Fr. Ripperger: NeoCatholicism vs. Traditionalism

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

Back before the Second Vatican Council, civility was highly regarded in civil society. You would certainly not wear t-shirts with annoying texts; men didn't even wear t-shirts, underclass men generally wearing a tie outside work. The general attitude was that you shouldn't invade the world of other people with your personal preferences. Watch series like Downton Abbey and you'll see that people went great ways to prevent annoying, embarassing etc. other people in public. This was charity applied to public life, and thus part of Christian civilization. 

Also people didn't yet believe that 'being myself' is The Most Important Thing in the World. At work they were primarily employees, at home primarily fathers/mothers, in Church primarily sons/daughters of God. They represented something greater than themselves, and dressed to that. This was humility applied to public life, and thus also part of Christian civilization. 

I think the whole 'I wear what I like because God loves me anyway' is wrong not only because it supposes God is a cosmic social worker, but also because it ignores the social aspect of clothes and does not inspire to civility, charity, and humility. 

 

 

Do you look for the less fortunate people in church who may need help. If not financially friendship wise. I think we all should be doing as such. I find the catholic church in general is cold and insincere and i have been to multiple parishes,i wouldn't know if the protos or non denoms are any different though i have visted a few but not enough consistently to make any kind of judgement, i am poor with a mental illness sitting outside after holy mass smoking a cigarette which helps drown the misery of my condition and absolutely no one has ever come up and asked me for my number and whether i knew anyone, a few have said hello how are you but not many at all in 12 years, i would really like a few catholic friends who are not mentally ill and are faithful to church teachings. Charity is helping each other, charity is the true wedding garment of praise and worship for Jesus says "love one another as i have loved you," jesus never said go and get changed into fine linen and than i will help you. Though of course you don't come into the temple of God deliberately unless it is an emergency in pig poo covered overalls and shoes and sit on there seats and walk on the carpet, nor any ones house, homeless people are an exception. Are not homeless people allowed at holy mass, i met one once that showed up at my parish, so i took him in and let him stay at my house for 3 weeks, that's what we are supposed to do right?

Edited August 4, 2015 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye

[Archaeology cat]

 

Why the negative prop Archeology Cat? Were those not evil times? Not that these times aren't evil as well.

Indeed those were horrible things. The negative prop was because Catlick's post had had nothing to do with racism, so there was no need to bring that up. Every age has its good and bad points - we can praise the good while not justifying the bad, in my opinion. So saying people used to do x in a certain age, and that x was good, doesn't mean that the age should be dismissed because they also did y, which was bad. 

 

Maybe down-voting was harsh, sorry.

Edited August 4, 2015 by Archaeology cat

[Guest]

No I actually deserve more down votes. I was due for one. I see what you're saying also. Thanks for responding.

 

Also spelled your name wrong. Sorry.

[Catlick]

Do you look for the less fortunate people in church who may need help. If not financially friendship wise.

I do. 

I understand the problems you have with how many Catholics behave - it's a scandal when people turn away from the needy. But my point was not that dressing well is the way to be charitable when on the street, but that it's a significant way that cannot be belittled with the fake idea that the imitation of Christ necessarily means the imitation of St. John the Baptist's dress. 

[Archaeology cat]

No I actually deserve more down votes. I was due for one. I see what you're saying also. Thanks for responding.

 

Also spelled your name wrong. Sorry.

No worries on the name! And really, I probably just had a knee-jerk response. Unfortunately I do have a temper as well (no one's perfect.  ). Praying for you, and please pray for me. 

[Ash Wednesday]

 

Whose fault is poor catechesis?

.....Catholics?

 

Plain old Catholics?

[MarysLittleFlower]

Do you look for the less fortunate people in church who may need help. If not financially friendship wise. I think we all should be doing as such. I find the catholic church in general is cold and insincere and i have been to multiple parishes,i wouldn't know if the protos or non denoms are any different though i have visted a few but not enough consistently to make any kind of judgement, i am poor with a mental illness sitting outside after holy mass smoking a cigarette which helps drown the misery of my condition and absolutely no one has ever come up and asked me for my number and whether i knew anyone, a few have said hello how are you but not many at all in 12 years, i would really like a few catholic friends who are not mentally ill and are faithful to church teachings. Charity is helping each other, charity is the true wedding garment of praise and worship for Jesus says "love one another as i have loved you," jesus never said go and get changed into fine linen and than i will help you. Though of course you don't come into the temple of God deliberately unless it is an emergency in pig poo covered overalls and shoes and sit on there seats and walk on the carpet, nor any ones house, homeless people are an exception. Are not homeless people allowed at holy mass, i met one once that showed up at my parish, so i took him in and let him stay at my house for 3 weeks, that's what we are supposed to do right

It doesn't bother me at all if someone is poor and homeless at church or a person with a mental illness. If someone is dressed very poorly because they are poor, that is not an offense.. I am often low on money and much of my clothes are from second hand stores.

