How St. Teresa Led Me Away From God As A Child.

[Budge]

Isnt today her feast day?

When i was young, a relative bought me an old book called

[i]A Story of A Soul[/i], I read this book while very young.

In many ways it led me away from God. I will explain.


[img]http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0935216588.01._AA240_SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg[/img]


Remembering this book I realized that Teresa was a loving girl who sought God, but from todays perspective, I know she was given a false god. She did not know the comfort of the Holy Spirit. She had no inkling of truth in Jesus Christ or of Gods Word.

She spoke often of God as bringing her suffering and how her suffering would save her. In fact as I read this book as a youngster--I think I was around 8-10 or so, I found myself thinking God is an ogre. How could He be so cruel to Teresa? One sees in her book even the horrible Catholic outcome of people turning to Mary for comfort and solace, while God brings nothing but suffering. In fact in the first chapter she entrusts her book to "my darling Mother" [who of course is Mary}

Like so many of these saints, they have communion with a false jesus that tells them to make themselves as victims and seek their salvation through their own suffering and works rather then trusting in Jesus Christ. Rather then trusting in the promises of the Bible where we are promised life more abundantly through Jesus Christ and joy....many of these saints seek after their own suffering led by a false Jesus.

Just read this from a writing about St. Teresa...

[quote]
"On 9 June of the same year 1895, the feast of the Blessed Trinity, she received a very special grace during Mass, and[font="System"] felt within herself an urge to offer herself as a holocaust victim to Merciful Love. After Mass she took me with her to mother prioress; she seemed beside herself and did not say a word.When we found Mother Agnes, for it was she who was then prioress, she asked her if both of us could offer ourselves as victims to Merciful Love, and gave her a short explanation of what that meant.[/font] Mother Agnes was at a loss; she did not seem to understand too well what was going on, but she had such confidence in Sister Thérèse's discretion that she gave her full permission. It was then that she composed the act called 'An Offering to Love', which she carried next to her heart ever afterwards."[/quote]


[url="http://www.ewtn.com/therese/readings/readng4.htm"]LINK[/url]

Consider how this is a twisted presentation of Gods love...Gods Love does not destroy it heals. This is an example of Teresa being in delusion from a false spirit leading her away from the true nature of God.

[quote]In order to live in one single act of perfect Love, I OFFER MYSELF AS A VICTIM OF HOLOCAUST TO YOUR MERCIFUL LOVE, Asking You to consume me incessantly, allowing the waves of infinite tenderness shut up within You to overflow into my soul, and that thusI may become a martyr of Your Love, O my God!
[/quote]

Looking to her own sufferings over and over....

Refusing to kill flies that hovered over her while she was ill.

From Mother Agnes's notes

[quote][font="System"]The flies tormented her, but she wouldn't kill them: "I always give them freedom. They alone have caused me misery during my sickness.[/font] I have no enemies, and since God recommends that we pardon our enemies, I'm happy to find this opportunity for doing so."[/quote]

[quote]"[font="System"]I have found happiness and joy on earth, but solely in suffering, for I've suffered very much here below; you must make it known to souls . . . "Since my First Communion, since the time I asked Jesus to change all the consolations of this earth into bitterness for me, I had a perpetual desire to suffer.*[/font][/quote]

[link=www.ewtn.com/therese/readings/readng9.htm]www.ewtn.com/therese/readings/readng9.htm[/link]


So as I read this book on Teresas life, as a young child, I found myself led away from God. I saw a young seemingly nice girl loved by her parents, who was literally being *tortured* by God. This was one thing that led me to atheism at a very young age. I in fact remember reading this book with a sense of horror and thinking I could never love a god like that. {I am sure some of this early discernment was related to the fact that God knew I was to be written in the book of life.}

In fact I remember crying over this girl, and what happened to her.

This is just one example of one Catholic "saint" led into deceptions byt the false Christ taught in Catholcism.

But St. Teresa follows many of the same paths they take...

1. False attributes of God, contrary to His Word.

2. Seeking salvation or salvation of others by their own suffering.


There is nothing of this...

[size=2]Mat 11:30 For my yoke [is] easy, and my burden is light.[/size]

Jesus brings a person life MORE ABUNDANTLY.

The true Jesus does not order an ill girl to let flies crawl all over her.

Edited October 1, 2006 by Budge

[Fides_et_Ratio]

Wow... you've done a great job of misrepresenting and misinterpreting St. Therese.

"The Story of a Soul" is about love, not being tortured by God. I can't imagine you actually having READ the book and coming away with such a notion.

[Theoketos]

Jesus brings a person life MORE ABUNDANTLY.

Amen.

SO that when we suffer our life is not hell, but a way away from hell. ß

[Budge]

So you think its normal for a young girl to let flies crawl all over her?

