Private Vows in The Laity/Spirituality

[Guest]

2 hours ago, BarbaraTherese said:

.  Time as the Will of God unfolds daily and sometimes I can be very slow to catch on.

 

........and sincerely desiring God's Will be done, yet dreadful slow to catch on, I know from experience, that The Lord will nudge, nudge and nudge until I do wake up.....and while most often heard softly in the gentlest breeze.........He can shout if He must...........  ..........

[Guest]

I knew there was some quote that applied but memory failed me. Sitting under the pergola with a coffee before getting into the late afternoon/evening tasks and I remembered: "Trust in the LORD with all your heart, on your own intelligence rely not; In all your ways be mindful of Him, and He will make straight your paths."Vatican Bible: Proverbs Ch3

[Guest]

A few years ago and visiting my Carmelite nun buddies, we decided to sit on the front verandah (fronted by the ocean) on a beautiful day.  Next thing, Sr R said "Be careful of our pal".  I looked up and there was a huge garden spider in a equally huge web.  "It is a beautiful web, isn't it?".  With that, I stopped looking at a horrible huge garden spider and a nasty big web and began to see through Carmelite eyes.  The web was remarkably beautiful and so was the spider.

Many years ago again, my Carmelite pal, Sr A, and I were talking about the garden and I said something about weeds.  She called them "Oh, our uninvited guests?"

There is something really wondrous about seeing things as they are without all the conditioning and expectations that come to us through our culture, without all my own needs and hopes, expectations, best scenarios, political correctness etc. getting in the way and precluding seeing what is actually and truly really present.

Today, I needed to go out and in the rain.  I was able to get to my destination without getting caught in quite heavy rain and thanked The Lord for it.  On the way home, however, it began to rain rather heavily and I was able to thank God for the heavy rain knowing full well that all comes about through His Divine Providence: Luke 12 "Are not five sparrows sold for two small coins? ⁴ Yet not one of them has escaped the notice of God.Even the hairs of your head have all been counted. Do not be afraid. You are worth more than many sparrows"

I thanked Him for the heavy rain even if I did get caught in it (with my umbrella turning inside out in the wind) because it was His rain and He had good reasons for it as I struggled home, even if my umbrella was problematic with me pulling along my full trolley behind me (had to call in for groceries on the way home)........ and trying to hold the umbrella right side up to stop me getting drenched, as the jolly umbrella continually turned right side down, with me hiding underneath my poncho a wrap of paper (for a Baptismal gift) so it wouldn't get wet either.  I only have two hands for goodness sake!  Now I am quite prone to fine Aussie adjectives and phrases -and very often ......but all I could do this afternoon was laugh and thank God for my predicament - there was a good reason for it all I know, it just evaded me...........and I told Him so.  The Lord knows what I am thinking without being told, so I may as well come forth and be honest with what I am thinking and getting in touch with my own inner reality, rather than deceiving myself (never Him!) with the nice and good thoughts that I am supposed to have or ideally should have, or would have.

The above made me smile and laugh today.

I am thankful and grateful for the fact that much of my 'formation' has been a Carmelite one - my Carmelite nun pals the source over many years now.  I was first accepted to enter Carmel when I was 16, but not until I turned 21.  Life and me too got in the way.  Do I regret not entering? Well, I suppose I could with an experience like this afternoon sometimes maybe tempted to regret - but I never really do. "Jesus said, "No one who sets a hand to the plow and looks to what was left behind is fit for the kingdom of God." - and not to interpret that with nonsensical scrupulosity.  I never actually invest in regret at not entering monastic life or religious life itself when I allow reality to speak and not the delusions and illusions that can rise up from within.  After all, life out here in secular life in the laity might have its tough times and far tougher than heavy rain and being out and about in it juggling with only two hands.  But then I know that monastic and religious life can get tough and tougher too in other ways possibly.  Or perhaps in different clothing we all experience the same tough and tougher challenges.

No matter the vocation and call in which we serve and love God and neighbour, He will provide more than sufficient to make great saints of us.  It is all a question of our response to His Graces always present - absolutely guaranteed.  Sometimes a response can be immediate and generous, perhaps even touched by the heroic.  Other times, I can fail and miserably so.....or I am just dragging myself reluctantly along the way.  Other times still, it is going to take me on a journey to learn just how to respond and as I should, nothing generous or heroic about it at all.  All is ok with Him***, He keeps working to make great saints in every single life and vocation, states of life all of them and without exceptions.......and at all times everywhere.

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***  "For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has similarly been tested in every way, yet without sin. So let us confidently approach the throne of grace to receive mercy and to find grace for timely help." Vatican New American Bible translation ..........after all, Jesus Himself said that He has come for sinners, that the righteous have no need of Him.

[Guest]

Excerpt: "Creighton Univ. Daily Gospel Reflection. 7th July 2016"
 

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"All of us are called to be gardeners in our lives and relationships.   As God’s partners in this world, we too must be sowers.  Paul Molinari SJ said it the best:  You must not be concerned about the fruit of what you do.  You must be generous in throwing the seed with open hands, without becoming discouraged when the fertile soil seems scarce… God, on the other hand, would have us sow generously, extravagantly, even wastefully—wherever we may find ourselves.  We can afford to, too, knowing full well that God is the keeper of the harvest.  We are mere sowers.  As such, we need concern ourselves solely with this: 

"How wide is the arc of our throw, how open our hands?" 

