Sr Mary Catharine OP Posted June 7, 2007 Posted June 7, 2007 [quote name='Margaret Clare' post='1290405' date='Jun 7 2007, 05:17 PM']As I understand it, a nun is a religious sister that takes Solemn Vows and is enclosed, while a religious sister takes simple/perpetual vows and is not formally a nun, though generally speaking, she can be called nun, as we in the US interchange the two a lot. It does confuse me though, because once when I was telling someone about the Sisters of Bethlehem they were saying to me, why don't you just become a nun. She kept asking me, but do they take Solemn Vows? Well, I guess not - they take Final Vows. But is it that big of a difference in the eyes of God? As I understand it, Solemn Vows are something only nuns in an established Order (with a capitol "O") can take. But an order like the Sisters of Bethlehem does not have that status, so they take Final Vows. They are a Religious Institute of Pontifical Right though. I asked a sister at Livingston Manor about it, and she said it's the same thing - Solemn Vows / Final Vows. I also asked a great priest once, and he was saying he thinks it's more of a canonical thing. I think what matters in this is what the vows mean before God, and not man. And now some pictures from Les Voirons. I love this sister! I met her when I was on retreat there! [img]http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/6445/2601/1600/HPIM4365%20(Medium).3.jpg[/img][/quote] Actually the difference between Solemn Vows and perpetual vows is more than canonical. According to the new code of canon law there is no difference unless stipulated in the constitutions. I recently learned that the OMI's make solemn vows. Solemn Profession is more than just about poverty, ie. one don't only can't acquire goods one doesn't own anything, whereas with perpetual vows one actually continues to own but doesn't have the right to adminster one's goods. According to natural law every person has the right to own goods. We give up this natural right by Solemn Profession. With Solemn profession if one would run off and get married it would be invalid whereas with perpetual vows it's illicit. OK. That sounds very dry and dull but it has deeper practical implications. Only the Pope can dispense NOT from the vow in solemn profession but from the obligations. Solemn Profession is a total holocaust between the person and God and even the Pope can't undo this. What one is saying with Solemn Profession is that one completely hands oneself over to God. Yes, essentially it's what matters is before God but we are creatures of body and soul and don't live in the mind although the modern world things so. So, we express this total self gift, total holocaust in a physical, created way. Let's face it; "that's mine" is something that seems to be ingrained in us from the day we were born! By Solemn Profession GOD consecrates and we in a new way we become His! The "stuff" of ownership and non-ownership is the expression of saying to God, "I belong to you; you must take care of me." Our profession is an ecclesial act. It's accept and ratified by the Church, it's not just a thing between me and God. It's really too bad the the new Code didn't continue this distinction because there is a difference. It doesn't make a person in solemn vows better than someone in perpetual vows but it's a real distinction. It's ABSOLUTELY a gift of God. We tend to use "moniales" to talk about the OP nuns as Sisters means the apostolic congregations. And yes, it's confusing because we call ourselves Sisters. The first nuns of Prouilhe were called "ladies". Hmmm. I don't think that would go today! We were also called the Sister Preacheresses. Lauren the European monasteries tend to be more broad about enclosure. Many don't have material separation and many have guest houses, hostels which means more interaction with the public. Many will have the public join them for the Liturgy. Their Offices also tend to have more musical instruments like zithers. Many of them have an industry like cookie making. And a lot of them wear those ugly kerchief style veils! They always fall off!
Chiquitunga Posted June 8, 2007 Posted June 8, 2007 Hey, thanks for the reply Sr. Mary Catharine. That's very informative. I guess my only question remains, I know that if the Sisters of Bethlehem could have Solemn Vows, they would. They live the wholly contemplative life and completely abandon themselves to God in this same way. But the reason their vows aren't solemn is because they're a Religious Institute and not an Order. I would want to completely give my life over to God in Solemn Vows, and I'm sure all the Sisters of Bethlehem would feel the same way too, like the Carmelites or Poor Clares or Dominican Nuns. They definitely live the monastic life to the full, without compromise. I do wish the Church could grant religious institutes such as them the privilge of Solemn Vows. But for some reasons it's only for the nuns in Orders.
Chiquitunga Posted June 8, 2007 Posted June 8, 2007 Sorry to hijack the thread though, with the discussion on nuns & sisters. Sr. MC's response was very informative though! Thank you!!
