Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Archaeology cat' timestamp='1330465842' post='2394186'] Did you read the link provided? Eliakim is not the king. He is the steward who holds the keys for the king. The king owns the keys, and can give them to whom he will, and can instruct the steward to open or shut, but there is still a steward. Jesus, the King, gives the keys to Peter in Matthew. There is an obvious parallel. But I'm repeating myself, and this won't get us anywhere. May God bless you. [/quote] Did you read what I posted about Jesus still having the keys in the book of Revelation...and He is the one who opens and shuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330466754' post='2394199'] The New Testament was compiled and put together, in its final form, in AD 367. [/quote] Your point is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330466909' post='2394202'] Your point is? [/quote] Sigh. I doubt such a thing matters anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) I know how you feel! I was answering a question asked by someone concerning what scriptures existed during the times that Luke-Acts was written...the scriptures that existed were the books of the old testament...correct me if I'm wrong...the old testament is considered as scripture Edited February 28, 2012 by Louie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 [quote]I was answering a question asked by someone concerning what scriptures existed during the times that Luke-Acts was written...the scriptures that existed were the books of the old testament...correct me if I'm wrong [/quote] Yes, they existed during the time of Christ and of course, after His ascension and into the early church. Please excuse me, I misunderstood you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Selah' timestamp='1330467744' post='2394211'] Yes, they existed during the time of Christ and of course, after His ascension and into the early church. Please excuse me, I misunderstood you. [/quote] It all good...it's getting a little out of hand here...going all over the place...have a blessed day...grace and peace to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selah Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Same to you, may the peace of Christ be with you (and don't take everything I say or do personally; I'm just wacky ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 This is what happens when you censor the unvarnished truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaeology cat Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 [quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330466839' post='2394201'] Did you read what I posted about Jesus still having the keys in the book of Revelation...and He is the one who opens and shuts. [/quote]Yes, I did. And both the link I provided and I addressed how the two were not mutually exclusive, for Jesus as King owns the keys, and of course can use them, but also gives them to the steward. One cannot ignore that Eliakim was not the king, nor can one ignore the parallel with Jesus giving the keys to Peter. God bless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 [quote name='Archaeology cat' timestamp='1330470835' post='2394247'] Yes, I did. And both the link I provided and I addressed how the two were not mutually exclusive, for Jesus as King owns the keys, and of course can use them, but also gives them to the steward. One cannot ignore that Eliakim was not the king, nor can one ignore the parallel with Jesus giving the keys to Peter. God bless [/quote] Well if you see a parallel with that given to Peter there then you must also see it with this verse in Matthew 18:18, which Jesus addresses the disciples saying the same thing to them...  1 At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, "Who then is greatest in the kingdom of heaven?"     2 Then Jesus called a little child to Him, set him in the midst of them,  3 and said, "Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.  4 Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.  5 Whoever receives one little child like this in My name receives Me.     6 "Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to sin, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck, and he were drowned in the depth of the sea.  7 Woe to the world because of offenses! For offenses must come, but woe to that man by whom the offense comes!     8 "If your hand or foot causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life lame or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet, to be cast into the everlasting fire.  9 And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes, to be cast into hell fire.      10 "Take heed that you do not despise one of these little ones, for I say to you that in heaven their angels always see the face of My Father who is in heaven.  11 For the Son of Man has come to save that which was lost.*     12 "What do you think? If a man has a hundred sheep, and one of them goes astray, does he not leave the ninety-nine and go to the mountains to seek the one that is straying?  13 And if he should find it, assuredly, I say to you, he rejoices more over that sheep than over the ninety-nine that did not go astray.  14 Even so it is not the will of your Father who is in heaven that one of these little ones should perish.     15 "Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother.  16 But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that 'by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.'*  17 And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.     18 "Assuredly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven. Do you see the parallel here? Peter was not the only one told this... How do you explain this same binding and loosening given to the rest of the disciples...same words were spoken to them as well...not just limited to Peter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Oh no. You have completely undone us. In 2000 years, this question has never come up; there are no answers to this question. Welp, we had a good run, guys. Are you the one that was claiming you were formerly Catholic? I can't remember, and don't want to look back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Also take note that at Jesus' first coming He did not come as a king but as a servant...just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many."Â Matthew 20:28 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaeology cat Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 [quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330480749' post='2394317'] Well if you see a parallel with that given to Peter there then you must also see it with this verse in Matthew 18:18, which Jesus addresses the disciples saying the same thing to them...  1 At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, "Who then is greatest in the kingdom of heaven?"     2 Then Jesus called a little child to Him, set him in the midst of them,  3 and said, "Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.  4 Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.  5 Whoever receives one little child like this in My name receives Me.     6 "Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to sin, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck, and he were drowned in the depth of the sea.  7 Woe to the world because of offenses! For offenses must come, but woe to that man by whom the offense comes!     8 "If your hand or foot causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life lame or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet, to be cast into the everlasting fire.  9 And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes, to be cast into hell fire.      10 "Take heed that you do not despise one of these little ones, for I say to you that in heaven their angels always see the face of My Father who is in heaven.  11 For the Son of Man has come to save that which was lost.*     12 "What do you think? If a man has a hundred sheep, and one of them goes astray, does he not leave the ninety-nine and go to the mountains to seek the one that is straying?  13 And if he should find it, assuredly, I say to you, he rejoices more over that sheep than over the ninety-nine that did not go astray.  14 Even so it is not the will of your Father who is in heaven that one of these little ones should perish.     15 "Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother.  16 But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that 'by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.'*  17 And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.     18 "Assuredly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven. Do you see the parallel here? Peter was not the only one told this... How do you explain this same binding and loosening given to the rest of the disciples...same words were spoken to them as well...not just limited to Peter. [/quote]That is addressed here: http://www.catholicapologetics.org/ap050200.htm Peter and the other Apostles do share in this, though Peter has primacy, as shown in Matthew 16:18, when he is singled out to feed the sheep, and at the Council of Jerusalem in Acts. [quote name='Louie' timestamp='1330484991' post='2394337'] Also take note that at Jesus' first coming He did not come as a king but as a servant...just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many." Matthew 20:28 [/quote]yes, He came as servant, but also as King. Not a king in the worldly sense, but He is the fulfillment of the Davidic king, as well as our High Priest and a servant. These are not mutually exclusive. God bless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 How about pick a subject and start a new thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Better option: Get off the internet and read. If you'd learned Catholicism in the first place, we wouldn't be having this conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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