 

The above is in the spirit of the Parable of The Sower.

[Guest]

Excerpt from Pope Francis's Prayer for the Year of Mercy: Full text HERE

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"You willed that your ministers would also be clothed in weakness
in order that they may feel compassion for those in ignorance and error:
let everyone who approaches them feel sought after, loved, and forgiven by God. "

 

I think that realising my own weaknesses and failures, I am not so quick at all to castigate those who may be in ignorance and error.  Having asked and received compassion and forgiveness from God for my own many weaknesses and failures, it is that same compassion and forgiveness that I, in its' abundance, have to share with others.

The Love and Mercy of God and all it contains does not go out without returning fruitful to yet again set out.  I cannot love God without from that self same love, at the self same time, love all others.  Love of God and neighbour are one.

[Guest]

There are many sacrifices a lay person in secular life called to private vows is going to have to make (to use an example with which I am nowadays quite familiar).  Sacrifices one would not have needed to make in religious life.  However, if one enters religious life, then there are sacrifices one will have to make not asked in private vows in the laity.

A bit of reflection will reveal what sacrifices might apply in either vocation ......... but there are some sacrifices only evident in actually living out the vocation in the day to day as God's Will unfolds daily.

The criterion for any vocation at all, of course, is that to which I am called by God...........whatever sacrifices asked along the way are incidental and fringe benefits (The Cross) - be the sacrifices major or quite minor.  One makes those sacrifices in order to live out one's vocation - and without which one could not be truly faithful to one's personal vocation in the day to day unfoldings........ i.e.  God's Will daily unfolding in every and all vocational states.

In every vocation and call from God, and without exemptions at all, there are going to be sacrifices and The Cross along the way.......because in every life and vocation, God grants sufficiency in an abundance (and more) of every Grace to make great saints.. This is inbuilt into all and every vocational call from God.

What is perhaps not commonly understood possibly is that one has a vocation and call from God at every moment of every life.  Prior to moving out of the celibate laity and entering into another state in life, one has the vocational call from God to celibate laity or the single life.  Private vows (to evangelical counsels) could be said to be one category within celibate laity in secular life.
 

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Vatican Translation "New American Bible"

2 Corinthians Ch 9 "Each must do as already determined, without sadness or compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.Moreover, God is able to make every grace abundant for you, so that in all things, always having all you need, you may have an abundance for every good work".

 

 

Edited July 8, 2016 by BarbaraTherese

[Guest]

@dUSt

See ........... Thread Title in Open Mic: "Seeing up an easily located blog"

[Guest]

Just trying to do some research and came across this old thread -..............and responding here (in accordance I hope with Phatmass rules i.e. refrain posting into an old thread - rather  link to the old thread) :

Question on Private Vows (December 2012)

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On 28.12.12  Chiquitunga said "She ( Sr. Marie-Angelique)was saying how many graces followed after making her vows"

 

Certainly many Graces have followed my renewing life private vows at a Home Mass for the purpose - and obvious entirely humbling Graces since the Home Mass on 14.8.14 Solemnity of The Assumption.

On ‎28‎/‎12‎/‎2012 at 7:00 PM, Chiquitunga said:

However, I did ask a good priest this once and pointed him to this CA thread, plus the example of saints like Blessed Elizabeth and St. Maravillas who did not first seek the advise of a priest/make their vows with a priest to witness, as St. Teresa of the Andes did and Sr. Marie-Angelique. Here is his reply:

 

Some of the saints were moved to make private vows without speaking to a confessor, but I think these are the exception. And they later submitted everything to the confessor. There are many rea-sons for this. Here are some.... It prevents the devil from getting into our acts of religion. It prevents us from making a mistake. It subdues our pride. It prevents scruples too. Our Lord always works through His Church.

My journey with private vows must be over 35 years now I think - actual dates are retained in my files here somewhere.

I made private vows quite privately on a temporary basis, renewed every year and at the time a potential vocation to religious life was also on the back shelf of my mind - I discerned against.  That was years before I sought advice and discerned re making the vows for life.  At the time I was aware of my track record in the past under the vows renewed yearly and realizing I had no idea what would unfold in the future no matter the past - including serious repeated episodes of psychotic bipolar at that time.  What I needed advice about (from a priest who knew me exceptionally well including my bipolar condition and the related episodes back then) was his opinion re my making the vows for life and he replied in the affirmative, tacking on "providing they are for life of course". Which they would be and are, of course.  I then very privately made the vows for life.  Further on down the line (after many years of being unable to find a SD willing to direct a lay woman under private vows who suffered a bipolar episodic condition), I came across a priest religious willing to direct me (my current SD and confessor).  After a few visits to get to know each other including showing him past spiritual references from priests and a nun as well as a neighbour and senior mental health workers, I spoke to him about the potential for a Home Mass for renewal of life vows....... and before I knew what was happening really, he advised me that he had spoken to our Archbishop who had given his permission.

