being divorced

[dairygirl4u2c]

ty

[Sojourner]

Funny .... I just had lunch with a dear friend last week who is in this exact situation. He will probably end up remarrying. And I'll rejoice for him when that happens.

[Paladin]

As I understand canon law, you couldn't marry. Even if your separated spouse did remarry, your sacramental union still stands. It seems harsh, and we must show compassion and charity for people in such cases, but you can't dissolve a sacrament.

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote]Funny .... I just had lunch with a dear friend last week who is in this exact situation. He will probably end up remarrying. And I'll rejoice for him when that happens.[/quote]

So you'll rejoice in his mortal sin? Even if he's not Catholic or accountable for whatever reason, he's still sinning.
You are aware that that would essentially involve living in mortal sin?

[quote]As I understand canon law, you couldn't marry. Even if your separated spouse did remarry, your sacramental union still stands. It seems harsh, and we must show compassion and charity for people in such cases, but you can't dissolve a sacrament.[/quote]
Does it only seem harsh or is it actually harsh?
Do you hesitate to call or harsh because living in truth is not harsh per se but can be tough aka maybe "harsh"?
or I can sort of understand the rationale, but at least have the cajones to say it's harsh...
or in your case, ovaries..

Edited March 7, 2006 by dairygirl4u2c

[Aloysius]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Mar 6 2006, 09:25 PM']Funny .... I just had lunch with a dear friend last week who is in this exact situation. He will probably end up remarrying. And I'll rejoice for him when that happens.
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if your friend cannot get an annulment, it would be a sin to remarry and cannot present himself for holy communion.

marriage is forever, even if one partner decides to "end" it. the two remain married and nothing can tear it apart except death.

annulment means there never was a marriage in the first place. if there was a valid marriage, remarrying is impossible and mortally sinful (the second marriage would be invalid and the two would be committing adultery).

[Paladin]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Mar 6 2006, 10:21 PM']Does it only seem harsh or is it actually harsh?
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Binding to a Christ-given sacrament only seems harsh to our human intellect. If the Godhead gave it to us, it is good and we are bound to it. I can't see sacraments as being harsh.

[track2004]

There are a million other circumstances that would dictate getting remarried, not just my spouse leaving and not coming back. So I don't know. It depends on a lot of things and most importantly finding someone I'd be willing to marry.

[Ash Wednesday]

If that happened to me, I would never want to marry again. I'm not one to date just anyone, so I'd probably not be able and willing to place my trust in another soul anyway. After such an experience I would probably prefer to spend the rest of my life in solitude with God.

[cmotherofpirl]

You don't know if you have grounds for annullment until you discuss it with a priest.

[Aloysius]

yep.

But assuming there are no grounds for annulment remarrying would be a mortal sin.

[thessalonian]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Mar 6 2006, 08:25 PM']Funny .... I just had lunch with a dear friend last week who is in this exact situation. He will probably end up remarrying. And I'll rejoice for him when that happens.
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Having been in an unapproved marriage for a couple of years, that I later had validated in the Church, in retrospect I would have to say, at least from my experience, your rejoicing is ill-advised. I got in to the situation because I was not living my faith. While I was in the situation, my soul was not at rest and right with God. Had I died during this time I do not have great confidence in my eternal outcome. In fact I would be surprized if I would not have ended up with the damned from the struggles that were going on within me. I definitely put myself in danger for eternity over "happiness" in this life. I have to believe it is similar for any Catholic who is in such a relationship. Fortunately for me God was patient with me and gave me the grace to rise above the situation and eventually get it all resolved. Some are not that lucky I am sure. Kirby Pucket, who was Catholic, has had considerable turmoil in his life and was getting remarried before he died yesterday. I hope his soul was not in the state mine was in during a similar time in my life.


My recommendation is that if you know someone heading in to this situation you pray for them as if they are going to hell. I am grateful to my family who let it be known that they did not approve of what I was doing and prayed for me. There are alot of complicating circumstances in my situation that I will not detail. But the fact is my soul was in grave danger. Sin pit it there.
Blessings

Edited March 7, 2006 by thessalonian

[Quietfire]

As someone who is...
A. in the process of being received in the Church and...
B. currently married to a Catholic that was civilly divorced...

I know precisely what Thess is speaking of above.

My soul is not at rest.

I pray that everything works out well, but until then I know that I am currently living in adultery.
This is one of my many personal issues that I spoke of on another forum here, something that I have to work out with the grace of God and help from the Church, which I have been assured that I would receive.

