Where Should Catholic Music Go From Here?

[abercius24]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' post='1347050' date='Aug 2 2007, 03:21 AM']by haveing good music......by not being uptight like we just came off of tbn........by realising that God gifted artist out of the catholic music sceene to.........which means.......that when we venture to the world we could possibly be dealing with artist who are gifted by God to......and while they may not hold the full truth.....us performing there...could shed light to them about Christ's Church and its stright demands..............[/quote]

Okay. Let me play devil's advocate, if I may. You're on to something good here, but we need to test and explore it more.

How do you convince a secular club owner that you're gonna make him money by allowing you to preach the gospel at his club? How do you convince him that he should be cool with some of his patrons being irritated by your "bible thumping" in a place they have come to relax and unwind? How do you keep yourself pure in that environment given that you may be opening for a wet tee-shirt contest? These are questions I personally have struggled with. I think we can find answers if we start some good brain-storming. Being it back at me!

Edited August 2, 2007 by abercius24

[RobeofJustice]

[quote name='abercius24' post='1346522' date='Aug 1 2007, 07:24 PM']So any ideas as to how we get into those secular venues?[/quote]


Start with a local OPEN MIC. Open "usually" means open. I just performed solo for an open mic at a coffee shop here in Arcata, Ca. i got there early and was the first to sign up.

i did my three song minimum (open mike limit) and it went well. Later the manager asked me to play again toward the end after all the artists had a chance to perform. With the extra time I was given I was able to turn the listeners on to our ministry's mission, our free music and our local presence. It was really cool. But I prayed for two years before I felt called to "go public" in the secular world. That's just me:/

after my first three songs I was approached by a woman that told me she was also a chistian and asked me to pray for her husband who just became a believer two weeks ago. i promised her I would and ministered to her with the help of the Holy Spirit for a few minutes.

i found out through the course of the night that this particular coffee shop is actually owned and operated by the local Vineyard church. The sound guy for open mike night is their worship leader. they have their service on sunday morning in the coffee shop and use the proceeds from the business to fund their various ministries. Interesting.

Got me thinking. hmmm... Well, that is where I'm starin ~Open mike nights~

Peace out ya'll~

www.OaksofJustice.com

[desertwoman]

Since the Catholic Church is made up of about a billion people, make music that covers that dynamic. Make Traditional, make hiphop, make rock, make metal, make country, make folk music. Make music that will edify the body. Make music that will inform Catholics in name only in what the Church teaches. Make music that will evangelize. Make music that will get your feet taping and having fun. Make music that will defend the Church. Make music that Jesus himself will be proud of.

[Guest]

[quote name='abercius24' post='1347874' date='Aug 2 2007, 06:52 PM']Okay. Let me play devil's advocate, if I may. You're on to something good here, but we need to test and explore it more.

How do you convince a secular club owner that you're gonna make him money by allowing you to preach the gospel at his club? How do you convince him that he should be cool with some of his patrons being irritated by your "bible thumping" in a place they have come to relax and unwind? How do you keep yourself pure in that environment given that you may be opening for a wet tee-shirt contest? These are questions I personally have struggled with. I think we can find answers if we start some good brain-storming. Being it back at me![/quote]


ya it would be tough.....i think one of the advantages of being cathohic is that we can blur the line way more easily then a protestant can......i think our music should be good enough that when we go to a club or a bar it would be on the same level that a non christians band would be..................i think when were done performing the audience should know that we represent Christ and were leaving them with material that will bring them closer to Christ and his church.........wether it be free cd's of our band or with catholic literature that lets them know where we stand......i dont think we should worry if wet t shirt contest are going on afterwards...all we can do is shed light on the situation when given the opportunithy........if we get one person there to mabey consider there faith then we did our job....wet t shirt contest or not.........

[abercius24]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' post='1350105' date='Aug 5 2007, 03:33 AM']ya it would be tough.....i think one of the advantages of being cathohic is that we can blur the line way more easily then a protestant can......i think our music should be good enough that when we go to a club or a bar it would be on the same level that a non christians band would be..................i think when were done performing the audience should know that we represent Christ and were leaving them with material that will bring them closer to Christ and his church.........wether it be free cd's of our band or with catholic literature that lets them know where we stand......i dont think we should worry if wet t shirt contest are going on afterwards...all we can do is shed light on the situation when given the opportunithy........if we get one person there to mabey consider there faith then we did our job....wet t shirt contest or not.........[/quote]

Okay, so do a little stealth action. I hear you. We actually did something similar when we played at some Fundy bookstores. For the most part, we played songs with themes more common between our faiths. But we also snuck in some Marian songs (particularly those that were less obvious given they were based on Old Testament scriptures!) But it did get people thinking a little more out of the box than they would if we hadn't played the gig. We had some good one-on-one talks afterwards, too.

