Other religions' use of Holy Water

[Mary's Knight, La]

[hijack to original topic haha]

apparantly the issue of it losing it's blessing by being sold is still a question

however, as a sacramental it's power, or more accurately it's conveyance of God's grace is limited by how open the person using it is to receiving God's grace (This is for if it is Catholic holy water) you would i think have a hard time in convincing me that a witch is open to God's grace and that it is in God's will to use it for a spell or such.
[/hijack]

Edited January 11, 2005 by Mary's Knight, La

[Phatmasser777]

[quote name='Benedict' date='Jan 9 2005, 10:43 AM'] Once again, Phatmasser, you are just completely off and wrong.

Dreamweaver never said he had no qualms about them selling holy water nor was his post "complaining about them selling it to witches or non-catholics". The topic of his post is what happens when other religions try to buy and use holy water; does it work or not?

Following that, St.Colette explained that it is usually the bottle one is charged for, not the holy water. Without any argument or attempt at proof, you simply assert it is also the holy water you are charged for (you seem to have a little problem with backing up your assertions; talking the talk without walking the walk, I believe they call it).

She followed up with the testimony that full and empty bottles of holy water are the same price, strongly implying that one pays for the bottle and not the holy water.

To that I add my own testimony. In both my home parish and my school parish, there is a decanter of holy water free for distribution. You can bring in your container and fill it for free at any time. I have availed myself of this several times.

Concerning your last post, your first post really had "nothing to do" with the topic of the thread, nor were any explanations forthcoming from you (part of that problem with assertion I mentioned above). [/quote]
:sleep:

[crusader1234]

I'm intolerably rude and cruel?

[Dreamweaver]

We need a big group hug

:group:

No more hurt feelings about spelling/misspelling corrections.

Lets get back onto topic about discussing holy water. In addition to charging for the bottle, it is ok to include shipping and handling in the fee for obtaining Lourdes (and presumably holy) water. Shipping from France may be a bit on the excessive side. Lets just hope that sites that sell Lourdes water aren't charging more than the cost of the bottle or shipping.

The prices for water sold [url="http://www.lourdeswater.com/bottles.html"]here[/url] seem a bit excessive, but I also don't know the cost of the bottle and shipping. I couldn't find any detail on the website.

I'm still pondering why a wicca would use Catholic holy water when they have ways of blessing their own water. Would they use Catholic holy water as a "last resort" or supplement their own water? I hope that none of them have used it with bad intent.

[Kilroy the Ninja]

[quote name='crusader1234' date='Jan 10 2005, 10:35 PM'] I'm intolerably rude and cruel? [/quote]
no no no...nevermind.


Play nice.

[journeyman]

one of the sellers on E-Bay is a church up in Rhode Island - I believe the write ups are phrased as "donations" for the relics and other blessed items - shipping and handling are not included, but were not outrageously inflated either. Supplemental fund raising for their building fund. According to the pages (and the follow up e-mails), it is run by the parish priest.

[Dreamweaver]

[quote name='journeyman' date='Jan 11 2005, 12:19 AM'] one of the sellers on E-Bay is a church up in Rhode Island - I believe the write ups are phrased as "donations" for the relics and other blessed items - shipping and handling are not included, but were not outrageously inflated either. Supplemental fund raising for their building fund. According to the pages (and the follow up e-mails), it is run by the parish priest. [/quote]
I'm assuming that their selling third class relics? It'd be a new low if a church were selling first and second class relics. I've looked up the policy of selling relics on 2 online stores ([url="http://www.discountcatholicstore.com/new_page_23.htm"]here[/url] and [url="http://www.cukierski.net/sacredrelics.htm"]here[/url]) and it says that only the sale of 1st and 2nd class relics are prohibited, and that the Church permits the selling of 3rd and 4th class ones. I can't find any documentation for this though.

[url="http://archive.salon.com/tech/feature/2001/02/20/relics/print.html"]Here's[/url] a cool story about the [url="http://www.ichrusa.com/"]International Crusade for Holy Relics[/url].

[cathqat]

[quote name='Dreamweaver' date='Jan 11 2005, 12:01 AM'] I'm still pondering why a wicca would use Catholic holy water when they have ways of blessing their own water. [/quote]
I agree, I think that's weird. Maybe it's not just a Wiccan shop though, and other pagan groups (Santeria, maybe?) might want it for something they do.

All the Wiccans I've known would probably spurn Catholic holy water in favor of water they'd blessed themselves. They didn't like any semblence of dependence on Christianity for anything.

[Guest JeffCR07]

The only wiccan I know says she can control time and luck

[cathqat]

[quote name='JeffCR07' date='Jan 11 2005, 02:36 PM'] The only wiccan I know says she can control time and luck [/quote]
Well that must be handy! *LOL*

[Guest JeffCR07]

yea, it would make weekend poker games that much more fun :mischief:

[Dreamweaver]

[quote name='JeffCR07' date='Jan 11 2005, 02:36 PM'] The only wiccan I know says she can control time and luck [/quote]
Wow, that would have been nice the week before finals. What I'd give to have a couple extra hours to study...



And the extra luck wouldn't hurt at all either. After finals, I could go hit the casinos.

[Benedict]

[quote name='Dreamweaver' date='Jan 11 2005, 09:41 PM']Wow, that would have been nice the week before finals. [b]What I'd give to have a couple extra hours to study...[/b]



And the extra luck wouldn't hurt at all either. [b]After finals, I could go hit the casinos.[/b][/quote]
We in the Catholic business call this "selling your soul".

:ph34r:

[Guest JeffCR07]

Dreamweaver is obviously going to Hell, and, more than likely, you are going to Hell for referencing the selling of a soul. I also am now in a state of mortal sin for making such a reference, however, I am on my way to confession. I should, obviously, pray that I make it there because if I were to die in the interum, I would obviously go to Hell, since desire means nothing, just like with Baptism.




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[spathariossa]

[quote name='Benedict' date='Jan 11 2005, 11:36 PM'] We in the Catholic business call this "selling your soul".

:ph34r: [/quote]
I like the quote from CS Lewis. You are a soul, you have a body. Or something like that.

[Q the Ninja]

I don't personally...but that's because I hold we're soul [i]and[/i] body, not one or the other...so many people have forgotten that.........

[crusader1234]

People sell their souls on a daily basis, you can get them back by going to confession, but really every time you sin you're putting your soul in the hands of Satan

[Q the Ninja]

Mortally sin..

[FilmGuy127]

i knew somebody who sold their soul on ebay once... she didnt get very much from it... like 100$ or something...

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='IcePrincessKRS' date='Jan 10 2005, 01:29 AM'] I'm a little confused.... indulgences aren't the same thing as a blessing, correct? Am I just not understanding the passage, because it doesn't seem to say that they lose the blessing, just indulgences, that is if the item carried an indulgence that would get you a Perpetual Indulgence or something it would lose that effect, but would it wipe out the blessing entirely? I'm still struggling with how something that is a sacramental because it's been blessed can become entirely not-sacramental because it has lost the blessing.... can someone explain? [/quote]
"bump" for my question.... just in case someone can answer it.....