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The Order Of Mt. Carmel


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The number 1 Carmel I would recommend would be the Carmel in Alexandria, South Dakota.

We had an aspirant when I was at OLAM who had left a Carmel in Canada during her novitiate. She said that although they were extremely ascetical, the spirit of Carmelite prayer and solitude were not present within the community. She said she felt like it was that way in many Carmels in North America. Someone else who visited OLAM moved to Spain in order to join a Carmel that was really living the life as it is meant to be lived. She couldn't find that in North American Carmels.

These are just two account I know of; I have not visited Carmels myself. But I do believe that the Alexandria Carmel is probably the best in this country, or on par with other good ones.

Anyway, God bless you!

Lauren

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Quick question. I want to give the good sisters another call, but I dont want to keep bugging Mother, I am sure she has other things to do ( like run a monestary and care for 15 sisters ) is there a vocation director at Buffalo, or someone else who could awnser vocation type questions? I dont want to be a pain and overlaod Mother Miriam with questions. :P: :D:

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[quote name='HeavenlyCalling' post='1140433' date='Dec 12 2006, 12:29 PM']
Quick question. I want to give the good sisters another call, but I dont want to keep bugging Mother, I am sure she has other things to do ( like run a monestary and care for 15 sisters ) is there a vocation director at Buffalo, or someone else who could awnser vocation type questions? I dont want to be a pain and overlaod Mother Miriam with questions. :P: :D:
[/quote]

Don't worry about bugging her. If she wants you to talk to someone else (i.e., the vocations directress) she will hand you over to her :)

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You can call Mother, or ask for an extern (probably Sr. Agnes Marie). Her Reverence is a woman of heroic charity and I'm sure you'll be glad to take/return your call. As far as I know, Mother Miriam handles the vocation questions directly, sometimes delegating another sister.

Don't be afraid!

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[quote name='Totus Tuus' post='1140451' date='Dec 12 2006, 01:53 PM']
Don't worry about bugging her. If she wants you to talk to someone else (i.e., the vocations directress) she will hand you over to her :)
[/quote]


[quote name='brendan1104' post='1140512' date='Dec 12 2006, 03:06 PM']
You can call Mother, or ask for an extern (probably Sr. Agnes Marie). Her Reverence is a woman of heroic charity and I'm sure you'll be glad to take/return your call. As far as I know, Mother Miriam handles the vocation questions directly, sometimes delegating another sister.

Don't be afraid!
[/quote]
Thank you both, I jsut dont want to be a burden. I tried calling a little bit ago but no one picked up, so I'll try again later or maybe tomarrow, when is the best time to call?

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If you do talk with Sr. Agnes Marie, know that she was a cloistered sister before. I do not know for sure myself, but I suspect she became an extern out of charity and sacrifice for the community, since they needed another extern. She is a young sister and very kind.

When I was discerning there, one of the Third Order ladies that was very kind asked if I might feel called to be an extern because they were in need of them. But I told her I felt called more to the cloister, which she very much respected of course, very kindly. All the Third Order people there I met were extremely nice.

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[quote name='Totus Tuus' post='1140345' date='Dec 12 2006, 09:13 AM']
The number 1 Carmel I would recommend would be the Carmel in Alexandria, South Dakota.

We had an aspirant when I was at OLAM who had left a Carmel in Canada during her novitiate. She said that although they were extremely ascetical, the spirit of Carmelite prayer and solitude were not present within the community. She said she felt like it was that way in many Carmels in North America. Someone else who visited OLAM moved to Spain in order to join a Carmel that was really living the life as it is meant to be lived. She couldn't find that in North American Carmels.

These are just two account I know of; I have not visited Carmels myself. But I do believe that the Alexandria Carmel is probably the best in this country, or on par with other good ones.

Anyway, God bless you!

Lauren
[/quote]

The Alexandria Carmel is a foundation from Buffalo, as is Brooklyn. Generally speaking, the Carmels you can pretty much guarantee follow the charism faithfully are the minority of Carmels in the world that chose the 1990 Constitutions. But again this is very generally speaking.