I guess you could do the same thing at a secular venue. Have some songs that aren't so obviously Catholic, but then sneak a few others in there that are. Give out CD's and tracts, like you said, but get into the sinner's inner circle. I like it. I would try to avoid being there when the wet tee-shirt contest goes on, though. You would be sick to your stomach seeing me in a tight, drenched tee -- beer belly and all. Really, though. It would be best to not tempt yourself unnecessarily. You would probably want to prepare spiritually with some serious prayer beforehand, too, just to keep your focus given that you will be on "enemy territory." But this idea does follow along the lines of what Christ did when he would eat and drink with the sinners. I'm sure He had to be careful being with them, but he certainly brought the gospel to those who truly needed it the most.

Steve S. -- Abercius24
CatholicQandA.com

Edited August 5, 2007 by abercius24

[melporcristo]

[quote name='abercius24' post='1343149' date='Jul 28 2007, 02:12 PM']Very interesting. How do they convince everybody to work together within that network? Is it mostly loyalty to the University?[/quote]


Sorry - I'm replying late ...
I think people just have the same vision -- get kids to love Jesus, love Mary, love the Church more. Love the Sacraments -- it's definately not like a loyalty to the school kind of thing.

[abercius24]

Thanks for the follow-up, Melporcristo! Its good to see that the faith is the center of unity with the Catholic Music scene at Steubenville. That's the way it should be.


Okay, here is another question for everybody: Should a Catholic band be close or distant with their local parish?

I've heard arguments on both sides. If you're tight with your parish, you can find a lot of loyal supporters, which can really kickstart a new band. You have a little more legitimacy claiming to be a "Catholic" band, too. On the otherhand, parishes are unfortunately involved in a lot of "church politics", which can create uncomfortable limitations and expectations of anyone who affiliates directly with them. We've found it more comfortable being supportive of our parish from a distance because we're not very good with the whole political aspect. We felt some of the rules we had to obey would limit our creativity. It took a good while to gain a following, though, as a result. What approach has everyone else taken?

Steve S. -- Abercius24
Agony Rose Music
CatholicQandA.com

Edited August 9, 2007 by abercius24

[Guest]

[quote name='abercius24' post='1353264' date='Aug 8 2007, 08:38 PM']Thanks for the follow-up, Melporcristo! Its good to see that the faith is the center of unity with the Catholic Music scene at Steubenville. That's the way it should be.


Okay, here is another question for everybody: Should a Catholic band be close or distant with their local parish?

We felt some of the rules we had to obey would limit our creativity.[/quote]



such as ??

[abercius24]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' post='1353443' date='Aug 9 2007, 12:00 AM']such as ??[/quote]
Some parishes require that you be more of a mass choir, with the obligation to play for at least one mass every Sunday and allow anyone in the parish to join the group (whether they have talent or not). Some parishes require that you use their instruments and not your own (and you know my local parish can afford a high quality sound system). Some require you to play unplugged. Some require that you do some Praise & Worship covers. Some require that your gigs be approved by committee or pastor, or be directly parish-sponsored. Some parishes will not tolerate any lyrics about abortion, artificial contraception, teen sex, or divorce -- even if it is in a righteous context. Some parishes require the drummer to use "hot sticks" instead of regular drum sticks because they might play in a church ("hot sticks" are the softer tied-reed sticks which sound really lame). Some will not tolerate electric guitars. Some flat out refuse to support hard rock or rap. Some will promise to allow you to do what you want, but then later come back with restrictions after somebody complains or comes up with a "better" idea than your vision. Some refuse to allow you to evangelize between songs. Some require that you not mention the word "Apologetics". Some require that you do everything for free. Etc.....

Some restrictions are understandable given the parish's tax-deductible status or their need to avoid unnecessary liability. Some restrictions are simply because the parish likes to have complete control over anything that could potentially affect their low-key reputation; or they have a need they want you to fill that doesn't jive with your particular motivations or limited resources (such as time and talent). The bottom line is that if you work at the parish level, you have to do whatever they say, or you have to do it on your own. Frankly, I think some parishes prefer you do it on your own so they can avoid any potential complications. I do know some bands who have successfully worked with their local parish. I'm not saying its better one way or another. I simply want newer Catholic bands to know their options, and the consequences and benefits that come with each option.

So, has anybody run into these issues before? Does anybody have recommendations on how to work through such limitations? Comments, please...

[misereremi]

[quote name='abercius24' post='1353666' date='Aug 9 2007, 07:58 AM']The bottom line is that if you work at the parish level, you have to do whatever they say, or you have to do it on your own. Frankly, I think some parishes prefer you do it on your own so they can avoid any potential complications. I do know some bands who have successfully worked with their local parish. I'm not saying its better one way or another. I simply want newer Catholic bands to know their options, and the consequences and benefits that come with each option.

So, has anybody run into these issues before? Does anybody have recommendations on how to work through such limitations? Comments, please...[/quote]
Interesting to hear your experiences. I haven't had anything to do with the parish apart from asking the priests to pray for us. I personally am against bands playing at mass and adoration. But outside of that, if it's just gigs, to have all those restrictions would make it impossible to make music.