[Fides_et_Ratio]

[quote]"They are my only enemies, and since the good God has urged us to love our enemies I am glad to have this opportunity. Let them be."[/quote]

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='Budge' post='1080779' date='Oct 1 2006, 02:19 PM']
So you think its normal for a young girl to let flies crawl all over her?
[/quote]
Does that have anything to do with it?

[Budge]

Read the quote above.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

I have read it...again...how is that relevant? You seem to use that to accuse her of seeing God as a tormentor, and yet the same quote says, "they alone have caused me misery during my sickness," meaning that God has not caused her any misery, but only flies.

Your argument just jumped from claiming that she saw God as a tormentor to claiming that she was a silly girl for allowing flies to live. What exactly is your point?

Edited October 1, 2006 by Raphael

[Laudate_Dominum]

gee budge, your post makes me wonder about your reading comprehension. I suppose its a good thing you didn't read the Bible when you were a kid, you would likely have seen little more than an ogre God who took pleasure in torturing and killing his own son. Heck, reading the Bible it seems common for God's most faithful servants (e.g., the prophets) to be tortured and killed (stoned, sawed in two, thrown headlong, etc), and all the asceticism would no doubt have seemed cruel and unusual; and what about those poor apostles? Ship wrecked, stoned to death, tortured, imprisoned, even crucified all because they were trying to serve God; how terribly cruel and savage.
And it's a good thing that you were no doubt ignorant of the remainder of Christian history, the lives of innumerable saints and so forth, sheer barbarism.

Lucky for you that there are modern heretics who preach a feel good gospel.

[Mary-Kathryn]

Budge,

I will not play your game since you are not truly interested in answers. Your interest is in getting people defensive as you twist things around. Then you sit back and enjoy as you watch the mess explode around you. Not worth the effort on this beautiful day. I will strongly suggest an excellent study edition of this book.

St. Therese of Lisieux
Story of a Soul
Translation by John Clarke O.C.D.
Study Editon Prepared by Marc Foley OCD

It can be purchased by ICS publications [I do not work there but its where I got it] or perhaps at another book store.


"......I cried out: O Jesus, my Love...my vocation, at last I have found it...MY VOCATION IS LOVE"
Saint Therese of Lisieux
[from book above pg 302]

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1080807' date='Oct 1 2006, 01:47 PM']
gee budge, your post makes me wonder about your reading comprehension. I suppose its a good thing you didn't read the Bible when you were a kid, you would likely have seen little more than an ogre God who took pleasure in torturing and killing his own son. Heck, reading the Bible it seems common for God's most faithful servants (e.g., the prophets) to be tortured and killed (stoned, sawed in two, thrown headlong, etc), and all the asceticism would no doubt have seemed cruel and unusual; and what about those poor apostles? Ship wrecked, stoned to death, tortured, imprisoned, even crucified all because they were trying to serve God; how terribly cruel and savage.
And it's a good thing that you were no doubt ignorant of the remainder of Christian history, the lives of innumerable saints and so forth, sheer barbarism.

Lucky for you that there are modern heretics who preach a feel good gospel.
[/quote]

Amen, L_D!
very well put

[Guest Rick777]

Wow! I've never seen anyone so misinterpret something before...and that's saying alot. I think maybe you need to read this book again...hopefully it will lead you to Christ and the Church he founded for you.

You say she did not know the comfort of the Holy Spirit? In her first chapter she writes," Then, just as when I was a child I cried: My God I choose all. I do not want to be a saint by halves. I am not afraid to suffer for you. I fear only one thing- that I should keep my own will. So take it, for I choose all that you will." Forgive me but this sounds like a child who very much has found comfort in the Holy Spirit. When St. Therese says that she is going to, "entrust the story of my soul to you, my darling Mother" she is speaking to her eldest sister Pauline. Just another thing that you misinterpreted.

I'm not sure why you felt sorry for her...she herself says, " I have now reached a stage in my life when I can glance back at the past, for my soul has matured in a crucible of inner and external trials. Now, like a flower braced by a storm, I can raise my head and see that the words of the Psalmist have been fulfilled in me: The Lord is my shepard; how can I lack anything? He gives me a resting place where there is green pasture, leads me out to the cool water's brink, refreshed and content...dark be the valley about my path, but I fear none while He is with me. For me, the Lord has always been pitying and gracious, patient and rich in mercy."

As for the flies...she was 24 years old when she "allowed the flies to live." Hardly a little girl.