Mother Miriam told me a couple sisters that were at the Buffalo Carmel when I was there that were from the Dominican Republic, ( or possibly it was Puerto Rico), were first directed by their spiritual directers to go to a Carmel in Spain, as they would be very faithful to the original charism. They were both in the Carmel in Avila. (not the first OCD Carmel btw, I'm pretty sure it's the one that used to be the more lax Carmelite community St. Teresa was first in, the Incarnation. Later it became an OCD Carmel.)

I forgot how these sisters came to Buffalo, but they found the charism is just as faithfully lived in Buffalo. And Buffalo has kept all the Spanish traditions and customs from Mexico. Their spiritual directors though weren't really aware of this, so it was probably good they sent them to Avila (they, the sisters, also have a lot to share with the community from their experience). I'm pretty much 100% sure these sisters are now in the Brooklyn Carmel.

Here's the thread I started on this a couple months ago. At the end of the thread, I posted the Carmels in the US that follow the 1990 Constitutions. I'm not sure about 1990 Carmels in Canada though.

[url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=58540&hl=1990"]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?s...540&hl=1990[/url]

Edited by Margaret Clare
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I thought I'd post the 1990 Carmels here too: (the first 3 have the full Divine Office in Latin)

[url="http://religiouslife.com/vocsearch/search.phtml?view=d&my_id=166&criteria=d"]Alexandria, SD[/url]
Brooklyn, NY
Buffalo, NY
Dallas, TX
Des Plaines, IL
Erie, PA
[url="http://religiouslife.com/vocsearch/search.phtml?view=d&my_id=18&criteria=d"]Flemington, NJ[/url]
[url="http://religiouslife.com/vocsearch/search.phtml?view=d&my_id=165&criteria=d"]Iron Mountain, MI[/url]
Jefferson City, MO
Kensington, CA
Lake Elmo, MN
Louisville, KY
[url="http://religiouslife.com/vocsearch/search.phtml?view=d&my_id=38&criteria=d"]Mobile, AL[/url]
[url="http://religiouslife.com/vocsearch/search.phtml?view=d&my_id=25&criteria=d"]Pittsford, NY[/url] (Schenectady, NY recently joined them)
[url="http://religiouslife.com/vocsearch/search.phtml?view=d&my_id=82&criteria=d"]Traverse City, MI[/url]
[url="http://www.lasvegasmariancenter.com/carmel.htm"]Valparaiso, NE[/url] (Indult Latin Mass & Office)

That's 16/60something Discalced Carmelite Monasteries in the US.

I think [url="http://carmelitemonastery.com/"]Georgetown, CA[/url] follows the 1990's in all ways but that they are under the General Superior of the Carmelite Order (1991's) rather than directly to the Holy Father (1990's) - Gemma told me this.

Ada Parnell, MI follows the 1991's but is supposed to be very good - founded many Carmels. I'm sure other 1991 Carmels are good too, but I don't know of them. The only other I heard that was very good was a new one in Denmark, WI

Also, I'm assuming all the 1990s are great, but you'd really have to visit each one and speak with the Mother to really know and find out the unique spirit of each Carmel. But generally, the 1990s are supposed to be the best for orthodoxy and faithfulness to the charism and the strict enclosure.

Edited by Margaret Clare
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[quote name='HeavenlyCalling' post='1140603' date='Dec 12 2006, 03:24 PM']
Thank you both, I jsut dont want to be a burden. I tried calling a little bit ago but no one picked up, so I'll try again later or maybe tomarrow, when is the best time to call?
[/quote]

You probably won't get someone to answer anytime you call. Generally in monastic communities the norm is to return messages at the sisters' convenience :)

[quote name='Margaret Clare' post='1140772' date='Dec 12 2006, 07:19 PM']
I forgot how these sisters came to Buffalo, but they found the charism is just as faithfully lived in Buffalo. And Buffalo has kept all the Spanish traditions and customs from Mexico. Their spiritual directors though weren't really aware of this, so it was probably good they sent them to Avila (they, the sisters, also have a lot to share with the community from their experience). I'm pretty much 100% sure these sisters are now in the Brooklyn Carmel.

Here's the thread I started on this a couple months ago. At the end of the thread, I posted the Carmels in the US that follow the 1990 Constitutions. I'm not sure about 1990 Carmels in Canada though.

