right when everyone says they are inspired by the Holy Spirit. The Pew Center says there are more than 30,000 denominations of Christianity in the world, and every single one of them claims to be guided by the Holy Spirit.

[Louie]

[quote name='Archaeology cat' timestamp='1330432305' post='2393988']
I was the one who posted about Isaiah 22. If you look at the full context, you see it is referring not to the Davidic king, but to the steward. The steward was the one who held the keys in the name of the king. We see in Matthew 16 our King (Jesus) exercising His kingly authority in giving the keys to His steward, Peter. Ultimately the King has the authority of the keys, but He gives the keys to the steward, delegating that authority. It's another both/and situation, and not an either/or. Here's something answering it better than I: http://www.catholic.com/quickquestions/dont-revelation-37-and-isaiah-22-point-to-christ-not-peter-as-having-the-keys-of-davi

God bless
[/quote]

    20  'Then it shall be in that day,
That I will call My servant Eliakim the son of Hilkiah; 
    21  I will clothe him with your robe
And strengthen him with your belt;
I will commit your responsibility into his hand.
He shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem
And to the house of Judah. 

In that verse I posted in Revelation...Jesus still has the keys...He still opens and closes... "the government shall be upon Messiah's shoulder" (Isa_9:6; Isa_22:22); He shuts or opens at will the access to the heavenly mansion (Rev_3:7), He has the keys also of hell (the grave) and death (Rev_1:18).

[Louie]

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1330435037' post='2393997']


Yet you know what I am thinking and know better than me. I just don't understand why your interpretations are right and mine are wrong, if we both claim the Holy Spirit is guiding us. I don't understand why you have authority to decide which of us is right, and I don't.
[/quote]

I'll tell you this one more time...so pay attention...if your interpretation of Ephesians 5:22 was giving you the rights to beat your wife...which you stated before...than I can honestly say to you that you have misinterpreted the scripture and have not the Holy Spirit guiding you in this...for this is not biblical...Acts 17:11 These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.
They searched the scriptures to see whether these things were so...so I searched the scriptures and found what you said not so.

If you don't get it by now...go and pray about this because I am not going to convince you nor convict you...that is the work of the Holy Spirit not me...all I can do is share the truth with you

[cmotherofpirl]

Just curious...What Scriptures existed at the time Luke- Acts was written? The New Testament didn't yet exist.

[Louie]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' timestamp='1330452177' post='2394065']


Ok did you miss the part about the Jesus founded a Church, He didn't write a book?

The New Testament never claims to be the final authority , it can't. The Church existed before the New Testament was written, the Church compiled the New Testament, its is a CATHOLIC set of books.
[/quote]

First of all the scriptures were written about Him...Jesus said...You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me. But you are not willing to come to Me that you may have life. 

Also scriptures are shown to verify things concerning Jesus...For these things were done that the Scripture should be fulfilled, "Not one of His bones shall be broken." And again another Scripture says, "They shall look on Him whom they pierced."

Jesus used scriptures...Have you not even read this Scripture:
'The stone which the builders rejected
Has become the chief cornerstone. 
    This was the Lord's doing,
And it is marvelous in our eyes'? "* 

Luke 4
    16  So He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up. And as His custom was, He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up to read.  17  And He was handed the book of the prophet Isaiah. And when He had opened the book, He found the place where it was written: 
    18  "The Spirit of the Lord is upon Me,
Because He has anointed Me
To preach the gospel to the poor;
He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted,*
To proclaim liberty to the captives
And recovery of sight to the blind,
To set at liberty those who are oppressed; 
    19  To proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord."* 
    20  Then He closed the book, and gave it back to the attendant and sat down. And the eyes of all who were in the synagogue were fixed on Him.  21  And He began to say to them, "Today this Scripture is fulfilled in your hearing."  22  So all bore witness to Him, and marveled at the gracious words which proceeded out of His mouth. And they said, "Is this not Joseph's son?" 

Also in Acts 15...at the counsel in Jerusalem they turned to the scriptures to reach an agreement...12  Then all the multitude kept silent and listened to Barnabas and Paul declaring how many miracles and wonders God had worked through them among the Gentiles.  13  And after they had become silent, James answered, saying, "Men and brethren, listen to me:  14  Simon has declared how God at the first visited the Gentiles to take out of them a people for His name.  15  And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written: 
    16  'After this I will return
And will rebuild the tabernacle of David, which has fallen down;
I will rebuild its ruins,
And I will set it up; 
    17  So that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
Even all the Gentiles who are called by My name,
Says the Lord who does all these things.'* 
    18  "Known to God from eternity are all His works.*  19  Therefore I judge that we should not trouble those from among the Gentiles who are turning to God,  20  but that we write to them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality,* from things strangled, and from blood.  21  For Moses has had throughout many generations those who preach him in every city, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath." 

Also Peter used the word of the Lord to verify what he had seen...Acts 11...16 Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, 'John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.'  17  If therefore God gave them the same gift as He gave us when we believed on the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could withstand God?" 