I think with that I probably went into shock.  So many years with refusals of one kind or another and now I was not being turned down.  A shock to conditioning.

Profound and humbled gratitude and thanksgiving........and tears for something I had resigned myself to would be another refusal.

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Previously quoted by Chiquitunga: The Maxims and Sayings of St Philip Neri - these are a series of truly excellent and profound short and concise advice on the spiritual life.

My comment:  These maxims and sayings are absolutely worthwhile reading.

[Guest]

Membership of St Vincent de Paul Society is a process of formation

 -  a rule for the journey.

 

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Vincentian Family Daily Reflection: http://famvin.org/reflections/daily-reflection-july-8/

 

“O, my Heavenly Father, I know that these contradicting events are permitted and guided by Thy wisdom, which alone is light.”
– St. Elizabeth Ann Seton

– In the confusion of this present age, it is often difficult to discern the best path to take in dealing with troublesome situations. Lord, I need the wisdom of your Spirit to guide my decision making so your holy will can be accomplished through me.

 

 

[Guest]

Reading the maxims of St Philip Neri HERE and see Maxim #13 (all of them are worth a read!).  He advises initially making temporary vows which I did for quite a few years, renewed yearly.  The advise in question of St Philip also advises conditional temporary vows - and this advice was a memory jog and is what I did also because of bipolar episodes.  My condition was that in the event of an episode, my vows and my rule of life were suspended until after the episode when normality and reality returned.  I just never knew in any way whatsoever what might occur during an episode and so I though the condition was the best and safest way for me to travel.  I had no problems with making the vows conditional under some circumstances since I thought it was an application of common sense and prudence...even wisdom - I did think possibly others might not understand, not that I have ever shared it till now nor even remembered it indeed***; however, I knew beyond question that The Lord understood completely in Compassionate Mercy and Understanding.  That I never doubted as long as I was in touch with reality that is.  Reality can be a weird thing with a sufferer of mental illness.  Others, including mental health professionals might state similar to: "You know it isn't real." Now that is a weird thing to say when the sufferer experiences their psychotic world as THE reality and it is the other person who is out of touch with reality.  Private vows are between self and God alone.  While "private" (as in private vows) is a Canon Law term to distinguish from public vows in consecrated life -  and therefore does not of necessity mean that one must keep private vows to oneself. 

I recall one episode much too vividly in which my sense of loneliness and absolute aloneness was truly crushing.  The world was still going round, but I was not in it - excluded. Not only that but all my comforting concepts about God crashed completely and I had no idea whatsoever about God other than fears.  This experience was so profound to me that I cried profusely: "No one should never ever be this lonely, this alone".  It wasn't anything of The Dark Night, since I slipped into a state of overwhelming anxiety, terror actually - almost despair, and was hospitalized.  But what travels with me today is that some people actually do journey in life terribly alone, isolated and lonely, with a crushing sense of hopelessness and meaninglessness, a sense of exclusion from the world going on around them.  They do not feel they belong. 

_______________________

*** Some bipolar episodes I can recall, some even vividly, others I cannot - although some sort of memory jog can occur and a memory floods back into consciousness.............most often totally unwelcome.  I simply do not want to remember some things that happened during episodes.  I call memory "a filing cabinet" with drawers that will fly open for no particular reason and sometimes most unwelcomingly.  Bipolar can be a difficult illness to understand as all mental illness is to some degree or other to a non sufferer.  What is really strange about bipolar is that one can be totally off the plant and out of touch with reality for a quite short or even a quite lengthy period.  After the episode passes, one returns to a normal state - well, whatever normality actually is - and not even psychiatrist nor psychologists know......or any other "ist" or "er" either.

I went through a very long stage indeed of not knowing who I was.  Was I the ill person and the reality I experienced when ill true reality?  Or was I the well person and my when-well-reality really the true one.  I simply did not know which was really me nor actual reality.  How did I survive?  I knew I had to survive in the world as it was experiencing itself and it's reality and so I began observe the thinking and behaviour of others and what they believed and I imitated.  As that journey progressed and I learnt to feel comfortable in their world, I learnt to experience my own inner reality which is not of necessity the reality that others think about re oneself.  I learnt to invest in my own inner reality and allow others to experience theirs.  Sort of: two ships passing in the night and if we should meet, it is beautiful.

I read somewhere that in an insane world, the sane will be considered insane.  How true that is when one thinks about it.

All is Grace.

[Guest]

One more point and quick as I have to shower and get ready for my nephew and his wife's send off to the USA to work and live, establish themselves.

I trained as a counsellor pre onset of bipolar and I was trained in non-directive therapy.  This meant that you facilitated your client to make positive decision for themselves.  One needed to put aside one's own concepts of what would be positive in their problem and for their life.  One invested in the positive personal decisions of one's client (once they arrived there hopefully, facilitating in hope that arrival) and affirmed that personal decision.  Affirmation in life and in relationships is very important and not at all unusual that affirming the other can lead them on to the journey of discovering who they really are - at least insofar as we can in this life.