[url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=58540&hl=1990"]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?s...540&hl=1990[/url]
[/quote]

I read the history of it once. I believe the sisters went from Mexico to Buffalo during the Mexican Revolution and religious persecution. They were fortunate to make it out of Mexico and all the way to New York in one piece! The dedication of the sisters (especially many of the superiors in their history) is astonishing.

I've been to St. Joseph's in Avila, but I didn't make it to Incarnation (was Incarnation really in Avila? All of Teresa's history is getting mixed up in my mind :unsure: )

God bless,
Lauren

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[quote name='Totus Tuus' post='1141170' date='Dec 13 2006, 07:57 AM']
I read the history of it once. I believe the sisters went from Mexico to Buffalo during the Mexican Revolution and religious persecution. They were fortunate to make it out of Mexico and all the way to New York in one piece! The dedication of the sisters (especially many of the superiors in their history) is astonishing.[/quote]

Yeah ...

[quote]I've been to St. Joseph's in Avila, but I didn't make it to Incarnation (was Incarnation really in Avila? All of Teresa's history is getting mixed up in my mind :unsure: )[/quote]

hmm, I think both of them were in Avila. I'll have to see in a book. For now I found [url="http://www.carmelite.com/saints/teresa01.shtml"]this site[/url]. It says that she entered the Incarnation [i]there[/i] (in Avila I'm assuming)

I'm pretty sure Mother Miriam said the nuns were in the monastery were St. Teresa was first that was later changed into a Discalced Carmel, rather than O.Carm. I didn't realize St. Joseph's was also in Avila, but it was. :j

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[quote name='Totus Tuus' post='1140345' date='Dec 12 2006, 09:13 AM']
I do believe that the Alexandria Carmel is probably the best in this country, or on par with other good ones.[/quote]

Thanks for the great recommendation for Alexandria though. I haven't heard very much about this Carmel only that it came from Buffalo, so I assumed it must be very good. I think the fact that it is very faithful to the charism and that it's in the country must make it one of the best.

I visited/corresponded with 5 of the Carmels on this list. First, Des Plaines, which is right near me, which is great - highly recommended. They do not come from the list of all the foundations from Mexico, but from foundations from Europe - so they have different customs and are a little more simple than the Spanish custom Carmels.
(I like both traditions)

The next was Iron Mountain, MI - foundation from Grand Rapids in 1951 - Spanish traditions - wonderful community!!! just about full now.

The next, Buffalo, NY - incredible, Latin chant, very traditional. Then Schenectady, NY - came also from Grand Rapids Mexican Carmel later than Buffalo, wonderful community (now has merged with another Carmel in Pittsford, NY)

Finally Lake Elmo, MN, which I didn't visit, but spoke a few times with Mother Rose there. They are supposed to be an exceptionally great community also. I believe it was Mother Miriam who also recommended this place. They have a lot of land and are in a very very quiet area. They also have an awesome Carmelite order right near them, the [url="http://www.decorcarmeli.com/Hermits.htm"]Hermits of the Blessed Virgin Mary[/url], who come for the Sacraments and give them spiritual direction and retreats.

They have a very very plain monastery, which Mother Rose particulary thought it was important that I know, as some may find it depressing there, she said, after a time. They are from the European foundations with the simple customs like Des Plaines. She sent me pictures in the mail. Their chapel has cement walls, and truly is incredibly plain. But this for them is a sign of their poverty, and also their simplicity in all things including the material.

Mother Rose asked me if I really liked the monastic feel of Buffalo, which greatly contrasts their monastery - and I definitely did. It is [i]beautiful[/i]. So she recommended I go there then. But something really great about Lake Elmo is that they are definitely in a silent area and have a good amount of land which they own around them - which helps protect the silence.

Edited by Margaret Clare
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Try this [url="http://www.carmelnuns.com/"]http://www.carmelnuns.com/[/url] (sorry I dont know how to make it a link) I have been there when the relics of Saint Therese came through and it is a beautiful monastery. It is in Arlington Texas God Bless and Mary keep
Karin

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I honestly do not know much about cloisters, but I know there is a Carmelite monastery in St. Louis, MO where Our Lord is exposed all day long. The seem to have had a good number of vocations recently, so you may want to check it out.
Here's their website: [url="http://www.stormpages.com/mtcarmel/"]Carmel of St. Louis[/url]

You'll be in my prayers! Keep us updated!

In Christ, the author of Life,
Lauren

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