God Conquers Posted December 1, 2004 Posted December 1, 2004 I'd say that it is IMPOSSIBLE to smoke dope in moderation. Like I said... high or not high. If there are varying levels of high then they are: High Quite High Very High Space There's no "almost high" or "not quite high".
Guest A Tall Guy Posted December 1, 2004 Posted December 1, 2004 [quote name='God Conquers' date='Dec 1 2004, 06:09 PM']I'd say that it is IMPOSSIBLE to smoke dope in moderation. [/quote] I'm suprised to see so many people in agreement with this idea. I understand that some people can't smoke in moderation; I had a roomate who couldn't drink in moderation, but I didn't conclude that no-one could. Based on experience in my sordid past, I would have said pot is one of the easiest illegal drugs (besides alcohol and tobacco for the underage) to achieve a light buzz that isn't much more affective than a beer. There are plenty of other chemicals with no middle ground--e.g. sober or passed out and off in hyperspace. Tom [Look what gets me to de-lurk.. a pot thread. Oh well.]
rachael Posted December 1, 2004 Posted December 1, 2004 [quote name='dUSt' date='Dec 1 2004, 06:26 PM'] Let's all get blunted. [/quote] Why would you ever do it?
toledo_jesus Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 [quote name='A Tall Guy' date='Dec 1 2004, 07:47 PM'] I'm suprised to see so many people in agreement with this idea. I understand that some people can't smoke in moderation; I had a roomate who couldn't drink in moderation, but I didn't conclude that no-one could. Based on experience in my sordid past, I would have said pot is one of the easiest illegal drugs (besides alcohol and tobacco for the underage) to achieve a light buzz that isn't much more affective than a beer. There are plenty of other chemicals with no middle ground--e.g. sober or passed out and off in hyperspace. Tom [Look what gets me to de-lurk.. a pot thread. Oh well.] [/quote] that was bad pot... When pot doesn't get you high it has failed to achieve the effect the smoker desired. Welcome by the way.
Don John of Austria Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 It doesn't matter iti s a mutagen and therefore is always sinful to use legal or not.
dUSt Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 I'm sorry to say that I use to smoke weed. I would often stop at a couple puffs just to get that light buzz--remaining in perfect control. That was a LONG time ago though. Remember. THERE'S NO HOPE WITH DOPE.
peach_cube Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 I was once known to smoke alot of weed. The thing is you can smoke it and not feel high. But it is like the alcoholic that needs 10 beers to start feeling drunk. The first bowl, joint, bong, might not do it but after 4 or 5 it may hit you. The intent is still to get high. That's why you smoke the 5th joint, you are not feeling it yet. Anyway it's always going to be sinfull because the intent is to get high. With alcohol I know that I can enjoy a drink and not feel anything but a little warm. With pot you kind of need to be a pothead to not get high off of a little bit.
ironmonk Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 (edited) [quote name='point5' date='Dec 1 2004, 05:50 PM'] from my personal experience (pre Christian) there is no middle ground... you are either high or not high. It is that simple...and if you are not high...you smoke till you are. And one joint normally will get you high [/quote] I disagree. I've smoked it in the past (although not for long)... I've known tons of people who smoke lots of it. And I've witnessed levels of high... with other people, and myself. I do not believe that it is a mortal sin to smoke it if it is legal... it becomes a mortal sin when one reaches a point of drunkeness. I know how it works biologically... the more you smoke, the more dopamine is released.... that means that there are levels. I've witnessed people take two hits and be fine and a little relaxed as if they had a drink... and then watched those same people smoke it until they passed out... those are levels my friends. Nothing more to be said on it unless someone can come up with a statement from the Bishops about legal marijuana. What the Catechism has: [quote][b]2290 [/b] The virtue of temperance disposes us to avoid every kind of excess: the abuse of food, alcohol, tobacco, or medicine. Those incur grave guilt who, by drunkenness or a love of speed, endanger their own and others' safety on the road, at sea, or in the air. [b]2291 [/b] The use of drugs inflicts very grave damage on human health and life. Their use, except on strictly therapeutic grounds, is a grave offense. Clandestine production of and trafficking in drugs are scandalous practices. They constitute direct co-operation in evil, since they encourage people to practices gravely contrary to the moral law.[/quote] 2291 seems to be meaning illegal drugs else "clandestine production" would not be used. alcohol and tobacco are legal drugs... marijuana could be classified as a medication... therefore it would not be a sin if it was legal. What I would like to know is how the Magisterium views legal marijuana used at a low level to where one does not reach drunkeness. There are level to being high. On a side note, after looking at 2290, it would be interesting to find out how the Bishops view NASCAR. God Bless, ironmonk Edited December 2, 2004 by ironmonk
toledo_jesus Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 if a person's at the point where they smoke a little to mellow out then they have developed a habit anyway. Nobody just casually uses marijuana without at least once getting high. The point of smoking the garbage is to get high. You're wasting your money if you aren't at least getting blazed. wasting it further, I mean.