The only thing that would bother me is immodesty but I'd still be friendly to such a person.

I believe in being a friend to anyone though and especially the poor or those suffering in some way. It's not Christ like to ignore them. I'm sorry to hear people didn't really come up to you or seek to get to know you better some parishes are more friendly than others. i think people at my parish are friendly to newcomers but there could be improvement anywhere.

I saw a very poor man praying in church once and it was edifying to see someone turning to God despite his obvious suffering. I believe his prayers are dear to God. 

 

Edited August 4, 2015 by MarysLittleFlower

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

I do. 

I understand the problems you have with how many Catholics behave - it's a scandal when people turn away from the needy. But my point was not that dressing well is the way to be charitable when on the street, but that it's a significant way that cannot be belittled with the fake idea that the imitation of Christ necessarily means the imitation of St. John the Baptist's dress. 

And on the whole black and poor thing, color aside do you know the magnificat by heart and what glories await and are actually granted to the believer whom is poor? Straight out the good book and it's not just a hook. God and the holy mother truly have a soft spot for the believer that is poor, and so should we.  Mary was a believer that was poor and she was granted wisdom above any that is was or ever will be except God himself.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye

[Nihil Obstat]

Magnificat anima mea Dominum,
et exsultavit spiritus meus in Deo salvatore meo,
quia respexit humilitatem ancillae suae.
Ecce enim ex hoc beatam me dicent omnes generationes,
quia fecit mihi magna,
qui potens est,
et sanctum nomen eius,
et misericordia eius in progenies et progenies
timentibus eum.
Fecit potentiam in brachio suo,
dispersit superbos mente cordis sui;
deposuit potentes de sede
et exaltavit humiles;
esurientes implevit bonis
et divites dimisit inanes.
Suscepit Israel puerum suum,
recordatus misericordiae,
sicut locutus est ad patres nostros,
Abraham et semini eius in saecula.

 

My soul glorifies the Lord, *
my spirit rejoices in God, my Saviour.
He looks on his servant in her lowliness; *
henceforth all ages will call me blessed.
The Almighty works marvels for me. *
Holy his name!
His mercy is from age to age, *
on those who fear him.
He puts forth his arm in strength *
and scatters the proud-hearted.
He casts the mighty from their thrones *
and raises the lowly.
He fills the starving with good things, *
sends the rich away empty.
He protects Israel, his servant, *
remembering his mercy,
the mercy promised to our fathers, *
to Abraham and his sons for ever.

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

My translation says "fills the poor with good things" not starving. What translation is yours Nihil?

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

And perhaps listening to protestant rap will weigh far lesser on the soul in purgatory than a lifetime indulging in pagan philosophy called fantasy, in hollywood, t.v series and pop 40 music. Perhaps neither is actually good. Idk, but i know which one i would choose if both are evil and i was to choose a lesser evil, not saying the protestant rap is evil though, just a hypothesis.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye

[Nihil Obstat]

My translation says "fills the poor with good things" not starving. What translation is yours Nihil?

The Latin line is: "esurientes implevit bonis".
Esurientes is "the hungry", so in this context starving seems acceptable. "Poor" does not seem to be as accurate.

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

The poor are often hungry.How are the starving filled with good things, they are on deaths door, unless this is what the holy mother is talking about, being on deaths door? Some kind of don't fear death parable perhaps?

Edited August 5, 2015 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye

[Catlick]

And on the whole black and poor thing, color aside do you know the magnificat by heart and what glories await and are actually granted to the believer whom is poor? Straight out the good book and it's not just a hook. God and the holy mother truly have a soft spot for the believer that is poor, and so should we.  Mary was a believer that was poor and she was granted wisdom above any that is was or ever will be except God himself.

...And Christ had a soft spot in His heart for the woman who poured very expensive perfume on His head. Note that the apostles were scandalized by this; in this they were no different from the contemporary Christians who think that money spent on beautiful altars and not on charity is wasted. 

 

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

But the truth is a double edged sword so it's probably both, spiritual and literal.