Socrates Posted April 23, 2005 Share Posted April 23, 2005 [quote name='hot stuff' date='Apr 23 2005, 06:36 PM'] Let's be clear Crispy. SSAD is not a recognized disorder by the APA. [/quote] It was until the 1970s, when under intense pressure from the homosexual lobby, it dropped homosexuality from its list of mental disorders. This had to do with politics, not science. Today no one can say anything negative about homosexuality without being viciosly attacked by the "gay rights" people. Political correctness, not truth, rules the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted April 23, 2005 Share Posted April 23, 2005 [quote]It was until the 1970s, when under intense pressure from the homosexual lobby, it dropped homosexuality from its list of mental disorders. This had to do with politics, not science.[/quote] Little bit of history for you Socrates. Freud, the Father of Psychology, was the first to diagnose the disorder of Hysteria. Freud coined the term. Hyster means "from the womb". Freud believed and based his diagnosis on the belief that the reason his patients were sick was because they were women. They were ill because they had a uterus. Things have changed a bit since then. It wasn't political correctness that changed psychology's view on women, it was science. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socrates Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 [quote name='hot stuff' date='Apr 23 2005, 06:55 PM'] Little bit of history for you Socrates. Freud, the Father of Psychology, was the first to diagnose the disorder of Hysteria. Freud coined the term. Hyster means "from the womb". Freud believed and based his diagnosis on the belief that the reason his patients were sick was because they were women. They were ill because they had a uterus. Things have changed a bit since then. It wasn't political correctness that changed psychology's view on women, it was science. [/quote] We're discussing homosexuality here, not hysteria, or women. The Church teaches that homosexual attraction is "inherently disordered" and that to act upon it is always sinful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 [quote] We're discussing homosexuality here, not hysteria, or women. The Church teaches that homosexual attraction is "inherently disordered" and that to act upon it is always sinful.[/quote] Yes it does. But it does not teach that it is a psychological disorder. So let's just keep the facts straight shall we? SSAD is a psychological term that is no longer in use by the world of psychology. Since the majority of folks around here who are reading these threads are teenagers, I do not want them misled on issues of the Church or anything else for that matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socrates Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 (edited) [quote name='hot stuff' date='Apr 23 2005, 07:08 PM'] Yes it does. But it does not teach that it is a psychological disorder. So let's just keep the facts straight shall we? SSAD is a psychological term that is no longer in use by the world of psychology. Since the majority of folks around here who are reading these threads are teenagers, I do not want them misled on issues of the Church or anything else for that matter. [/quote] Disordered is disordered. And sexual attraction involves the psyche. It does not matter what any secular psychiatric organization or committee says about it in these "politically correct" times. Edited April 24, 2005 by Socrates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 I have a medical disorder called diabetes. Not all disorders are the same. Not all disorders involve the psyche. And you have a right to your opinion on how the psychological community came up with its reasons to "retire" SSAD. I disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socrates Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 [quote name='hot stuff' date='Apr 23 2005, 08:50 PM'] I have a medical disorder called diabetes. Not all disorders are the same. Not all disorders involve the psyche. And you have a right to your opinion on how the psychological community came up with its reasons to "retire" SSAD. I disagree. [/quote] What's the point of your "argument"? If you agree with the Church that it's a disorder, what's it disorder of? Or are you just playing Littleles-like games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 [quote]If you agree with the Church that it's a disorder, what's it disorder of? Or are you just playing Littleles-like games?[/quote] Kind of a cheap shot don't you think? I actually use facts in my arguments. While I do not argue with Church teaching, people with homosexual desires feel disenfranchised from the Church. People have a tendency to be less than charitable with them and that bugs me. Misinformation about homosexuality only adds feeds that. If we are going to debate the issues. We have to debate the truth and make it clear when we are simply asserting opinions. Why do you take issue with me clarifying things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
track2004 Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 Just $.02 and my psych student clarification. When the DSM was under going large scale revisions in the 1970s SSAD was one of the many things they (the APA) changed. The group got together and decided that people with this 'disorder' were actually leading healthy productive lives and, besides living in a society that disapproves, actually were happy. The APA realized that being gay wasn't the same as being bipolar or paraniod. They also realized that being homosexual, even actively, does not contribute to the mental health of a person; in other words, statistically they couldn't tell the difference between heterosexual and homosexual people in terms of overall mental health. They took Homosexuality out of the DSM. They did however leave in a blanket, sexual identity category so anyone who was homosexual or transgender (which is still in the DSM as I recall) or just confused about it could get his or her insurance to cover the bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 Nice job Track!! That's what I'm talkin about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 no matter how much I absolutely detest this subject, I will make a statement. Please, no one make this personal Dr. Robert Spitzer, the doctor who originally convinced the APA to change its stance on homosexuality in 1973, came out in 2003 after interviewing over 200 people who had been treated by psychologists. He originally had the APA change becuase he was convinced that it was not mentally unhealthy and thus shouldn't be treated, and that it cannot be treated. That was due to studies reported to him. Then he underwent his own intensive study recently, saying he went into it "initially skeptical" but found that reparative therapy does work well. Here are some quotes from his study: [quote]"For the participants in our study, there was no evidence of harm" "Mental health professionals should stop moving in the direction of banning therapy that has as its goal a change in sexual orientation" "Many patients can make a rational choice toward developing their heterosexual potential and minimizing their homosexual attractions." [/quote] That is the guy that originally convinced the APA to change its stance. Now, I know Norma McCorvey ("Roe") isn't too convincing to hard core pro-choicers, so I bet the renowned psychologist Dr. Robert Spitzer wouldn't be convincing for hard core homosexual-normalization advocates. But for reasonable people it at least calls into question the absolute truth to the APA's decision that it is not a psychological disorder. The National Assosiation for the Research and Therapy of Homosexuality ([url="http://www.narth.com/"]NARTH[/url]) has said that 1/3 of the people who come to them have a complete absolute turnaround from homosexual attractiosn to heterosexual attractions, and 1/3 overcome their homsexual attractions as well as all the problems previously assosiated with it, and 1/3 can find a way to commit to chastity. It is simplistic and erroneous to declare that no one has any sort of curable same sex attraction disorder. it is at least curable in some people with same sex attraction. anyway, I stand by Dr. Robert Spitzer in believing homosexuality to be psychologically disordered, mentally harmful, and cureable through correct, sensative, and scientific means (not by throwing a Bible at the person) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 Aloysius You make a great point. However why do you detest this subject? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 you have Diabetes disorder, I have same sex attraction disorder. we'll make a deal, I won't call you a diabetian if you don't call me a homosexual anyway, that's why I don't like talking about it. too much of a personal struggle. publicizing it only gives it a more forceful control over my identity and image. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 See that is exactly why I get so grumpy when people state conjecture as fact. I know that there must be people reading these threads who are struggling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted April 24, 2005 Share Posted April 24, 2005 I was fine with Socrates. Though I am not as cynical about the APA's original decision, I do believe it wrong and do believe it to be a disorder. so anyway then, how come no one posted the link of the anti-thesis"dignity" (their definition of dignity is actually the deadly sin of pride) : COURAGE [url="http://www.couragerc.net"]http://www.couragerc.net[/url] [img]http://www.couragerc.net/images/facts.gif[/img] soooo... look at the time... I should prolly hit the ol' dusty trail now... :ninja vanish: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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