God Conquers Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Ironmonk, that is an interesting proposition, however, would you say that it is a mortal sin to smoke up when it is illegal? Another question... If it was legal, could you concieve a group of serious Catholics sharing a joint like they would share a beer? It sems to me this is where things break down... it just doesn't seem right.
crusader1234 Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Hey, To all of you that say 'either you're high or youre not'... well you're wrong. It is much the same as alcohol, where the amount you drink or smoke is what determines the level of inerbreation. My friends smoke up quite a bit, and theres no way that you can tell me that they always get high. Often, you can not tell when they ARE high. They have never gotten to a point where they are making bad decisions (or at least ones they wouldn't make anyways). The idea that Marijuana is sinful because you're automatically high is flat out stupid - because its just not true. Rich.
ironmonk Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 [quote name='toledo_jesus' date='Dec 1 2004, 11:38 PM'] if a person's at the point where they smoke a little to mellow out then they have developed a habit anyway. Nobody just casually uses marijuana without at least once getting high. The point of smoking the garbage is to get high. You're wasting your money if you aren't at least getting blazed. wasting it further, I mean. [/quote] My mother has glocoma... she doesn't smoke it, but she needs to use THC drops in her eyes to slow the loss of her eyesight. There are people in the world that smoke it so they can keep their eyesight and it's legal in those places. Smoking it every now and then in a place where it is legal does not equal a habit. There are people who use marijuana casually... just because you don't know any does not mean there arn't any. I know some... and if it was legal, I still do not believe it a sin. People saying it's a waste of money in a legal place have no right to say that because it's not a waste if they are not sinning, and they want to spend their money on it. Some people tell me that I waste money on alcohol... I ask them: Do you eat out? Do you get a steak at Outback or Ruths Chris? Do you go to a movie? The same applies here bro... Just because you don't like does not mean that it's a waste for others as long as they don't sin with it and it is legal. I am totally against smoking marijuana... but if it's legal and people do not smoke it to the point of drunkeness, I do not believe it to be a sin. I do not think it should be legalized because it will be abused, and it is the gateway drug for those that abuse it. I've seen what it does to people. It's not physically addictive... it is psychologically addictive when used in great quantities, or consistant prolonged use. Not when used every now and then. Tabacco is more addictive than marijuana. God Bless, ironmonk
God Conquers Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Well, alot of this stuff is coming from personal experience....
ironmonk Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 [quote name='God Conquers' date='Dec 1 2004, 11:41 PM'] Ironmonk, that is an interesting proposition, however, would you say that it is a mortal sin to smoke up when it is illegal? Another question... If it was legal, could you concieve a group of serious Catholics sharing a joint like they would share a beer? It sems to me this is where things break down... it just doesn't seem right. [/quote] Bro, I thought I already said that... I believe it to be a sin if it's illegal. I believe it would be a mortal sin because of what the Catechism says in 2291... as for illegal drugs. I think it's stupid to smoke anything... especially pot. If it was legal I would think a group of serious Catholics would be smarter than that. I do not believe that pot is any comparison to alchohol... a little alcohol is good for us... but a little tabacco or marijuana isn't.... unless you have glocoma then a little pot could be good. I also believe that we should consider the following in some cases... [b]Proverbs 31:6 [/b] Give strong drink to one who is perishing, and wine to the sorely depressed; [b]7 [/b]When they drink, they will forget their misery, and think no more of their burdens. God Bless, ironmonk
EcceNovaFacioOmni Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 I have never seen a drug user that used weed to get a "light buzz". That's just my experience. Plus, it smells terrible.
drewmeister2 Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 [quote name='crusader1234' date='Dec 1 2004, 08:47 PM'] Hey, To all of you that say 'either you're high or youre not'... well you're wrong. It is much the same as alcohol, where the amount you drink or smoke is what determines the level of inerbreation. My friends smoke up quite a bit, and theres no way that you can tell me that they always get high. Often, you can not tell when they ARE high. They have never gotten to a point where they are making bad decisions (or at least ones they wouldn't make anyways). The idea that Marijuana is sinful because you're automatically high is flat out stupid - because its just not true. Rich. [/quote] You dont have to be high for it to be sinful. The fact is is that it hurts your health, even if you dont get high. I cant see any good in it. The Church says some things like alcohol are good, in moderation, but somethings, like premarital sex and drugs, are just wrong, and cant be done.
ironmonk Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 [quote name='drewmeister2' date='Dec 2 2004, 12:01 AM'] You dont have to be high for it to be sinful. The fact is is that it hurts your health, even if you dont get high. I cant see any good in it. The Church says some things like alcohol are good, in moderation, but somethings, like premarital sex and drugs, are just wrong, and cant be done. [/quote] With your reasoning, you must include tobacco. Tobacco does damage to some people's health... yet it's not a sin if used moderately. Please read the Catechism piece I posted above.. 2290-2291, and my comments. God Bless, ironmonk
Dreamweaver Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 With many pot users, I've noticed that many of them have problems with other parts of their lives. It seems as if they turn to drugs to escape from stress and other problems. If one ends up using marijuana to escape from reality, it can easily become the only way someone knows how to cope with the stresses of reality. If marijuana were legal, and if someone were to take a small toke now and then, I could see that it wouldn't be a mortal sin. I don't see why someone would only smoke in moderation, and occasionally. Plus it stinks nasty. Medicinal use is another weird grey area. I could see it being used if it were under close supervision of a doctor. You'd have a definate problem if someone were to grow their own "medicine" and share with others without a prescription. Ideally, pharmaceutical companies could find a way to produce just the THC, to allow for a more consistent, uniform product.
Recommended Posts