Sr Mary Catharine OP Posted June 8, 2007 Posted June 8, 2007 [quote name='Margaret Clare' post='1290598' date='Jun 7 2007, 11:05 PM']Sorry to hijack the thread though, with the discussion on nuns & sisters. Sr. MC's response was very informative though! Thank you!![/quote] I just had a correspondence with a priest who said that according to the 83 Code there IS NO distinction between Final/perpetual and Solemn and that one could have the act of renounciation that we have with Solemn Vows with Simple vows if the it's in the Constitutions of the institute. However, I was not taught it quite this way but he may be right. Believe it or not, now I'M confused! Will do a little more research and get some advice and let you know. Again, dont' mean to highjack. I'll do a separate thread. God bless! SMC
the lords sheep Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 [img]http://www.sistersofcarmel.org/pics/cell.jpg[/img] Carmelite S.O.L.T. Sisters: [img]http://www.soltsisters.org/images/Mayon%20Philippina%20Sisters.JPG[/img] Sisters of Perpetual Adoration (AK) [img]http://monestaryoftheblessedsacrament.com/index_files/image074.jpg[/img] [img]http://monestaryoftheblessedsacrament.com/index_files/image068.jpg[/img] Carmelite Sisters of the Divine Heart of Jesus: [img]http://www.carmelitedcj.org/life/community.jpg[/img]
Chiquitunga Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 [quote name='EJames' post='1288825' date='Jun 5 2007, 03:15 PM']Carmelites of The Child Jesus (Contemplatives ,who have a small children's apostolate.) Montpelier,France [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/62852_0qen8/carmelites%20MonTpeilleir.jpg[/img][/quote] These Carmelites look like a wonderful community, with a beautiful apostolate! And I think we have here a Srs of Bethlehem statue sighting! Our Lady of Aude :j
Chiquitunga Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 (edited) [b]Congregation of the Mother of Carmel, India[/b] - Active/Contemplative Carmelite sisters, affiliated with the Discalced Carmelite Order, (they have both brown & white Carmelite habits) [url="http://imageshack.us"][img]http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/2600/cmcsisterzk1.jpg[/img][/url] CMC Sisters Novitiate [url="http://imageshack.us"][img]http://img117.imageshack.us/img117/4717/cmcsistersmn1.jpg[/img][/url] Holy Founders: [url="http://www.blessedchavara.org/"][b]Blessed Kuriakose[/b][/url], "The Father of the Untouchables" founder of the Carmelites of Mary Immaculate, priests/brothers & CMC sisters - & [url="http://www.vatican.va/news_services/liturgy/saints/ns_lit_doc_20061203_eufrasia_en.html"][b]Blessed Euphrasia[/b][/url], Mother Foundress Edited June 9, 2007 by Margaret Clare
Chiquitunga Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 CMC Sister in Chicago greets Auxiliary Bishop Paprocki :j (she's a great sister!) [img]http://www.saintodilo.org/pictures/brankinmass/tn_odilo100_sm.gif[/img]
Ora et Labora Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 [quote name='the lords sheep' post='1291310' date='Jun 9 2007, 11:43 AM'][img]http://www.sistersofcarmel.org/pics/cell.jpg[/img] Carmelite S.O.L.T. Sisters: [img]http://www.soltsisters.org/images/Mayon%20Philippina%20Sisters.JPG[/img][/quote] this one's beautiful.
ofpheritup Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [quote name='the lords sheep' post='1291310' date='Jun 9 2007, 10:43 AM'][img]http://www.sistersofcarmel.org/pics/cell.jpg[/img][/quote] This is one of my most favorite pictures. I really can't explain why. Whenever we build our house I plan on modeling the guest rooms after this. My husband thinks I'm kidding....I'm not. After all what else do you need? He married a minimalist.
shortnun Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 If anyone's on facebook, check out the group "Dominican Sisters... Wild at Heart"--it has 100+ pictures of the Nashville Dominicans
ofpheritup Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [quote name='shortnun' post='1292198' date='Jun 10 2007, 06:23 PM']If anyone's on facebook, check out the group "Dominican Sisters... Wild at Heart"--it has 100+ pictures of the Nashville Dominicans[/quote] Shortnun what is facebook? And how do I get it and where is it? THANK YOU...