That training did help and facilitate me on the journey out of bipolar psychotic episodes to appreciate the other.  To be able to put aside my own selfhood, I guess might be the word - and invest fully in the other person.  To develop observation and listening skills - hearing what the other has to say and who they are or are not to themselves, their identity.  And to be fully appreciative of the other, grateful - even admiring.

I later trained as a marriage guidance counsellor - and shortly before my own marriage broke up.  And no, I could not heal either myself nor my marriage.  Ironic huh.

Oh dear, I do have to go and I just don't have the time to think and edit.  Hope it comes out ok.

All is Grace, Alleluia Amen.

22 hours ago, BarbaraTherese said:

@dUSt

See ........... Thread Title in Open Mic: "Seeing up an easily located blog"

I also PM'd a moderator and have a reply.  At this point seems no reason for me to think that this thread could be locked or might be locked.  Hence, insofar as Phatmass administration and moderators are concerned to my knowledge, I will remain active in this thread and the thread is not under threat of locking.  I am totally relieved that I do not have to consider setting up a blog at this point.  Whatever happens in the future is in the future's unfoldings.  I have done what I can and can rest on this subject for now, put it bed.

[Guest]

Can't see where I am logged in, although I seem to be.  Just seeing if I can post ok.

___________________

..........all ok, I can post.............

Edited July 11, 2016 by BarbaraTherese

[Guest]

 

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   Norsman82 - Church Militant Thread in Vocation Station titled "Single Vocation"

• "Peoples of the phorum, please attend carefully...

  I hate to burst your bubble, but unless there is a vow involved to "lock you in", single life in and of itself is NOT a vocation.

  Married people make a "vow" to each other, so marriage is permanent (until death). In the Latin rite, they cannot enter into clerical, religious, or consecrated life while married. Exceptions: permanent deacons, as well as eastern rite Catholic priesthood.

  Clergy make vows or "solemn promises", and they are priests forever, unless in special circumstances they are laicized. They cannot enter married life without laicization.

  Religious and consecrated take "vows". It is permanent unless they are somehow released from their vows.

  Singles who have not taken a vow, on the other hand, do not need to be released from any vows in order to enter marriage, clerical, religious, or consecrated life."

 

The above was posted into Vocations Forum HERE - and their are some inaccuracies.

The lay state in secular life is broken into two categories in The Church i.e. the married state and the lay celibate state.  The Church has never stated that the lay celibate state is or should be further defined as the committed and non-committed lay state.  Our baptism consecrates and commits us to the lay celibate state as, until and if a further call from God is discerned.  Our baptism is a vocation and call, a consecration, to holiness.

 

That some might suggest that the committed lay state only is a vocation is their purely quite personal opinion and concept, not what The Church states.  Not ever has The Church stated that one MUST make further vows other than the baptismal vows.

 

Those who are baptized and remain in the lay state in secular life without any sort of vow or vows other than their baptismal vows are consecrated individuals to worship God in spirit and in truth – i.e. a call and vocation to holiness - and the person is immediately consecrated to the pursuit of holiness/worship of God in spirit and in truth.  It is impossible for the baptized to ask to be freed of their baptism or baptismal vows – but they can deny  their vows by refusing deliberately to fulfill them in some way i.e. mortal sin.  The vows related to Baptism are binding and for life.  This might be similar to the Consecrated Virgin vocational state in that they cannot be released from their vow of virginity.

 

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http://consecratedvirgins.org/prepare-FAQ

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"The Consecration of a Virgin is a sign of the relationship of Christ, the Bridegroom, to the Church, the Bride. The consecrated virgin is a sign of the relationship of the Church, the Bride, to Christ, the Bridegroom. The sign is founded on the natural order, the relationship of a man and a woman in the marriage bond. Clearly, a man cannot be the sign of the Bride of Christ. Likewise, the spiritual relationship with Christ the Bridegroom is expressed in action by spiritual maternity in the Church. A man does not have the natural gifts of woman to exercise spiritual maternity.The bond of Christ with His bride, made as a definitive act on the part of the Church as stated above, cannot be "undone." That is, it cannot be dispensed. "

 

.............as baptism and the vows of baptism cannot be undone nor dispensed. CATHOLIC CATECHISM - 1280 Baptism imprints on the soul an indelible spiritual sign

 

Baptism is a consecration into the consecration of Christ.  SEE: Christifideles Laici "Vocation of The Laity In The Church & The World" - Apostolic Exhortation Pope John Paul II) It is effected by Baptism with related vows by the person. 

 

 

 

[Guest]

 Just had a look at the temperature here in Adelaide.  It is 9 degrees C - or 48 degrees F.  We usually will only drop to that level in winter and through the night - and sometimes even lower.  It is a very cold day with extremely strong icy winds, some rain, glimpses of sunshine now and then.  We are simply not used to 9degrees during the day - Melbourne might be another matter.

I have explained to my pp (and to my SD in accord with my rule of life which he approved) that i wish to be just another 'face in the pews' i.e. just an ordinary everyday Catholic to appearances without any sort of title or status in the parish.

