Domestic Violence

[Lil Red]

please explain your responses.

[tojo]

[quote name='Lil Red' date='Oct 24 2005, 02:58 PM']please explain your responses.
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I said no, but I suppose he could resort to violence if she were trying to kill the kids or something....

[scardella]

He could in self-defense; ie she's attacking him, and he's doing the minimum to stop her from killing/maiming him.

Edited October 24, 2005 by scardella

[jasJis]

No. Never.
No hitting by either one is acceptable. No slapping, poking, kicking, pinching, shoving, etc.
Not acceptable, not allowable. If it happens, both should go to counseling, as a couple. It takes 2 to tango, but hitting has no justification. Hitting is a symptom of deeper problems, that's why counseling for both is important.
I grew up, fighting with my sisters. They can dish it as well as take it, but that's kids. After 22+ years of marriage, my wife and I have never shoved or poked each other. Don't open the door and you don't have to worry about it getting to wide.

[photosynthesis]

in self defense.

[scardella]

Has anyone seen McClintock? What about a situation/solution like that?

[Carrie]

[quote name='jasJis' date='Oct 24 2005, 04:21 PM']No.  Never. 
No hitting by either one is acceptable.  No slapping, poking, kicking, pinching, shoving, etc.
Not acceptable, not allowable.  If it happens, both should go to counseling, as a couple.  It takes 2 to tango, but hitting has no justification.  Hitting is a symptom of deeper problems, that's why counseling for both is important.
I grew up, fighting with my sisters.  They can dish it as well as take it, but that's kids.  After 22+ years of marriage, my wife and I have never shoved or poked each other.  Don't open the door and you don't have to worry about it getting to wide.
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100% agreed.

If there is a conflict in the marriage/relationship, there are countless other ways to address it.

Hitting is never ever acceptable by either party. It does nothing but cause severe damage both physically and emotionally.

[Jaime]

You don't hit women.


That's about it.

[Myles Domini]

I voted no because when people talk about hitting their wives it connotes dometic abuse, which is unnacceptable particularly in light of Ephesian 5 and 1 Peter 3 etc. The wife is the icon of the Church, Christ gave up his life for the Church and does not scorn the confessions of penintents inspite of our constant sins. Nothing warrants the physical abuse of the covenant partner. Nothing is further from God's design for this sacred sacrament.

Lawful self-defence falls into a different category. However, it must be noted that for self-defence to be lawful you must use proportionate force. If you're stronger than your wife and she slaps you it doesnt give you warrant to slap her back if you know you're palm strikes more firmly than hers. If the chances of proportionate force are nil then either get out of the way or take it like a man--indeed the former would be my advice even if she were coming at you with a kitchen knife.

[Cow of Shame]

*sings*

Smack her down again, paw...smack her down again....




old song from the ....20's? I think...

[toledo_jesus]

If she's attacking him or the children, then yes.

If she attacks him with intent to kill or maim only. If she attacks kids with intent to hurt, spanking of course distinguished from hurting (smacking a kid [responsibly and with consistency] doesn't hurt them, it feeds into their sense of immanent justice. Nuance can come later ).

Rough situation. Of course, if it's gotten to that point one should probably be examining her mental history or one's own behavior as husband.

[dspen2005]

you are asking the question in a vacuum.... but you can't.....

[toledo_jesus]

[quote name='dspen2005' date='Oct 24 2005, 10:41 PM']you are asking the question in a vacuum.... but you can't.....
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more vacuums...

[Cow of Shame]

one would assume that a (typically larger) male could subdue a (typically smaller) female without needing to resort to violence in most cases

Edited October 25, 2005 by Cow of Shame

[ofpheritup]

[quote name='hot stuff' date='Oct 24 2005, 02:45 PM']You don't hit women. 
That's about it.
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In self defense oh you'd better believe you do.

The fist that is beating you doesn't belong to "a man or a woman" it is a FIST, at the end of the arm of a BULLY. It shouldn't matter who it is attached to. If a woman feels she has the right to hit you then you have the right to defend yourself.

Bullying is not a gender issue, it is a violence issue.

