Possible Ex-communication

[Socrates]

[quote name='MJReynolds' post='1709454' date='Nov 24 2008, 11:03 AM']The rationale that I am seeing here is that a candidate could have stances that match up quite well with everything that the Catholic Church teaches but abortion and we shouldn't vote for him because of that. Fine. I get it. But I think that you guys have your Catechism a bit off on the Death Penalty. It states that it is only allowed when it must be done in order to protect society. And since we have the means to do that now-a-days without killing a person, it is rendered unnecessary and immoral. So, go ahead and "flip" because I'm comparing the two and believe in the real culture of life, not just the easy ones.[/quote]
Did you even read the quote from Cardinal Ratzinger from the CDF document I provided?

The Catechism acknowledges that capital punishment can have legitimate application - whereas abortion never does.
Cardinal Ratzinger plainly states that the capital punishment issue does not have the same moral weight as abortion and euthanasia.
He concludes:
[b]"There may be a legitimate diversity of opinion even among Catholics about waging war and applying the death penalty, but not however with regard to abortion and euthanasia."[/b]

Are you claiming to have a better understanding of Catholic theology than the Pope himself?
Personally, I find that quite dubious.

You need to get your own head straight before you presume to lecture the rest of us about the Catechism.

Voting for Obama, who promised to pass FOCA into law - which would permanently ban any and all restrictions on abortion, force Catholic hospitals to perform abortion, and have more of your and mine tax dollars pay for baby-killing - is [i][b]far[/b][/i] from supporting a "real culture of life."

It is you, sir, who's a "bit off" and who's being hypocritical here.

Edited November 25, 2008 by Socrates

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='zwergel88' post='1707779' date='Nov 22 2008, 11:41 AM']Even if it turns out that fetal pain is a factor in late term abortions, the procedure doesn't last very long, and the child doesn't know what is happening.[/quote]

Wha...wha...what? [b]Even if it turns out[/b]??? You think the child feels no pain by having his or her brains sucked out, from being yanked out of his or her mother, from having his or her skull smashed?

Edited November 25, 2008 by HisChildForever

[Ash Wednesday]

[quote name='MJReynolds' post='1709454' date='Nov 24 2008, 10:03 AM']So, go ahead and "flip" because I'm comparing the two and believe in the real culture of life, not just the easy ones.[/quote]

I don't think abortion is the "easy" issue. In my experience it is considered much more righteous and fashionable to be against the death penalty. Not so with abortion. I happen to agree with John Paul II's writings on limiting the death penalty, but when it comes to lives lost from abortion compared to the death penalty -- there is no comparison.

I don't want to come across as uncharitable, but this issue makes my blood boil and it boggles my mind how anyone, not just you but anyone, who claims to be against abortion can really have a clear conscience and sleep at night knowing that their vote for Obama helps bring about the Freedom of Choice Act and destroys everything that the pro-life movement has fought for.

Edited November 25, 2008 by Ash Wednesday

[Ash Wednesday]

[quote name='zwergel88' post='1707779' date='Nov 22 2008, 10:41 AM']Even if it turns out that fetal pain is a factor in late term abortions, the procedure doesn't last very long, and the child doesn't know what is happening.[/quote]

The level of pain and awareness one way or another does not render it justifiable.

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='MJReynolds' post='1709454' date='Nov 24 2008, 08:03 AM']The rationale that I am seeing here is that a candidate could have stances that match up quite well with everything that the Catholic Church teaches but abortion and we shouldn't vote for him because of that. Fine. I get it. But I think that you guys have your Catechism a bit off on the Death Penalty. It states that it is only allowed when it must be done in order to protect society. And since we have the means to do that now-a-days without killing a person, it is rendered unnecessary and immoral. So, go ahead and "flip" because I'm comparing the two and believe in the real culture of life, not just the easy ones.[/quote]

Of course, you know, those who have murdered tend to keep murdering, even in prison.

(Of course, anyone who is in prison doesn't deserve the same protections against being murdered as "good" people, do they? Just like those in the womb don't deserve those protections.)