Although at this point, I do have a weird sort of sense of moving towards something.  It might be quite minor or major - I recognise the destination when I get there and only then.  During my very ill days, sometimes I would experience the same weird awareness but back then it was always without fail something negative and I became conditioned into that awareness being related to something negative on the way.  It was always negative back then.  Nowadays that has changed and conditioning has modified so that I never know whether something negative or positive is on the way, heading towards me or towards which I am moving is perhaps better.  C'est la vie and the journey rolls on in the days and in the nights............

I do sometimes wonder if I just have too much time on my hands knowing that ol' nick loves the idle hands with abundant wiles and deception up its' sleeve....or imagination is taking flight......C'est la vie and the journey rolls on in the days and in the nights.............

Nothing is perfect in this imperfect world of ours..........and certainly not me either.............

Meanwhile...........back at the ranch............ I need to prepare for the St Vinnies meeting tonight.

[Guest]

I try to read daily The Daily Blessing, which lands into my inbox daily, along with the USCCB site for the Daily Gospel and often the related video (never more than 2mins in length) HERE.  I thought today's blessing from www.gnm.org was particularly meaningful for an interpretation of a lifestyle with or without private vows in the laity - or any other vocation :

Edited July 12, 2016 by BarbaraTherese

[Guest]

Saw my SD today and went to Confession. 

One point that was raised is considering going back to school.  There is an adult campus not far from me, very short bus trip there and home - rather than 2 buses there -  and again to return home as with voluntary work.  I would much rather do voluntary work as preference but returning to school and undertaking study would be a social event for me (mixing with fellow students and teachers) as well as a focus of the mind and challenges to, exercises for, the intellect.  At my age (71yrs almost) and with A1 physical health (my doctor called it "disgustingly healthy") I am hoping to be able to spend all the rest of my days here in Bethany and with my wits about me, God Willing.   School would involve 2 days each week.  As long as voluntary work proves a 2 bus trip event with considerable walking for me, it is not an option.  But every now and then I check with the volunteer website to see if there is anything advertised that is closer to where I live

The above might be a better option I had not thought of earlier, better than taking in another load of ironing which of course would tie me down, while returning to school does not.......not tie me down inside the house anyway.  Before I actually decide I need to research about returning to school since it is now 7 years since I was last a student and much can change in 7 years.

Another decision I needed to make is whether to write about my own journey with mental illness.  I think to focus on that part of my journey as a subject of sole type of focus would be too much emotionally and also perhaps mentally in that memories now forgotten could very well return into consciousness and memories I have repressed for reasons.  However in writing into this thread and of my journey with bipolar at times, it is only a passing matter, not a sole focus type of matter. I write and then I move on.  That I can handle I know. 

I also wanted to make a decision about again discerning re a Third Order.  This has both pros and cons.  It is still in an undecided state for me.  A problem might be the constitutions of a Third Order may not fit into what is going to be a quite busy schedule if I should decide to return to study.  I am not only going to have two full days of the week at school, I need to work in the one load of ironing I do complete fortnightly around those two days.  I would need to fit in time for study and assignments.  Also, Wednesdays and Thursdays are most always already committed days for me.  Over and above that, I need time for various kinds of appointments and visiting as well as time to do necessary grocery shopping (on foot).

Father today did underscore, double underscored in fact, not to overload myself.  Perhaps the only way I am going to find out that a schedule is or is not an overload is by giving it  try.  Perhaps.

All decisions are prayerful decisions........and I really would be grateful that if you have read this that you would say a prayer for me as I do for you.

____________

lPS A big thank you for 'listening' to me.  Yeah, I know - most all don't and how do I know that some do read this thread.  I said to my sister in law last weekend "Leave me in my illusions"..........so, please - do leave me in my illusions.

Writing is the way I can work out things for myself.  Get things into some sort of rational order and logic....to me that is!  The bipolar mind can be a real handful at times and taming it completely is impossible.......to me that is!

God bless........and cheers...........

[Guest]

I am truly loathe to be almost continually posting the same links to documentation from The Vatican in support of the single or lay celibate vocation.  But as long a it keeps cropping up somewhere on Phatmass (and other sites) that there is no such thing as a vocation to lay celibacy, I will keep posting the links that there is. 

At the end of this post, you can read the latest statement by The Church on the single state in life (lay celibacy) as vocation.

Yet again, there is a thread unfolding in Vocation Station HERE that has a couple of posts stating that the single life or celibate laity in secular life is not a vocation (without supporting links to sound source material).  Without sound support quotations and links, one is only stating one's personal opinion, not what The Church has to state.  Never at any point in our lives are we without a call and vocation from God.  Insofar as one is in single life (lay celibacy) there may or may not be a further call into another state of life (i.e. Holy Orders, Consecrated Life, Marriage, Lay Celibacy).  Some lay celibate persons might receive a call and vocation to private vows or simply to remain in the lay state of life in celibacy without private vows.

It is fine to post one's personal opinion and I have no problem with that as a personal opinion.  However, I do have a problem with it if the sense of the post is that it is Church teaching.