Edited October 1, 2006 by Rick777

[Budge]

[quote]ee budge, your post makes me wonder about your reading comprehension. I suppose its a good thing you didn't read the Bible when you were a kid, you would likely have seen little more than an ogre God who took pleasure in torturing and killing his own son. [u]Heck, reading the Bible it seems common for God's most faithful servants (e.g., the prophets) to be tortured and killed (stoned, sawed in two, thrown headlong, etc), and all the asceticism would no doubt have seemed cruel and unusual; [/u]and what about those poor apostles? Ship wrecked, stoned to death, tortured, imprisoned, even crucified all because they were trying to serve God; how terribly cruel and savage.[/quote]

Suffering for a purpose for the gospel is different then suffering needlessly...

ie a person goes without food to feed another, a person is beaten and stoned for preaching the gospel.


Jesus died on the cross for us, to keep us from suffering being lost in hell. It was done out of love.

The problem is that Catholicism with its work based gospel teaches people to seek suffering for its own sake. This is done out of pride, and looking to oneself and one's own suffering for salvation.


[img]http://www.portugal-ferien.net/Fatima_2a.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.odan.org/images/cilice_2004.jpg[/img]

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Budge' post='1080831' date='Oct 1 2006, 01:08 PM']
The problem is that Catholicism with its work based gospel teaches people to seek suffering for its own sake. This is done out of pride, and looking to oneself and one's own suffering for salvation.
[/quote]
This statement makes me question whether or not you actually read Story of a Soul. I'll give you one guess as to why St. Therese (a cloistered Carmellite) is patroness of missions. Need some clues?

[Guest Rick777]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' post='1080833' date='Oct 1 2006, 01:11 PM']
This statement makes me question whether or not you actually read Story of a Soul. I'll give you one guess as to why St. Therese (a cloistered Carmellite) is patroness of missions. Need some clues?
[/quote]

Personally, I think Budge may have just scanned some of the first chapter online and then read a biography of her...

[tonyofpadua]

Budge,

I cannot speak for the church, and I cannot speak for my other brothers and sisters here, but I can speak for myself.

[u]Story of a Soul[/u] changed my life, and brought me into a closer relationship with Jesus than any other book that I have ever read. The fact that you would make such an outlandish claim using superfluous arguments about flies is insulting to me, especially on her feast day.

I have respectfully read and considered what are now countless debates on this board that you have started with seemingly no other intention than to rile people up. And while I've bitten my toungue to the point of bleeding, the fact that you state that a loving, innocent, and all-together holy young woman has led people away from the Christ is an insult to her, me, and I'm sure other people.

Budge, I know that this post won't make you change your mind, and I respect your efforts to convert/expose people on this phorum to new ideas, but I think you could take a page from St. Therese when she says:

"[b]Without love, deeds, even the most brilliant, count as nothing.[/b]"

If I were you I would consider reading her masterwork again, as I doubt a young kid of 8-10 (as you state you were at the time) could fully wrap their mind around such brilliance. It's understandable how a child, even a brilliant one, could misinterpret her words as something else.

[quote]Like so many of these saints, they have communion with a false jesus that tells them to make themselves as victims and seek their salvation through their own suffering and works rather then trusting in Jesus Christ. [/quote]

Again, this insults me, as St. Therese's words brought me closer to Jesus, and even back to the church, when I was in a crisis of faith. Especially this one:

[b]"Be not afraid to tell Jesus that you love Him; even though it be without feeling, this is the way to oblige Him to help you, and carry you like a little child too feeble to walk."[/b]

I hope and pray that you too will experience the love of Jesus that St. Therese so beautifully exemplified and experienced to her death. May God be with you, and bless you in all your endeavors.

-Tony

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Rick777' post='1080840' date='Oct 1 2006, 01:13 PM']
Personally, I think Budge may have just scanned some of the first chapter online and then read a biography of her...
[/quote]
I'm not sure I care at this point. Budge has a strange obsession with Catholicism and yet avoids at all costs (even at the expense of rationality and sanity) even approaching the truth of what Catholicism is. I think the technical term for this would be neurosis.

[homeschoolmom]

Oh, I thought this was about St. Theresa (of Avila... Benedicta of the Cross etc.) but it's about St. Therese... Okay... procede....

[phatcatholic]

[quote name='Mary-Kathryn' post='1080809' date='Oct 1 2006, 02:48 PM']
Budge,

I will not play your game since you are not truly interested in answers. Your interest is in getting people defensive as you twist things around. Then you sit back and enjoy as you watch the mess explode around you. Not worth the effort on this beautiful day. I will strongly suggest an excellent study edition of this book. [/quote]
you T-O-T-A-L-L-Y nailed it.

its about time we quit taking the bait here at phatmass.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='phatcatholic' post='1080846' date='Oct 1 2006, 01:17 PM']
you T-O-T-A-L-L-Y nailed it.

its about time we quit taking the bait here at phatmass.
[/quote]
while I agree, I must nonetheless suggest that bait can be fun.

authentic discussion is certainly a wonderful thing, but exchanging witty persiflage has a certain value of its own.