There are very many verses I can use all day long but if you refuse to see it as it reads then like I said before...I can only share the truth and pray that the "Holy Spirit" will guide you and not that spirit that misled you in Ephesians 5:22

[Louie]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' timestamp='1330463658' post='2394164']
Just curious...What Scriptures existed at the time Luke- Acts was written? The New Testament didn't yet exist.
[/quote]

The same scriptures Jesus used when He taught in the synagogues and on the road to Emmaus...Luke 24    13  Now behold, two of them were traveling that same day to a village called Emmaus, which was seven miles* from Jerusalem.  14  And they talked together of all these things which had happened.  15  So it was, while they conversed and reasoned, that Jesus Himself drew near and went with them.  16  But their eyes were restrained, so that they did not know Him. 
    17  And He said to them, "What kind of conversation is this that you have with one another as you walk and are sad?"* 
    18  Then the one whose name was Cleopas answered and said to Him, "Are You the only stranger in Jerusalem, and have You not known the things which happened there in these days?" 
    19  And He said to them, "What things?"
So they said to Him, "The things concerning Jesus of Nazareth, who was a Prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people, 20  and how the chief priests and our rulers delivered Him to be condemned to death, and crucified Him.  21  But we were hoping that it was He who was going to redeem Israel. Indeed, besides all this, today is the third day since these things happened.  22  Yes, and certain women of our company, who arrived at the tomb early, astonished us.  23  When they did not find His body, they came saying that they had also seen a vision of angels who said He was alive.  24  And certain of those who were with us went to the tomb and found it just as the women had said; but Him they did not see." 
    25  Then He said to them, "O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe in all that the prophets have spoken!  26  Ought not the Christ to have suffered these things and to enter into His glory?"  27  And beginning at Moses and all the Prophets, He expounded to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning Himself. 
    28  Then they drew near to the village where they were going, and He indicated that He would have gone farther.  29  But they constrained Him, saying, "Abide with us, for it is toward evening, and the day is far spent." And He went in to stay with them. 
    30  Now it came to pass, as He sat at the table with them, that He took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to them.  31  Then their eyes were opened and they knew Him; and He vanished from their sight. 
    32  And they said to one another, "Did not our heart burn within us while He talked with us on the road, and while He opened the Scriptures to us?"  33  So they rose up that very hour and returned to Jerusalem, and found the eleven and those who were with them gathered together,  34  saying, "The Lord is risen indeed, and has appeared to Simon!"  35  And they told about the things that had happened on the road, and how He was known to them in the breaking of bread. 

[Selah]

[quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330464323' post='2394170']
The same scriptures Jesus used when He taught in the synagogues and on the road to Emmaus...
[/quote]

The Torah and the Tanaka. However, the New Testament had not yet been compiled.

[Louie]

[quote name='BG45' timestamp='1330452739' post='2394070']


Except when you quote Colossians 2: 8-10, you neglect the context of Colossians 2:6-7. "So then, just as you received Christ Jesus as Lord, continue to live your lives in him, rooted and built up in him, [b]strengthened in the faith as you were taught[/b], and overflowing with thankfulness."

Notice what I bolded there; the teaching of faith is more than just the reading of Scripture, it's the passing down of tradition. I don't use a big T, because we had traditions we passed down in my Baptist church too, they just weren't call such. So while I appreciate you indirectly calling me a slave of false prophets with an out of context Scripture citation, I assure you that Jesus is my Lord. Again, as so many others have said, we return to the question of who is right when everyone says they are inspired by the Holy Spirit. The Pew Center says there are more than 30,000 denominations of Christianity in the world, and every single one of them claims to be guided by the Holy Spirit.
[/quote]

Where does it say "the teaching of faith is more than just the reading of Scripture, it's the passing down of tradition."?
So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Romans 10:17

Test all things with scripture to see if what they teach aligns with it. I have answered this question over and over again...i think it's called having a discerning spirit

[Louie]

 13  However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.  14  He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you. John 16:13

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330460736' post='2394149']


    20  'Then it shall be in that day,
That I will call My servant Eliakim the son of Hilkiah; 
    21  I will clothe him with your robe
And strengthen him with your belt;
I will commit your responsibility into his hand.
He shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem
And to the house of Judah. 

In that verse I posted in Revelation...Jesus still has the keys...He still opens and closes... "the government shall be upon Messiah's shoulder" (Isa_9:6; Isa_22:22); He shuts or opens at will the access to the heavenly mansion (Rev_3:7), He has the keys also of hell (the grave) and death (Rev_1:18).
[/quote]Did you read the link provided? Eliakim is not the king. He is the steward who holds the keys for the king. The king owns the keys, and can give them to whom he will, and can instruct the steward to open or shut, but there is still a steward. Jesus, the King, gives the keys to Peter in Matthew. There is an obvious parallel. But I'm repeating myself, and this won't get us anywhere. May God bless you.

[Louie]

[quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330465043' post='2394176']


The Torah and the Tanaka. However, the New Testament had not yet been compiled.
[/quote]

The question was "what scriptures existed?"...I answered the question giving biblical references...the bible consists of both the old testament and the new testament...what is the problem here...what more do you want?

[Selah]

The New Testament was compiled and put together, in its final form, in AD 367.