Declaring War on Abortion

[save ferris 101]

[quote name='Aluigi' date='Dec 31 2004, 01:24 PM'] i presume no one's culpability one way or the other, simply state the objective facts. these murderers deserve death. if they are inculpable of it, let them repent in the face of my sword.

(though i'm not actually going out to fight them, lol i just thought that'd be a cool line) [/quote]
Since when have we been able to say who deserves death and who doesn't. Guess if you were with Jesus, you would have been able to throw a stone eh?

[Guest Aluigi]

murderers deserve death. that is a fact the Bible teaches us.

if a man's life is the cause of others' deaths, let his life be taken.

[Q the Ninja]

Yes, but in the Bible, presumably the Old Testament, the law was set forth. Sadly it's not so simple now.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Aluigi' date='Dec 31 2004, 03:28 PM'] murderers deserve death. that is a fact the Bible teaches us.

if a man's life is the cause of others' deaths, let his life be taken. [/quote]
but not but you, that is function of the legitimate government.

[Q the Ninja]

[Guest Aluigi]

i know not by me, i wasn't planning on it. (the sword line was just too good to pass up, but i didn't mean it!)

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote]but not but you, that is function of the legitimate government. [/quote]

If the government was legitimate, there wouldn't be a problem to begin with.

You're not implying that we should just accept a corrupt government? I'm sure the Catholic Church doesn't teach that. A new american revolution or civil war seems to be justified according to the Catholic Church.


If you think that practicality is an issue, then argue that. Dont' argue about waiting for a legitmate government if that's not what you mean. I say this because I really can't believe you're waiting for a legitimate government if you stop and think about what you're saying.

[cmotherofpirl]

What qualifies you to decide if the government is corrupt or not?

[Don John of Austria]

[quote]What qualifies you to decide if the government is corrupt or not? [/quote]

2000 years of Chruch Tradition and the equel amount of teaching from the Magisterium. This doesn't even discuss the ability of a Men to determine what is Just through the Natural Law.

[Theoketos]

Tradition does not speak on this particular case.

[dairygirl4u2c]

In response to cmother I was basically going to say what Don said.

And I will respond to this.

[quote]Tradition does not speak on this particular case. [/quote]

It's not us saying the government is corrupt; it's the Catholic Church. Its tradition says that abortion is wrong. It says that wars can be justified. I don't see a difference between an abortion just war and others.

The only difference I might be able to see is that you might think it's somewhat understandable what the pro-choice argument says. Actually, I bet ninty percent of the people here really know what it says (they usually don't make themselves very clear). But I know that most of you think that it's illogical to fathom understanding the prochoice arguement at all. So it seems like all the criteria are present.

I have a few more points to make but I will let this play out first. For now, how is this any different than any other Just war?

Edited December 31, 2004 by dairygirl4u2c

[Theoketos]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' date='Dec 31 2004, 03:45 PM'] What qualifies you to decide if the government is corrupt or not? [/quote]
If the government is not governing by the will of the people and the government does more harm then good according to the natural law.

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote]If the government is not governing by the will of the people and the government does more harm then good according to the natural law. [/quote]

I like that..

Now let me work that into the equation here. I'll be back after the New Years!

[bookwyrm]

You have to think about going to war in the context of our society. The liberals already see us as crazy, ignorant, unenlightened barbarians; declaring physical war on them would hardly ameliorate the situation. Don't get me wrong; we ARE ALREADY at war. It's a spiritual war. What's wrong with that? Why can't that be just as powerful and effective?

If it were God's will, of course I would be willing to fight that His will might be done. I just find it hard to believe that He would choose to act through us in such a way.

We want to convert them, to convince them we're right, not to eliminate them. Going to war is not a long-term solution.

[Guest Aluigi]

that's the way he usually acts (through war)

God is un-enlightened too lol

[Q the Ninja]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Dec 31 2004, 05:14 PM'] I have a few more points to make but I will let this play out first. For now, how is this any different than any other Just war? [/quote]
There are other ways to stop this, which is part of the Just War Doctrine.

[Q the Ninja]

[quote name='Theoketos' date='Dec 31 2004, 05:14 PM'] If the government is not governing by the will of the people and the government does more harm then good according to the natural law. [/quote]
I believe our government allows a great deal of harm to occur. However, the good from it outweighs the harm.

Look at ancient Rome. I do not want to belittle this situation, but they were still a just government after killing God. Talk about major crimes.

[voiciblanche]

May I have an example of a just war (one that's already occured) so that I may put this into perspective?

[Q the Ninja]

Us going to war with Germany was probably just.

[voiciblanche]

[quote name='Q the Ninja' date='Jan 1 2005, 03:28 AM'] Us going to war with Germany was probably just. [/quote]


Anybody have more than that, and possibly without a "probably"?