 I will be posting a link to my post here into the thread in Vocation Station.  I am avoiding posting directly into VS because the single state as a vocation is out of bounds on VS - and also to avoid triggering debate in Vocation Station, also out of bounds in accord with the rules or guidelines for VS.  Debate here in Open Mic is not a problem insofar as I am aware.

The following is from Christifideles Laici (Vocation and Mission of The Lay Faithful) Apostolic Exhortation  HERE 

POST-SYNODAL
APOSTOLIC EXHORTATION
CHRISTIFIDELES LAICI
OF
HIS HOLINESS
JOHN PAUL II
ON THE VOCATION AND THE MISSION
OF THE LAY FAITHFUL
IN THE CHURCH AND IN THE WORLD

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""The secular character of the lay faithful is not therefore to be defined only in a sociological sense, but most especially in a theological sense. The term secular must be understood in light of the act of God the creator and redeemer, who has handed over the world to women and men, so that they may participate in the work of creation, free creation from the influence of sin and sanctify themselves in marriage or the celibate life, in a family, in a profession and in the various activities of society"(39)."

DOGMATIC CONSTITUTION ON THE CHURCH

LINK TO: Dogmatic Constitution on The Church
LUMEN GENTIUM
SOLEMNLY PROMULGATED BY HIS HOLINESS
POPE PAUL VI
ON NOVEMBER 21, 1964

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#39. However, this holiness of the Church is unceasingly manifested, and must be manifested, in the fruits of grace which the Spirit produces in the faithful; it is expressed in many ways in individuals, who in their walk of life, tend toward the perfection of charity, thus causing the edification of others; in a very special way this (holiness) appears in the practice of the counsels, customarily called "evangelical." This practice of the counsels, under the impulsion of the Holy Spirit, undertaken by many Christians, either privately or in a Church-approved condition or state of life, gives and must give in the world an outstanding witness and example of this same holiness.

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 6 June, 2016

https://zenit.org/articles/pope-establishes-dicastery-for-laity-family-and-life/

Pope Establishes Dicastery ‘for Laity, Family and Life’

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Excerpt:              "On Saturday, it was announced that Pope Francis has taken up a recommendation from this Council of Cardinals, and approved ad experimentum the statute of a new dicastery for the laity, family and life.

The new dicastery will merge from 1 September 2016 the existing Pontifical Council for the Laity and the Pontifical Council for the Family. On that date both dicasteries will cease their functions and will be suppressed, following the repeal of articles 131-134 and 139-141 of the apostolic constitution Pastor bonus of 28 June 1988..................

"...............The section for the lay faithful will inspire and encourage the promotion of the vocation and mission of the lay faithful in the Church and in the world, as individuals, married or unmarried, or as members of associations, movements and communities.

It will also promote studies to contribute to the doctrinal examination of themes and issues regarding the lay faithful."

 

 

[Guest]

The path of the just is made smooth?

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What follows are some informative and interesting comments on private vows on the site: Ask A Priest Xt3 LOCATED HERE

"Private Vows may seem like an easy option, but in fact they are among the most challenging vocations available in the Church and in the world if they are taken seriously. Strictly speaking, Canon Law makes this option available to clarify that any person is free to make promises to God, but when vows are private, this means that the Church and her related institutions do not acknowledge any obligation to offer spiritual guidance or (more specifically) material support (such as assistance obtaining employment) to support you in living out your vows, even if you make the standard promise to structure your life on the foundation of the Evangelical Counsels.

There are a lot of inherent contradictions in the option of private vows that can be confusing and very difficult to reconcile in practice - but that is part of the challenge that a person takes on when he/she choses this option.

At the same time, Private Vows offer certain advantages, for example:
1. By making private vows, you can ensure that you are entering into your vows on your own free will, purely for the love of God and not just because it is traditional ("the done thing") in a community that you would like to be a part of.
2. The vow of poverty is all the more authentic for not benefitting from any privileges (such as a recognisable social status or a position of employment in the Church or one of her institutions), and the fact that you may not expect any preferrential treatment or extra spiritual support (such as the appointment of a regular confessor or spiritual counselor to guide you in living out your vows).
3. They allow you to make it more clear to God that your promises are motivated purely out of love for Him and for the Church without expecting anything particular in return.
4. They are one of the few options available to people who want to transcend the perceived conflict between marriage and religious life. For instance, a person can decide to live a consecrated life without precluding the possibility that God may lead him/her into a marriage, just as He may call him/her to enter a monastery. Under these circumstances, a private consecration can significantly support discernment and progress into either state of life, however as a rule, a person under vows should only enter a marriage if it is conducive to the greater fulfillment of the vows, just as one should only enter a monastery if one feels that the life of the chosen community best supports one to live one's vows more authentically and productively.

For someone considering marriage, private vows can be a very romantic option because there is no clearer or more profound way to demonstrate to your future spouse that he/she is second only to God in your life. You can also make private vows to God for your future spouse (in expectation of him or her), in which case the vow of chastity becomes an incredibly romantic gift that allows you to tell your soulmate: "I loved you before I ever met you". How many people can say that in a way that allows the other person to see and feel that it is true? A vow of chastity pronounced in a private Mass in front of witnesses is one way to be able to do that.

