Interview With Pope Francis In America Magazine

[4588686]

People see Pope Francis and they see someone who doesn't have a creepy fixation on the sex lives of his supporters or a strangely masochistic need to fee persecuted while being the head of an immensely wealthy and politically powerful organization. People who love thinking about sodomy and yearn to be whipped (by the world, metaphorically) may find this distasteful.

[dUSt]

That is not what we want though, is it?

 

What do we want? To spread the message of Christ to Catholics? To spread the message of Christ to an increasingly secularized world? Maybe he's not the pope for the former, but he seems to be doing a pretty good job of the latter.

[Basilisa Marie]

I think the Pope's words would be great if they were designed just for practicing Catholics, like most are on Phatmass. I think we "trying to be devout" Catholics DO tend to be legalistic, put the cart before the horse, focus on contraception and gay marriage and excellent liturgy etc to the detriment of the Gospel message.

 

But for 90% of the Catholic world, that's not the problem we have.

 

And then, for instance, right to life IS the gospel message - because we are loved by God we have dignity, and because we have dignity we can't be discarded like trash, no matter how small we are. I know sometimes the pro-life movement stinks at explaining that.

 

When he said "I am a son of the Church" it almost came off like he was saying "this is the way it is, sure I would change it if I could, but I'm loyal to mama, see."

 

Maybe it's just the translation. I'm sure it's just the translation.

 

See, I thought the comment "son of the Church" wasn't just a "oh I'd change it if I could." I took it as a affirmation that OF COURSE he believes in the Church's teachings.  He strikes me as one of those people who just doesn't think we have to be talking about abortion, contraception, and gay marriage all day every day.  I often get the distinct impression (not from you, but others) that if I'm not volunteering my free time at my local pro-life club, read LifeSiteNews daily, and constantly inform my gay friends that they're going to hell that I'm not Catholic enough to be Catholic.  There's a weird, McCarthy-esque attitude a lot of hardcore pro-lifers have, that how hard you pro-life is how good of a Catholic you are.  We need people who feel passionate about being pro-life, gay issues, whatever. But I think we need to check to make sure we're spreading the Gospel first, before everything else. Certainly you can do that through being pro-life, that should go without saying.  But I for one get frustrated when being pro-life and anti-gay marriage start sounding like the only things that matter in how we live our faith.  And if those are the only things we talk  about, are we really spreading the Gospel? Idk, something to think about.  

[4588686]

What do we want? To spread the message of Christ to Catholics? To spread the message of Christ to an increasingly secularized world? Maybe he's not the pope for the former, but he seems to be doing a pretty good job of the latter.

My Facebook has been blowing up with people who haven't said a kind word about the Church in years praising the man. None of these people are stupid. They understand that he isn't saying that homosexual activities are now ok in the church. But they see in him a decency and a humility that they haven't previously associated with organized religion and he's put a lot the Dawkins wannabes that I know on the defensive.

Lets see how the inquisitorial faction of the Traditionalists ruin this.

[dUSt]

I once had a priest tell me that the most frustrating thing about hearing confession is how people focus on the same sins over and over again, yet, people rarely confess of lacking charity, or not showing enough love and compassion to the people they care about, or failing to have a good prayer habit.

 

When I read the pope's words, this is what I thought about. Yes, certain issues are extremely important, but we musn't allow those issues to disable us from focusing on other things that are also important.

[Apotheoun]

I do not see how morality can be divorced from (or even de-emphasized in) preaching the Gospel of Christ.

[dUSt]

I do not see how morality can be divorced from (or even de-emphasized in) preaching the Gospel of Christ.

 

Well, of course, this is how you may interpret the Pope's message if you are only reading it on CNN.

 

Here's the thing. What if people start to like the pope? Even non-Catholics? Gasp!?!? What if his style appeals to people? What if people actually started reading stuff written by the pope in his own words? What if people read those words and fall in love with not only the pope, but the Church? Then, heaven forbid, they may actually read the catechism, or attend RCIA, or maybe go to confession for the first time since they were a kid.

 

I wonder if something like that might ever happen? Naw, probably not. Everyone is exactly the same and only come into the Church after reading theology books.

[Nihil Obstat]

What do we want? To spread the message of Christ to Catholics? To spread the message of Christ to an increasingly secularized world? Maybe he's not the pope for the former, but he seems to be doing a pretty good job of the latter.