shortnun Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [quote name='ofpheritup' post='1292201' date='Jun 10 2007, 07:31 PM']Shortnun what is facebook? And how do I get it and where is it? THANK YOU...[/quote] Facebook is a social networking site (like MySpace). [b][url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook"]Wikipedia Entry[/url][/b] [b][url="http://www.facebook.com"]Facebook interface[/url][/b]
fearundercontrol Posted June 11, 2007 Posted June 11, 2007 [quote name='EJames' post='1272751' date='May 13 2007, 11:31 PM'][b]YOU MUST BE LOGGED IN TO VIEW PICS DIRECTLY[/b] Capuchin Sisters ,PA - [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/24977_dfv99/cnPictTrischLizpos.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/24978_e0bbx/message-candle.JPG[/img] profession final[/quote] My friend is a postulant there! (She's not in the picture.) And I recognize those two in that last picture. Sr Kelly (I think it's her name) and Sr Veronica. They are so sweet and funny!
EJames Posted June 11, 2007 Author Posted June 11, 2007 OK sooooo..continuing with [b]pictures[/b] that speak many words... [b]Little Poor[/b](and we do mean poor) [b]Sisters[/b](and Brothers) [b]of Jesus and Mary (Franciscan[/b], with devotion to Our lady of Mt Carmel)-Italia very new as far as Sisters go, only one fully professed, and a few Novices, and Postulants-observers. see 'Brothers pic thread' for more info. ------------------------------------ [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72542_dizoh/lavoro%20di%20formrazione%202.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72546_ziblb/Sr.%20Letizia%20-%20a%20breve%20raggio.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72541_0wlyv/a%20lungo%20raggio%203.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72543_xzeux/Meditazione%201.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72544_0jbif/Missione%20Franc.%205.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72504_nly4o/liytlest.JPG[/img]
EJames Posted June 11, 2007 Author Posted June 11, 2007 Dominican Nuns here in B.C. ------------ [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72540_3oxsa/dominicans%20langley.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72539_iahqz/page3.jpg[/img][img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72538_wlsup/page4.jpg[/img] ---------- Benedictine Nuns at Jamberoo, Australia. [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72537_skvre/jamberoo.jpg[/img]
Veritas Posted June 11, 2007 Posted June 11, 2007 [quote name='EJames' post='1292288' date='Jun 10 2007, 08:48 PM']OK sooooo..continuing with [b]pictures[/b] that speak many words... [b]Little Poor[/b](and we do mean poor) [b]Sisters[/b](and Brothers) [b]of Jesus and Mary (Franciscan[/b], with devotion to Our lady of Mt Carmel)-Italia very new as far as Sisters go, only one fully professed, and a few Novices, and Postulants-observers. see 'Brothers pic thread' for more info. ------------------------------------ [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72542_dizoh/lavoro%20di%20formrazione%202.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72546_ziblb/Sr.%20Letizia%20-%20a%20breve%20raggio.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72541_0wlyv/a%20lungo%20raggio%203.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72543_xzeux/Meditazione%201.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72544_0jbif/Missione%20Franc.%205.JPG[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/72504_nly4o/liytlest.JPG[/img][/quote] + That is seriously old school. It appears as though one is looking in on Saint Francis and his followers themselves!
ofpheritup Posted June 11, 2007 Posted June 11, 2007 I would like to thank everyone who has posted pictures here. The joy that you see in the Sister's faces is such a "pick-me-up." I often come on this site to see the pictures when I've had a bad day. Seeing all the smiles and beauty I can't help but feel better. Please know that I appreciate what you are doing.
Jennifer Posted June 11, 2007 Posted June 11, 2007 [quote name='ofpheritup' post='1292621' date='Jun 11 2007, 12:48 PM']I would like to thank everyone who has posted pictures here. The joy that you see in the Sister's faces is such a "pick-me-up." I often come on this site to see the pictures when I've had a bad day. Seeing all the smiles and beauty I can't help but feel better. Please know that I appreciate what you are doing.[/quote] >>>>>>>>DITTO <<<<<<<<<<
EJames Posted June 11, 2007 Author Posted June 11, 2007 the joyfull Sisters de l'Annonciade-order founded by St Jeanne de France in 1502 a.d. if anyone knows what the ten knots on their cords means, i would be interested...thanks. E-J. --------- [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/73371_zxyvs/procession6.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/73370_u9rvm/noviciat77.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/73373_fufr5/foyer.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/73374_85kt2/aide.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.hotlinkfiles.com/files/73375_f87dk/chapelle.jpg[/img] - PAX!
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