[Didymus]

yeah, I don't think I could sound anything like I'm intending to if I tried to do it within a parish. It would just end up too soft, and what good would that do if it sounded like most everything else...

[RobeofJustice]

[quote name='misereremi' post='1353696' date='Aug 9 2007, 02:54 AM']Interesting to hear your experiences. I haven't had anything to do with the parish apart from asking the priests to pray for us. I personally am against bands playing at mass and adoration. But outside of that, if it's just gigs, to have all those restrictions would make it impossible to make music.[/quote]


We (Oaks of Justice) only performed non-liturgical music betweeen 2003-2005. When my wife and I moved ourselves and the ministry to Northern Cal. We found ourselves without a band in a strange and foreign mission field called Humboldt County.

I returned to my roots musically playing for Adoration, the Holy Mass, Confirmation Retreats and Penance services. (I am not classically trained and I have never learned Gregorian Chant though I would love to learn.)
I have established good on going relationships with St. Bernard's and Sacred Heart Parishes respectively and
St. Bernard's Catholic High and Elementary schools.

I find that having the support of the local parish priests and parishioners is helping to build a good working foundation for spiritual growth and outreach to the local community.

We have not done any Conferences or Rock concerts for serveral years but it has been very fulfilling as music ministers to share the gift God has given us with our fellow parishoners and Catholic school kids in this way.

~Robe~
www.OaksofJustice.com

[abercius24]

[quote name='RobeofJustice' post='1354567' date='Aug 9 2007, 10:38 PM']We (Oaks of Justice) only performed non-liturgical music betweeen 2003-2005. When my wife and I moved ourselves and the ministry to Northern Cal. We found ourselves without a band in a strange and foreign mission field called Humboldt County.

I returned to my roots musically playing for Adoration, the Holy Mass, Confirmation Retreats and Penance services. (I am not classically trained and I have never learned Gregorian Chant though I would love to learn.)
I have established good on going relationships with St. Bernard's and Sacred Heart Parishes respectively and
St. Bernard's Catholic High and Elementary schools.

I find that having the support of the local parish priests and parishioners is helping to build a good working foundation for spiritual growth and outreach to the local community.

We have not done any Conferences or Rock concerts for serveral years but it has been very fulfilling as music ministers to share the gift God has given us with our fellow parishoners and Catholic school kids in this way.

~Robe~
www.OaksofJustice.com[/quote]

Yeah, I think Rob is on to something. If your goals are in line with those of the parish, as they are in Rob's case, then you all can bless each other in many wonderful ways. But if your vision simply does not fit with theirs, then you gotta find another network. Now please don't get me wrong, its NOT BAD to work with a parish. There is nothing wrong with that. I just think it can be difficult in some cases -- particularly as it has been in my case. Just as it can be difficult for some musicians to work in band with each other because of their different methods and goals, not every Catholic band is meant to work with every parish. I still would like to hear more success stories about how some bands have found ways to work with their parish. I think such examples can help some new Catholic Bands to (carefully) find some help on the parish level. Thanks for your story Rob!

Steve S.
Agony Rose Music

[abercius24]

[quote name='Didymus' post='1353763' date='Aug 9 2007, 10:12 AM']yeah, I don't think I could sound anything like I'm intending to if I tried to do it within a parish. It would just end up too soft, and what good would that do if it sounded like most everything else...[/quote]

Yeah, that's kind of how it has been for us. I bought some hot sticks once to satisfy one particular parish, but I might as well have been scratching a chalk board behind my drumset given the way I felt while playing. Yikes. Gives me the chills just thinking about it. We have played at some very gracious parishes, though. They just weren't local enough to be a solid, ongoing part of our support network.

Steve S. -- abercius24
Agony Rose Music

[Custos Morum]

[quote name='abercius24' post='1340826' date='Jul 26 2007, 02:25 AM']My buddy, Jerry (head of Faithful Artists Productions in SoCal) did some research for a report on the influence of satanism and the occult in modern rock and rap music. I was quite shocked to hear how many Hollywood producers are directly involved in satanic and occultic circles. They are also pretty blatant about their agendas to promote sexual promiscuity and violent behaviors in others. They think its funny how easy people can be manipulated. If Satanism plays hard at influencing people through music, I would think we Catholics have a calling to produce an effective counterattack.[/quote]

YES! finally someone who knows what I'm talking about.. I am completely aware of the 'evil' industry and its aim to manipulate consciously and subconsciously.. So it is our duty to get in there with a positive religious counter attack - it has to be good, it has to be up to their standard or even better and it has to hit hard. Get in everywhere we can, clubs, radio, bars, compilations, you name it. I don't know if you're aware of the subliminal, subconscious effect certain unhearable frequencies have on people, but a lot of this is going on as well. We need to work on something beautiful for God and to help save souls from evil culture.