Having said that, while this is not clarified in the Code of Canon Law, I feel there is a significant difference between standing in front ot the Blessed Sacrament (exposed or in the Tabernacle) and making a silent promise to God and professing private vows in a Mass in front of witnesses. In Monastic professions, it is customary for a chart naming the vows and the person entering into them (including the duration of validity if they are temporary) to be drawn up and deposited on the altar. This is normally the only occasion when it is permissible to deposit anything on the altar besides the bread and wine. The person approaches the altar prior to the Eucharistic portion of the Mass and declares his/her promises so that everyone present hears. The knowledge/memory that other people have heard your promises and can testify to them before God is extremely helpful at times when you may be tempted to act as though you had not made them. The deposition of the "chart" on the altar represents the person's deposition of their life on the altar and their "sacrifice" or "personal offering" is then joined to the sacrifice of the Mass and offered up to God with it (this is the consecration part of a profession). If you chose to replicate monastic traditions in your private profession, you will perceive greater benefits.

Private vows may be a good sping-board into a more public religious profession and can greatly help discernment to the priesthood or religious life as well as a more serious approach to courtship and support a more God-centered marriage. However, there are also reasons why professional religious undergo a period of formation and testing of their vocations in community before they make even just temporary vows. Private vows are actually more controversial than they seem and many publicly professed religious (i.e. religious who professed vows as a condition to adherence to a community or as a condition for ordination i.e. the appointment to a professional station in the Church) do not look favorably on people who choose this option. In that regard, I would say that Private Vows should be approached and discerned as a vocation with its own, distinct charism. They can be a precursor to a more traditional religious profession but not necessarily. In fact, I would say that monastic experience or experience in a more traditional religious profession should be a precursor to private vows. Living private vows can be very similar to a heremitical vocation - but it is all the more challenging because they are entered into without any guarantee of recognition or support of a broader religious community or diocese.

 

 

[Guest]

My journey in the lay state with private vows has been such a long journey, it is only with hindsight and looking back than I am able to give the journey those words that are more accurate( to me)  - and sometimes an increasing understanding of what was taking place back then.

My original intention was that this thread would die a natural death after my Home Mass.  That is not the way things have unfolded recent reflection confirms - as I walk daily in the unfoldings, whatever unfolds (Divine Providence) -.  To fully grasp the Doctrine of Divine Providence - I discovered "Abandonment to Divine Providence" by Jean Paul du Caussade the most all embracing explanation (available to read online: HERE)  It is a Catholic spiritual classic of much renown even still in our own day.  

 This thread does contain much research on the single state or celibate state in the Laity in secular life, which is the more common Church terminology.  This was never my original intention.

However, while The Church is very clear indeed about the vocation to the Laity (married or celibate) as a vocation indeed, we have those who contest this as individuals, since they are not in line with what The Church is saying officially.  My feeling is that we are all without exception entitled to our opinions and concepts based on something or other - and any and all opinions and concepts are based on something.  However, since private vows in the Lay state is my quite personal call and vocation from God and therefore a matter of great importance to me, I prefer to hear what The Church states always and on that foundation form my own personal concepts and opinions and that is my personal concept and opinion.........with a right to advocate same, just as all others have the same right.

I am hopeful that the research included might prove helpful to others - which can have that "pebble in the pool" effect.    I had reflected on gossip at some point in the long ago and what was, with gossip, the sinister nature of how it spread and even changed as 'it travelled'.  It also tended to stick to the victim of gossip.  I wrote a poem on gossip long ago and one line ran "good reputation taken from another, once gone is gone forever".  I also felt with reflection, that perhaps a similar 'process' might be able to be used possibly for good - or as a pebble in the pool type of effect.

My objective from the beginning of my journey discerning and then embracing the Lay state as my personal vocation with private vows has always been to understand what The Church had to state, not to lean on my own definitions and concepts.  And frankly, back in the beginning of my journey, I had no understanding whatsoever other than to embrace poverty, chastity and obedience was to walk closely in the footsteps of Jesus.  It was asked of me when I entered monastic life in my teens how I had come to recognise that.  I had no idea, I just did.   Since I knew I was not called to consecrated life, nor marriage - I had experienced both (left RL of my own accord &marriage annulled), my vocational call had to be to the Laity, initially by default.  I have also have discerned in the long ago years with Third Orders and Secular Institutes.

As my understanding developed according to The Church, I came to embrace fully the Lay state of life with Joy and Peace and humbled gratitude for where God called me and was calling me to in each day and moment.  My place in the scheme of things became the Laity and no longer by default but by embrace.  The lay state of life is generally regarded as the lowest state of life in The Church - and I became (and still am) humbled and grateful to God for it with much Peace and Joy.  A line of The Magnificat follows me i.e. "looks with favour on His lowly servant".  I find consolation not grief in being the lowest of the low in reality - in failures and imperfections, sinfulness compared to the Graces granted.  Although it is difficult to explain because there is very real grief in all my failures etc (tears in the Confessional). while on the other hand, the gift to intellect of trust and confidence in The Lord and His Mercy is overwhelming humbled consolation (equal tears in Confession) - including in the knowledge that it is there always and for all God's creatures without exception - of whom I am the lowest.  I feel right in the lowest place as much as elevated to be in the lowest place as the most lowest. The understanding of my vocation became an unfolding matter most often related to research.  I was very surprised that not one priest (other than my initial SD - priest, religious and theologian) could inform me further on private vows and as a vocation to the Laity.  My research really went ahead only once I was given a computer.  At intervals along the way, I did come across priests who could inform me in a very broad basic sort of way about a vocation to the Laity in the celibate state.

