jabs at Catholicism

[Socrates]

[quote name='FilmGuy127' date='Jun 28 2005, 08:08 PM']I would say the opposite. I think i have seen more catholics bashing other religions than the other way around. This is especially on this site. I see a lot of people talking about the catholic church being the only church with the "truth" and though this may be the belief, that does not make it a fact. Many times it seems to me that people are knocking down other religions because they dont have the "truth".  That may be your belief and you are entitled to it. But, It feels like to me that there is not a whole lot of respect for alternate beliefs and a lot of these other beliefs get bashed by catholics because their belief does not allow for there to be alternate equally valid beliefs.
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FilmGuy, what do you believe about the Catholic Faith? Do you believe it is the One True Faith revealed to us by God through His Only Begotten Son, Jesus Christ, or do you beleive it is just one of many religions, with no more rightful claim to truth than any other belief system?

As Catholics we beleive ours is the One True Church and source of all Salvation. Therefore, it is charitable to try to lead others to the Faith. (I know this probably sounds weird to modern ears.) This does not justify uncharity towards or "bashing" people of other religions, but arguing the truth of the Faith against other beliefs is not the same as "bashing" others.

All religions or belief systems cannot logically be equally valid. Their claims contradict one another. A Catholic does not believe the same as a Baptist who does not believe the same as a Muslim who does not believe the same as an atheist. All cannot be true. If you claim that all beleifs are equally true or valid (relativism), then you are really saying that you don't believe any are true, including Catholicism, or that they are all only partially true.

To take religion at all seriously, one must beleive that the truth of one's religious beleifs is important. To say otherwise is to say that religion doesn't really matter.

[sweetpea316]

I hear a lot of it personally, especially because I'm not Catholic (but possibly on the road to it) and have grown up around Catholic-bashers. I mean, lots of it isn't anything hardcore and ruthless, but just little things I pick up on. Like, saying stupid stereotypical things and cracking lame jokes and whatnot. And just the other day at work, I heard some guys talking about religion in general, and then proceeded to make tacky comments about Catholicism, and said "Well no one here is Catholic and would take offense so..." but little did they know, I did. Anyways, I think it is evident all around, just maybe in some locations and stuff more than others.

[Mikhail]

I didn't read the whole thread, but I just want to say this. The only reason it seems that Catholics are the brunt of more abuse than others is because you are Catholic. Believe me, everyone gets it, although some less than others.

As for free speech, there are certain things we can't say, yes, but maybe complete free speech is not a good thing. In their own homes yes, but not in public.

[sweetpea316]

[quote name='Mikhail' date='Jun 28 2005, 09:26 PM']The only reason it seems that Catholics are the brunt of more abuse than others is because you are Catholic.
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Hmm, I understand the point you're making, but I dunno... I am not Catholic but I hear more jabs at Catholics than most other religions or groups of any kind. But then again, its true, there are other confounding factors that you have to take into consideration... I mean, I'm from a Lutheran family and church, so of course I'm gonna hear more than someone who is Catholic themselves. But I see what you're getting at. God bless.

[FilmGuy127]

response to socrates:

Oh I agree that it is quite impossible to believe that all religions have the truth. But my belief that my religion has the whole truth and that any other religion only has some fractured part of the truth doesn't mean that the other religions belief that they posses the whole truth is any less valid. I believe I have the truth. My hypothetical hindu friend believes he has the truth. My belief says he is wrong and his me. But my belief does not make his belief any less valid or vise versa. We both believe our version is the truth but in the end neither can know for certain. If we knew for certain why would we need faith? So, I think that as long as that is his belief I should respect it, even if i think he is wrong. I can tell him my belief, what i think, and why. Even tell him i think he should believe the same as me. But i think that i owe his belief a certain amount of respect. And what i was saying earlier is that i dont think there is a lot of respect for people with a diffrent belief on pm or in the world as a whole for that matter.

[Mikhail]

Yes, I agree we need to respect everyone's beliefs. I also believe it is impossible to achieve 100% truth because that would be equal to being perfect. There are always things we can improve on. However, I think we can be sure that our truth is true. Faith is where we believe something that can't be proved. It is when we know for sure.

[Didacus]

[quote name='FilmGuy127' date='Jun 28 2005, 10:56 PM']response to socrates:

[ snip]for that matter.
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A quick way to discern weither someone is respectfully objecting to a religion or attacking disrespectfuly a person is to look at the core of what is being said and see if it is aimed at a person, or at the religion itself.

