Other religions' use of Holy Water

[Phatmasser777]

[quote name='VoloHumilisEsse' date='Jan 9 2005, 04:06 AM'] we sell empty holy water bottles in our bookstore.....it is up to the person buying it to get a source of free holy water.....i dont understand how you are concluding that we are charging for the holy water [/quote]
Did I say YOU or anyone else? Re-Read.

[HomeTeamFamily]

ok now i think im as confused as crusader

[crusader1234]

Actually Phatmasser777, there isn't anything to re-read that has anything to do with Volo's post...

[HomeTeamFamily]

good im glad im not the only one who saw that and was confused

[StColette]

I'm confused as well.

[crusader1234]

Anyways, I found out from New Advent (courtesy of volo) that items lose their blessings once sold.

[Phatmasser777]

[quote name='crusader1234' date='Jan 9 2005, 04:18 AM'] Actually Phatmasser777, there isn't anything to re-read that has anything to do with Volo's post... [/quote]
Good starting point, especially when you re-read and see that my original posts HAD NOTHING TO [Edited by IcePrincess] DO WITH HIS. Oy.

Edited January 10, 2005 by IcePrincessKRS

[Kilroy the Ninja]

[quote name='crusader1234' date='Jan 9 2005, 04:25 AM'] Anyways, I found out from New Advent (courtesy of volo) that items lose their blessings once sold. [/quote]
Can you please post a link to this? Thanks!

[Benedict]

Once again, Phatmasser, you are just completely off and wrong.

Dreamweaver never said he had no qualms about them selling holy water nor was his post "complaining about them selling it to witches or non-catholics". The topic of his post is what happens when other religions try to buy and use holy water; does it work or not?

Following that, St.Colette explained that it is usually the bottle one is charged for, not the holy water. Without any argument or attempt at proof, you simply assert it is also the holy water you are charged for (you seem to have a little problem with backing up your assertions; talking the talk without walking the walk, I believe they call it).

She followed up with the testimony that full and empty bottles of holy water are the same price, strongly implying that one pays for the bottle and not the holy water.

To that I add my own testimony. In both my home parish and my school parish, there is a decanter of holy water free for distribution. You can bring in your container and fill it for free at any time. I have availed myself of this several times.

Concerning your last post, your first post really had "nothing to do" with the topic of the thread, nor were any explanations forthcoming from you (part of that problem with assertion I mentioned above).

Edited January 10, 2005 by IcePrincessKRS

[Benedict]

This was mentioned in the [url="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14001a.htm"]Simony[/url] article:

"It is thus unlawful to exchange ecclesiastical benefices by private authority, to accept any payment whatever for holy oils, to sell blessed rosaries or crucifixes. Such objects lose, if sold, all the indulgences previously attached to them (S. Cong. Of Indulg., 12 July, 1847)."

[HomeTeamFamily]

thank you benedict......last night at 5am it was kind of hard to see that clearly lol

[Oik]

[quote]Such objects lose, if sold, all the indulgences previously attached to them (S. Cong. Of Indulg., 12 July, 1847).[/quote]

Which is why one has to go see the parish priest after buying goodies from the home parish giftshop/bookstore...

[Dreamweaver]

[quote name='Benedict' date='Jan 9 2005, 10:43 AM'] Dreamweaver never said he had no qualms about them selling holy water nor was his post "complaining about them selling it to witches or non-catholics". The topic of his post is what happens when other religions try to buy and use holy water; does it work or not? [/quote]
Actually I'm a girl, but its ok.

Concerning the selling of blessed objects, the Catholic church basically states that the objects lose their previous blessings if sold.

Does anyone know if other religions' have a similar belief? Many of these witchcraft supply stores charge exorbiant prices, and I really can't tell if they're blessed or anything. I wasn't putting down wicca or those who practice it. I just found it curious that stores sell things for exorbiant prices, especially since wicca and other forms of paganism describe themselves as nature based religions.

I'm not sure of any other religions or belief systems have a form of blessing or consecrating objects, or what their "policy" is on selling or charging more for blessed objects.

[Benedict]

Exhorbitant.

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v622/EldricIV/Nazi.gif[/img]

I am not sure if this is 100% accurate, but from what I know, many ingredients in witchcraft must be harvested or prepared in a specific way, at a specific time, and/or with a specific spell or incantation that could be considered like a blessing.

One can assume that since these shops do exist to sell ingredients or charms or whatever, selling them does not break the spell.

Or, one can postulate that even if it does break the spell it does not impact their use in witchcraft (otherwise why buy them).

Or, one can postulate that these stores cater to the rebellious teen wiccans and not the "real" witches. Sort of the cafeteria Catholics of the pagan world.

[Dreamweaver]

Haha, sorry, its actually spelled exorbiant. [url="http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=exorbitant"]From Merriam-Webster Online[/url]. Not sure if there are different spellings for different regions though.

Yes, I would like to believe that "true" witches somehow aquire their supplies and tools with natural found objects or suitable cheap things, rather than expensive shops and such. I don't see the purpose of stores selling 80 different types of magical oils (the ingredients aren't even listed) for $8 an ounce or so. One could make the same argument about Catholic sacramentals too. Simple plastic or knotted rosaries vs precious gem rosaries that cost hundreds of dollars. Or simple 25 cent medals vs 24k gold medals. It seems that many of these stores send a message that one must get items with blah blah blah oil infused in it and x number of gemstones to channel energy most effectively. Not to mention specific ritual robes, candles, yadda yadda.

Anyone know of any wiccans/pagans that could share their thoughts on stores that deal in witchcraft supplies and materials vs using found objects in their rituals? It seems to me that it would be more fitting to their beliefs if they used handmade/hand grown stuff rather than overpriced, manufactured tools.

[Benedict]

You spelled it "exorbiant" again.

I know of a witchcraft website where you can ask about it. PM me if you want the address.

[hyperdulia again]

*hijack*

crusader, I just have to say this MORRISON ROCKS!

*exits*

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='Benedict' date='Jan 9 2005, 11:47 AM'] This was mentioned in the [url="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14001a.htm"]Simony[/url] article:

"It is thus unlawful to exchange ecclesiastical benefices by private authority, to accept any payment whatever for holy oils, to sell blessed rosaries or crucifixes. Such objects lose, if sold, all the indulgences previously attached to them (S. Cong. Of Indulg., 12 July, 1847)." [/quote]
I'm a little confused.... indulgences aren't the same thing as a blessing, correct? Am I just not understanding the passage, because it doesn't seem to say that they lose the blessing, just indulgences, that is if the item carried an indulgence that would get you a Perpetual Indulgence or something it would lose that effect, but would it wipe out the blessing entirely? I'm still struggling with how something that is a sacramental because it's been blessed can become entirely not-sacramental because it has lost the blessing.... can someone explain?

[crusader1234]

I did a little research, and as it turns out, there is Holy Water made by witches which does not involve the Catholic Church in any way.

[Catalyst]

the bibles warns about conversations that go around in circles. If you have questions, read the bible! Spend time with God and ask Him!