My husband supports me in wanting to be received in the Church, but as far as him pursuing an annulment...thats another story.

[thessalonian]

You have my prayes, for him as well that he will see the importance of it. My wife at one time did not want to go through it all other. Praise God he moved her to it. God's grace is there for you on your journey which is not always easy.

[Quietfire]

Thank you Thess.

He's actually come quite far considering what he's been through, more than I really need to get into here, so I give him alot of credit and patience.
He is definitely not afraid to discuss this with me, we spent a good hour last night over this.
I have spent time talking with a Sister from my parish who is preparing me for entrance and she's given me another option so I dont have to wait for him to persue an annulment. I think though, that I would only consider it as a last resort. Somehow I feel if I choose it (at least right now, in my mind) then I am saying that I dont have that trust in my husband and that also, in some small way, I am leaving him behind.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' date='Mar 7 2006, 06:27 AM']If that happened to me, I would never want to marry again. I'm not one to date just anyone, so I'd probably not be able and willing to place my trust in another soul anyway. After such an experience I would probably prefer to spend the rest of my life in solitude with God.
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ash usually sums it up best! :

[Amator Veritatis]

I am not aware of the divorce laws in America or anywhere else for that matter, but as far as I understand, the party against which a suit of divorce has been brought is required at least to consent to the divorce. Am I correct? If this is the case, the person has the option of never consenting to the divorce initially. As far as the situation posed, and assuming that both parties need not consent, as has already been stated, to remarry would be a mortal sin. Even a widow (or a widower) is better served remaining in unmarried simply because it is a higher state, as is attested by Our Lord Himself, Saint Paul and every Saint who spoke on the matter. The person who is in such a position ought to offer whatever his sufferings may be to God in reparation for his sins and for the penalties due to them. He should accept his cross and recognise that the chaste life is more pleasing to God and more conducive to perfection. Consequently, he should live a life of solitude and prayer, growing in virtue and the love of God.

[Socrates]

Christ Himself condemns divorce and remarriage.

[quote]"It was said also, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement: but I say unto you, that every one that putteth away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, maketh her an adulteress: and whosoever shall marry her when she is put away committeth adultery" (Matt. 5:31-32).

"And there came unto him Pharisees, trying him, and saying, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered and said, Have ye not read, that he who made them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife; and the two shall become one flesh? So that they are no more two, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why then did Moses command to give a bill of divorcement, and to put her away? He saith unto them, Moses for your hardness of heart suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it hath not been so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and he that marrieth her when she is put away committeth adultery" (Matt. 19:3-9).

"And there came unto him Pharisees, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? trying him. And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you? And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away. But Jesus said unto them, For your hardness of heart he wrote you this commandment. But from the beginning of the creation, Male and female made he them. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife; and the two shall become one flesh: so that they are no more two, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. And in the house the disciples asked him again of this matter. And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her: and if she herself shall put away her husband, and marry another, she committeth adultery" (Mark 10:2-12).

"Every one that putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and he that marrieth one that is put away from a husband committeth adultery" (Luke 16:18). [/quote]

[Paladin]

Now there is such a thing as a civil divorce, and the Church does recognize that. Say you have a man that's become abusive and refuses to get any treatment for it. The wife would be prudent to separate and seek a legal divorce. But, just because you're not married under state law doesn't mean you're not married under ecclesastical law. So she'd remain a wife to the abusive husband in the Church's eyes, but for civil purposes, she'd be single.

[musturde]

Okay that makes no sense tho. Sorry if I don't understand this but how on earth can you not be on grounds for annulment if your wife left you and remmarried. That doesn't make sense. If she's cheating on you, that doesn't qualify divorce? Seriously, i think a priest would be OUT OF HIS MIND if he was to say that this isn't on the grounds of annulment... Would these two people really be meant to be in Gods eyes if one of them refuses to stay with the other? Wouldn't that qualify for annulment in itself? I just can't understand this, can someone explain it. I have a feeling the Church is far more compassionate than this.

[dairygirl4u2c]

If you were to take the quotes by soc, and disregard the CCs teaching and christian norms, much like social norms, I'm not sure those passages say all remarriages are bad. I'm not just talkin about those that happen to be annullable. I mean the fact Jesus said who ever puts away his wife, who ever divorces the spouse is the one who did bad. The one who decided to leave.
But I honestly don't have much of a stand on this. Just thought I'd throw that out there food for thought.