What I am referring to in this thread a personnal attacks upon individuals, and not critics of a particular religion. A statement saying "All catholics are ignorant." is aimed at the individuals taking part in the religion, another statement "Catholicism is filled with ignorant ideas." is not and leaves room for the individual to be respected.

However, I understand your point and must admit the shinobi flows both ways at times. Personally, I must disagree with you, as I think the shinobi flows towards catholics a lot more nowadays, and that has been a growing tendency for an entire generation as far as I reckon.

[Semalsia]

Oppression is quite a strong word for just rude, ignorant and spiteful comments, don't you think? I mean, it's not like catholics were fearing for their health, occupation or freedom on a national level. And is it not the catholics who are trying to eradicate certain group of people from the society? Who's oppressing who?

[Didacus]

[quote name='Semalsia' date='Jun 29 2005, 02:56 PM']Oppression is quite a strong word for just rude, ignorant and spiteful comments, don't you think? I mean, it's not like catholics were fearing for their health, occupation or freedom on a national level. And is it not the catholics who are trying to eradicate certain group of people from the society? Who's oppressing who?
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I said it was quickly becoming, not that it was.

And these days... the catholics definately have the short end of the stick... and though the stick ain't pouding our heads in the ground yet... seems to be coming...

Read an article not too long ago about a christian priest who spoke his church's views on homosexuality in B.C. (British columbia, not birth control), and he was arrested and charged for hate speech.

If a protestant denomination is starting to have trouble speaking its 'truth' by fear of being arrested, what about the catholics who actually hold an even stricter doctrine?

It might not be here jsut yet... but it is in the making.

[Socrates]

[quote name='Didacus' date='Jun 29 2005, 03:02 PM']I said it was quickly becoming, not that it was.

And these days... the catholics definately have the short end of the stick... and though the stick ain't pouding our heads in the ground yet... seems to be coming...

Read an article not too long ago about a christian priest who spoke his church's views on homosexuality in B.C. (British columbia, not birth control), and he was arrested and charged for hate speech.

If a protestant denomination is starting to have trouble speaking its 'truth' by fear of being arrested, what about the catholics who actually hold an even stricter doctrine?

It might not be here jsut yet... but it is in the making.
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The existance of "hate speech" laws is clear proof that we are becoming an Orwellian society!

[Semperviva]

quote from www.thereturncurve.blogspot.com:



"I have been thinking about conversions recently. A visiting priest, the witty, reverent, and traditional Fr. Fasano (the spelling may not be correct), gave an awesome homily in honor of the Feast of the Conversion of St. Paul. (As Dr. Fahey said with all his habitual wryness, "This is an occasion of gladness for many, as today the Old and new calendars agree for once.") Fr. Fasano spoke about someone who had asked him to make him a Catholic on his deathbed, and mentioned several of the many other people who have done so as well, like John Wayne, and Mae West ("I may not be able to live like a Catholic, but I sure can die as one.") [b]"Somehow," Father mused, "No one ever seems to be siezed with a sudden longing to die a Methodist, or a Unitarian. No, when they think of death, they think of coming home, and they wish to come home to the Church."[/b]

Edited June 29, 2005 by Semperviva

[Socrates]

[quote name='Semperviva' date='Jun 29 2005, 03:43 PM']quote from www.thereturncurve.blogspot.com:
"I have been thinking about conversions recently. A visiting priest, the witty, reverent, and traditional Fr. Fasano (the spelling may not be correct), gave an awesome homily in honor of the Feast of the Conversion of St. Paul. (As Dr. Fahey said with all his habitual wryness, "This is an occasion of gladness for many, as today the Old and new calendars agree for once.") Fr. Fasano spoke about someone who had asked him to make him a Catholic on his deathbed, and mentioned several of the many other people who have done so as well, like John Wayne, and Mae West ("I may not be able to live like a Catholic, but I sure can die as one.") [b]"Somehow," Father mused, "No one ever seems to be siezed with a sudden longing to die a Methodist, or a Unitarian. No, when they think of death, they think of coming home, and they wish to come home to the Church."[/b]
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It appears the author of that blog went to my Alma Mater. How'd you learn of that blog?

[Semperviva]

[quote name='Socrates' date='Jun 29 2005, 04:14 PM']It appears the author of that blog went to my Alma Mater.  How'd you learn of that blog?
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i dunno whose blog it is, Soc