The SD and confessor who first affirmed my stumbling and hesitant question about private vows (Father was a priest religious and theologian) liked to leave me (I can now insight) with my mind ticking over - questing for understanding, rather than leaving an appointment beaming with affirmation and understanding.  Father (dec'd) had great devotion to and grasp of the mysterious working of The Holy Spirit in every life. That was obvious even back then over 40yrs ago as I began to stumble alone on my way, once he had died of cancer.

Once I came to an understanding of what The Church (including Canon Law) had to say about the Laity and private vows with a computer doing the hard work of research, I then found myself on sure ground in defining the way of life I was living in accord with what The Church had to state.  Prior to that understanding, my inclination was to define my way of life reflective more on religious and monastic life - but I knew as a restless sort of feeling that I was not on sure ground at all, something did feel 'not there' (accurate) about it  - at least where my personal call and vocation was concerned.

Where was my serious bipolar condition in all the above back then.  It was very active and seriously so in intervals or as episodes of a psychotic state of mind - as bipolar can sometimes be.  Bipolar and the wake was a source of great grief to me; nevertheless, after each episode, I would pick up the pieces of my life as best I was able and move on.......most often into another serious bipolar episode and its wake........and for over 20 years.  It is now over 10 years ago since I have been the victim of serious psychotic episodes of bipolar.

My private vow journey was affirmed for me when our Archbishop gave permission for the Home Mass to renew life private vows to the evangelical counsels.  My now SD (priest religious), who had put the question to our Archbishop, made the passing smiling comment "Well, you can't call it a snap decision, can you?"   

I have kept nothing about my past life, nor the current either, secret from those who had a right to know.

 

"5 Trust in the LORD with all your heart, on your own understanding rely not; In all your ways be mindful of Him, and he will make straight your paths" Vatican Bible Translation. Proverbs Chapter 3

 

 

Here are some quotations from EWTN: "Vocations in the Pontificate of John Paul II"

Cardinal Jean-Marie Lustiger Archbishop of Paris

Quote   CARDINALS' SYMPOSIUM, 15-18 OCTOBER 2003: TALK 6 The body of pronouncements by John Paul II on the subject of priests, consecrated life and the vocation of the baptized — therefore including the laity — covers thousands of pages. I would like to try here to highlight their logic and their originality, to understand their "economy" in the sense of the word as used by the Fathers to describe the economy of salvation in which the Trinitarian mystery is revealed to us. Beyond their diversity, one finds in them the great challenges of the life of the Church at the end of the 20th century and a coherent, structured response that draws its strength from the mystery of Christ.   Quote Quoting Pope John Paul II from "Gift and Mystery".  Golden Jubilee of Pope John Paul's ordination to the priesthood:  " "As I look back, I see how all things are connected: today as yesterday, we find ourselves no less deeply caught up in the same mystery". This mystery is, of course, the inexhaustible gift of Christ the Redeemer. It is also the mystery of the priesthood and of vocations in their organic diversity and ecclesial unity, and this includes the baptismal vocation of the laity." Quote   Comments from Cardinal Jean-Marie Lustiger: Ten years after the inauguration of his Pontificate, the three Post-Synodal Apostolic Exhortations began to appear. They were dedicated respectively to vocations, that is, to our subject: to the laity (Christifideles Laici) in 1988, to priests (Pastores Dabo Vobis), and to men and women religious (Vita Consecrata) in 1996. This group of three Encyclicals, followed by three Apostolic Exhortations, deploys a spiritual teaching whose coherence is amazing, even though — as biographers of the Holy Father assure us — all the stages were not systematically planned. And his steadfast aim is even more striking if one takes into account the circumstances and events that arose to hinder his development of it. In a certain way, the Pope bases the following of Christ on the commitments of the people of our time, whether they are priests, consecrated persons or lay people, by placing them in the economy of salvation: at the end of this Advent, the person discovers himself in his inalienable dignity, which is his participation in the priesthood of Christ.

 

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Still a regular sort of thread views daily average and the average seems to be steady more or less.  It seems to hover around 35 views daily.  This seems to increase marginally after I post and an expected normal type of result I would think.  Hence I feel relatively sure that there just might be some interest in the thread. 

I only crunch the numbers into Word now and then - but not too long after the last time - week or 10 days or so.

 

[Guest]

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I quoted previously from Cardinal Jean-Marie Lustiger - so I researched who he might be never having heard of him before.  Turns out he is deceased.  A biography from the NYTimes HERE

I find him a fascinating and interesting priest, archbishop and then cardinal  - relatively close it seems to me to Pope John Paul II.