Remnant video on the Synod

[little2add]

 

Minga

[little2add]

If their union is adulterous then they must end it.

i'm just a little curious, what do I you think should become of these children  Born to the adulterers when they ( the adulterers) end it?

[Credo in Deum]

i'm just a little curious, what do I you think should become of these children  Born to the adulterers when they ( the adulterers) end it?

The parents should continue to make sure the children are active in their faith regardless of what the parents unique situation calls for; whether that be living as brother and sister, or if that is not possible without causing a scandal, then they need to separate while still keeping their children active in their faith.  The only people who will punish the children for the parents situation are the parents themselves, since they ultimately control how they approach the cross they are going to have to carry. The cross which they have created by their sins.  They can either discard the cross and teach their children, wrongly, that the church is uncharitable, or they can accept the cross and teach their children that sin has consequences but that God in his mercy extends the cross so that we may do our part to repair our relationship with God.  A relationship which we, WE, have wounded by our sins.  The Church here is neither obligated or responsible for their difficult situation.  On the contrary, had they followed the Church they would not have been in this situation to begin with.  

Lastly Catholics need to get it out of their heads that the Church is punishing such couples, or their children, by having the parents separate, if that is the only option available. The Church dispenses the sacraments and is here to save souls.  They cannot do this if we are not wiling to do everything we can to amend our lives so that we can participate in the sacramental life of the Church.  I know the whole "amend your life" sounds foreign to most people, you know since divorce is fact of life and all, but there is no forgiveness without a true purpose of amendment.  Yes, amendment. It's that part of the Act of Contrition you say at the end of your confessions.   When Christ helped the woman caught in adultery He forgave her and then told her to "go, and sin no more!"  He did not say "go and continue to live in adultery. I wouldn't want My will to be an inconvenience for you."

Edited November 8, 2015 by Credo in Deum

[dominicansoul]

 

That’s absurd.  Are you suggesting the parents end there union?

 

  In practicality, it is unlikely that the children of said union can or would follow the catholic faith.

 

 

i think what is more absurd is going through the Sacrament of Marriage with someone, saying "I do" to FOREVER being with that person, and then breaking up later cos they didn't do their homework and get to really know that person and recognize that they SHOULDN'T say "I DO" to forever and ever til death do they part for better and for worse.  And that's the main problem with marriage today.  It's not a trial, it's not a "let's try this out and see how it goes" kinda thing, it's SERIOUSLY F-O-R-E-V-E-R.    I think what's absurd are society's definitions of marriage as well as the attitude towards marriage, as if its something they can return to the store when it breaks or they realize they don't want it after all.

With that said, the Church isn't the big bad meanie most people want to make it out to be.  You see this with other issues.  "What does the Church have to CHANGE to fit into my lifestyle and not offend me in my sinfulness???"  We live in a world where everybody is looking inward at themselves and concerned... or rather, obsessed with not getting their feelings hurt while completely ignoring God's feelings.  He gets hurt too, you know.  And it really is the Church's job to defend Him and His commandments, regardless if it "offends" people's sinful states.   

I think we need next a Synod on Catechesis, because with the breakdown of the Family Unit in our Church, parents have not been the primary teachers of the Faith to their children.  That has left the responsibility to Parish CCD programs which only get children once a week for about an hour.  And we've seen how this has not bore much fruit in the Church, but actually has created a great deal of ignorance amongst the Faithful. 

[little2add]

what about forgiveness

 

[little2add]

   When Christ helped the woman caught in adultery He forgave her and then told her to "go, and sin no more!"  He did not say "go and continue to live in adultery. I wouldn't want My will to be an inconvenience for you."

VERSES 10-11: Jesus stood up and said to her, "Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?" She said, "No one, Lord." And Jesus said, "Neither do I condemn you; go, and from now on sin no more."

 

forgave and condemn are not interchangeable, if your going to apply  verses 10-11, you need to understand the diff

[dominicansoul]

what about forgiveness

 

what about "sin no more?"

you can't stay in the state of mortal sin and expect forgiveness

[little2add]

i think what is more absurd is going through the Sacrament of Marriage with someone, saying "I do" to FOREVER being with that person, and then breaking up later cos they didn't do their homework and get to really know that person and recognize that they SHOULDN'T say "I DO" to forever and ever til death do they part for better and for worse.  And that's the main problem with marriage today.  It's not a trial, it's not a "let's try this out and see how it goes" kinda thing, it's SERIOUSLY F-O-R-E-V-E-R.    I think what's absurd are society's definitions of marriage as well as the attitude towards marriage, as if its something they can return to the store when it breaks or they realize they don't want it after all.