[Jaime]

nope

Don't hit women.

[scardella]

Ok, since none of you have apparently watched McClintock... here's what happens...

It's set circa 1890 in the western territories. GW McClintock was a cattle baron and owned much of the town of McClintock. His wife had been for the past 2 years separated from her husband. She's been a prima donna out east, but when she is around, she browbeats everyone, particularly Mr. McClintock. In the course of the film, it shows that she sees GW in what she assumes is an amorous relationship, but it isn't. Her self-righteousness is shown to be hollow when it reveals that she's actually having some sort of relationship w/ another man (the governor ot the territory). After McClintock learns of it, he winds up chasing her through town and spanking her publicly. The sentiment was that order in the relationship was restored as well as the relationship itself.

Comments?

BTW, I think we need a clearer understanding of what y'all mean by "domestic violence." Are we talking about beating your wife b/c she complains about something (bruises, broken bones, bloody)? Any sort of physical correction (ie slap on wrist, spanking)? Does self-defense count? It seems like you might include any or all in the understanding of "domestic violence."

Edited October 25, 2005 by scardella

[ofpheritup]

[quote name='Myles' date='Oct 24 2005, 03:02 PM']If the chances of proportionate force are nil then either get out of the way or take it like a man--indeed the former would be my advice even if she were coming at you with a kitchen knife.
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My friend tried that, he tried getting out of the way,
so she stabbed him in the back. He is dead and she is in prison.
The children are now living with their grandparents.

Forgive me I need to ask, any other bright ideas?

Take it like a man? What the CENSORED does that mean?

Violence is Violence....Hello are we on here?

Men can and do die as easily as women. Why is it that we seem to value (protect) women more? We are a nation of hypocrites. This is why society is as screwed up as it is, there are two sets of rules. Men don't seem to stand a chance.

Edited October 25, 2005 by ofpheritup

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='scardella' date='Oct 25 2005, 11:04 AM']Ok, since none of you have apparently watched McClintock... here's what happens...

It's set circa 1890 in the western territories.  GW McClintock was a cattle baron and owned much of the town of McClintock.  His wife had been for the past 2 years separated from her husband.  She's been a prima donna out east, but when she is around, she browbeats everyone, particularly Mr. McClintock.  In the course of the film, it shows that she sees GW in what she assumes is an amorous relationship, but it isn't.  Her self-righteousness is shown to be hollow when it reveals that she's actually having some sort of relationship w/ another man (the governor ot the territory).  After McClintock learns of it, he winds up chasing her through town and spanking her publicly.  The sentiment was that order in the relationship was restored as well as the relationship itself.

Comments?
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several different comments.
-I love that movie.
-there is a line between rough play and violence in a relationship. the line must be well defined.
-some women [and some men] deliberately provoke a fight which results in a physical altercation, then play victim.
-My ex-husband tried to hit me. twice. Both times I put him into a wall. we were not playing and it was a breaking point in our relationship.

Edited October 25, 2005 by cmotherofpirl

[toledo_jesus]

[quote name='ofpheritup' date='Oct 25 2005, 12:58 PM']My friend tried that, he tried getting out of the way,
so she stabbed him in the back. He is dead and she is in prison.
The children are now living with their grandparents.

Forgive me I need  to ask, any other bright ideas?

Take it like a man? What the CENSORED  does that mean?

Violence is Violence....Hello are we on here?

Men can and do die as easily as women. Why is it that we seem to value (protect)  women more?  We are a nation of hypocrites.  This is why society is as screwed up as it is, there are two sets of rules.  Men don't seem to stand a chance.
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exactly. Women can use deadly force.

In fact, female police shoot more often than male. Wanna know why? there is something called intermediate force, and women are less able to use it. It is harder for a woman to subdue a 200 pound man, and so she is more apt to use her gun. go figure.

If a woman is coming at you with a knife, you don't "take it like a man." That's suicide, in my opinion. You hit her in her face until she goes down or until she gets you.

That being said, I do think that women need to be protected. However, if a woman is a danger to you, then you don't need to protect her...protect yourself.

Do we need to talk about Lorena Bobbitt?