We do not want things to be static. Good Catholics should be saints, and lukewarm and bad Catholics should be good Catholics. We always have to be shaken up, because there is no such thing as good enough.
I, and imo most other people, need to hear a message that makes us uncomfortable, and pushes us to do better.

[Lilllabettt]

does your pastor preach about gay marriage, abortion, contraception all the time? I have had maybe 6 or 7 pastors in my life and none of them preached on those things all the time. Some never did. For most they were topics for special occasions ... oh look its Respect Life Sunday type of thing.

 

is my experience a minority one?

 

 

[dUSt]

We do not want things to be static. Good Catholics should be saints, and lukewarm and bad Catholics should be good Catholics. We always have to be shaken up, because there is no such thing as good enough.
I, and imo most other people, need to hear a message that makes us uncomfortable, and pushes us to do better.

 

Have you ever thought about the fact that these messages are doing just that? Us "good" Catholics cannot stand on the sidelines anymore. If the pope is the new talk around the water cooler, it's now our job to step up and represent authentic Catholic teaching. In a way, The pope is forcing us to step up. He's shaking us up. Now let's get to work.

[4588686]

Well, of course, this is how you may interpret the Pope's message if you are only reading it on CNN.

Here's the thing. What if people start to like the pope? Even non-Catholics? Gasp!?!? What if his style appeals to people? What if people actually started reading stuff written by the pope in his own words? What if people read those words and fall in love with not only the pope, but the Church? Then, heaven forbid, they may actually read the catechism, or attend RCIA, or maybe go to confession for the first time since they were a kid.

I wonder if something like that might ever happen? Naw, probably not. Everyone is exactly the same and only come into the Church after reading theology books.

That'd be one idea. But given the way the Church has been bleeding members for the last few decades it only makes sense to double down and make extra, extra sure that people understand that the Church doesn't like gay sex.

This Pope haven't really been quiet on the issue of sin and moral error. He just isn't focusing on some sins that a subset of the Reactionary Wing of the Church seem to really, really love focusing on.

[Apotheoun]

Well, of course, this is how you may interpret the Pope's message if you are only reading it on CNN.

 

Here's the thing. What if people start to like the pope? Even non-Catholics? Gasp!?!? What if his style appeals to people? What if people actually started reading stuff written by the pope in his own words? What if people read those words and fall in love with not only the pope, but the Church? Then, heaven forbid, they may actually read the catechism, or attend RCIA, or maybe go to confession for the first time since they were a kid.

 

I wonder if something like that might ever happen? Naw, probably not. Everyone is exactly the same and only come into the Church after reading theology books.

It is how I interpret what he is saying, and so maybe he needs to be more precise. The ancient Church always made it quite clear to converts that their entrance into the Church involved a moral reformation, and a constant one at that. I do not know how a person can preach Christ and not also preach about His death due to sin. Maybe this is all leading to the final rejection of the Eucharist as a sacrifice and accepting it only as a meal. I don't know what to think. Do I wish Pope Benedict was still bishop of Rome? Yeah, but he is not.

 

I do not see how de-emphasizing the moral norm will bring more converts to Christ, and I doubt that He would have accepted such an idea.

[Nihil Obstat]

Have you ever thought about the fact that these messages are doing just that? Us "good" Catholics cannot stand on the sidelines anymore. If the pope is the new talk around the water cooler, it's now our job to step up and represent authentic Catholic teaching. In a way, The pope is forcing us to step up. He's shaking us up. Now let's get to work.

I said nothing about the Holy Father's interview. :p Just your post about good Catholics staying good, etc.

[4588686]

does your pastor preach about gay marriage, abortion, contraception all the time? I have had maybe 6 or 7 pastors in my life and none of them preached on those things all the time. Some never did. For most they were topics for special occasions ... oh look its Respect Life Sunday type of thing.

is my experience a minority one?

I think that most Homilies I have heard are pretty generic. The only really sharp moral condemnations that I hear, however, are those rare ones against homosexuality and abortion. So gay teens in the mid west who get the poo kicked out of them every day get the fully furry of the Church's moral weight, such as it is. While the guy who runs a payday loan service never seems to be given cause to question his line of work. That's why people get repulsed by the Churches moralizing. Because it is often directed against elements of society that are already stigmatized.

[Apotheoun]

In the Diocese of Oakland there is a priest who has said in his homilies that adultery is not always wrong, but I haven't noticed any influx of new converts into his parish.