With that said, the Church isn't the big bad meanie most people want to make it out to be.  You see this with other issues.  "What does the Church have to CHANGE to fit into my lifestyle and not offend me in my sinfulness???"  We live in a world where everybody is looking inward at themselves and concerned... or rather, obsessed with not getting their feelings hurt while completely ignoring God's feelings.  He gets hurt too, you know.  And it really is the Church's job to defend Him and His commandments, regardless if it "offends" people's sinful states.   

I think we need next a Synod on Catechesis, because with the breakdown of the Family Unit in our Church, parents have not been the primary teachers of the Faith to their children.  That has left the responsibility to Parish CCD programs which only get children once a week for about an hour.  And we've seen how this has not bore much fruit in the Church, but actually has created a great deal of ignorance amongst the Faithful. 

I love and honored  my wife even before she said "I do" until the day she died 30 years later, the three Beautiful children that resulted from our Union are the most precious thing in my (both) lifes.   I think about her  every day and thank God for the time we had together.

I firmly believe in the sacrament and sanctity of marriage.

Divorce is very prevalent in today's society, so much unhappiness and misery has resulted from such.  But I don't see how abandoning a child who sprung from an invalid marriage could possibly be beneficial or a good thing.  

 

 

 

[little2add]

 

Gay people, divorced and remarried people, people who don't follow the rules like getting married not in a church are not welcome in the present day cathilic church.  

It is any wonder that church attendance has fallen drastically among Catholics.

over the past four decades, self-reported church attendance has declined among “strong” Catholics as well as among Catholics overall. The share of all Catholics who say they attend Mass at least once a week has dropped from 47% in 1974 to 24% in 2012; among “strong” Catholics, it has fallen more than 30 points, from 85% in 1974 to 53% last year.

the facts speak for themselfs.  Local parishes are closing and/or consolidating wherever you go, hopefully this Synod Will bring souls back...

Edited November 11, 2015 by little2add

[Peace]

 

Gay people, divorced and remarried people, people who don't follow the rules like getting married not in a church are not welcome in the present day cathilic church. 

I do not see how you come to that conclusion. It seems to me that gay people are called to live a life of chastity. I have never heard any priest say that gay people are not welcome in the church. People who are divorced and remarried are encouraged to seek an annulment (my sister is in this situation right now). Just because the Church cannot accept or encourage sin does not mean that people who are engaged in sinful activities are not welcome. At least my own personal experience has been that the priest encourages confession, and is willing to work with people to put them on a better path to salvation. It seems to me that the Church wants all of these people to participate in the life of the church, and part of that is attempting to eliminate sin from one's life, I think.

[little2add]

why do you think that the catholic faith (in the US) is in such a great decline then?

[Not A Real Name]

why do you think that the catholic faith (in the US) is in such a great decline then?

Probably because there are a lot of wishy washy Catholics who treat the Church like it's some club that needs to change with the times. 

[little2add]

thank you Captain Obvious 

[Peace]

why do you think that the catholic faith (in the US) is in such a great decline then?

That's a good question. I have not really thought about it, so it is tough for me to say. For one, I am not sure that I would say that the Church in the US is in a great decline. But if by decline you mean a drop in the number of professed Catholics, I suppose that the reasons for that are pretty complex. It seems that there has been an overall drop in religiosity in the US that has affected all Christians, not only Catholics. You certainly have people who want to attack the Church. It seems to me that there has been pretty poor Catechesis in recent years, so a significant number of people were not really firmly rooted in their faith to start with. You also have a pretty modern, individualistic culture, whereby people in general see themselves as being more self-reliant than reliant on God. That culture is probably most prevalent in the USA. You also have the failure of many people within the Church to live up to the standards that She sets and that has hurt her image (such as the pedophile priests, etc.)  All of those come into play I think.

[little2add]

Read matthew 9:11 -13

 

   "What does the Church have to CHANGE to fit into my lifestyle and not offend me in my sinfulness???"

Because the sinners are the ones who need the help, that's why!

 Isn't it odd that the   Crucial  verse to this  discussion is 911 

[dominicansoul]

Read matthew 9:11 -13

 

 

Because the sinners are the ones who need the help, that's why!

 Isn't it odd that the   Crucial  verse to this  discussion is 911

Sinners get help only when they are told the Truth.  Ever hear the saying, "The Truth shall set you free?" 

Believe me, this sinner needs the Church.  I was just at Confession last night.  I don't want to be told, "it's okay, ur okay, ur sins are okay."  I want to be told, "God is merciful and your sins have been forgiven go and sin no more." 

[little2add]

Sinners get help only when they are told the Truth.  Ever hear the saying, "The Truth shall set you free?" 

Believe me, this sinner needs the Church.  I was just at Confession last night.  I don't want to be told, "it's okay, ur okay, ur sins are okay."  I want to be told, "God is merciful and your sins have been forgiven go and sin no more." 

 you're preaching to the choir,  brother 

[Credo in Deum]

Sinners get help only when they are told the Truth.  Ever hear the saying, "The Truth shall set you free?" 

Believe me, this sinner needs the Church.  I was just at Confession last night.  I don't want to be told, "it's okay, ur okay, ur sins are okay."  I want to be told, "God is merciful and your sins have been forgiven go and sin no more." 

Our Lord is the Divine Physician. Sometimes His medicines are hard to swallow, but they are always for the well-being of our souls.  

[MarysLittleFlower]

what about forgiveness

 

There's no forgiveness without repentance. God doesn't force His grace on us. A person who has no intent to stop committing the sin is not repentant. A couple living as husband and wife without a valid marriage are sinning. If the Church let them receive the Sacraments in this state it would be reception of Sacraments in mortal sin and each time they do this they would be committing sacrilige. Then when they die, if they don't repent, they'd be guilty not only of the other sin but also hundreds of sacriligeous Communions and Confessions. That is very serious. People who advocate for these couples to have the Sacraments without ending the sin, don't understand what they are truly arguing for. True charity cares for the persons spiritual good not just their feelings. What is the use of feeling accepted or whatever while being on the path to hell and have everyone encourage you there. What kind of a friend would do that. 

 

That's how the Churchs teaching is way more charitable than that of people who want the active homosexuals and divorced 'remarried' people to have Communion. They would be receiving unto their greater condemnation not salvation. We don't get forgiven if we have no intent to.stop the sin. 

This goes for any sin BTW. When I.confess my sins the priest looks for true repentance too that's part of being a confessor. If I have no purpose of amendment its invalid. Why would there be an exception for this. So if someone is divorced and with someone, the priest would help them get out of sin. If there are children there are ways for them to be taken cared of without the parents living as spouses. And if the children are told through example that marriage doesn't matter, how would that affect them spiritually? That's important too. I think.there are people against this teaching not because the Church is "mean" but because the reality of sin has been lost today in society and its all about feelings. 

For myself I'd rather save my soul than go to hell feeling comfortable with my life. 

[little2add]

If there are children there are ways for them to be taken cared of without the parents living as spouses. And if the children are told through example that marriage doesn't matter, how would that affect them spiritually? That's important too. I think.there are people against this teaching not because the Church is "mean" but because the reality of sin has been lost today in society and its all about feelings. 

For myself I'd rather save my soul than go to hell feeling comfortable with my life. 

O No, i don't believe it!   if you was this child, you might not agree.  wouldn't it be better to accept the wayward parents, repent, accept and keep the family together?  two wrongs don't make a right, my dear.  

an now a song by Frank Zappa

Oh no
I don't believe it
You say that you think you know
The meaning of love
You say love is all we need
You say
With your love you can change
All of the fools
All of the hate
I think you're probably
Out to lunch

Oh no
I don't believe it
You say that you think you know
The meaning of love
Do you really think it can be told?
You say that you really know
I think
You should check it again
How can you say
What you believe
Will be the key to a
World of love?

All your love -
Will it save me?
All your love -
Will it save the world
From what we can't understand
Oh no
I don't believe it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nrxx72AK0ZU