Music At Mass

[princessgianna]

[quote name='inunionwithrome' post='1878425' date='May 30 2009, 11:01 AM']So what does EF and OF mean? Does it mean Extraordinary Form and Ordinary Form? Please explain!

P.S.-You should have used the opportunity while you had the Baptist choir to evangilize and convert! [/quote]
Extraordinary Form usually is used to talk about the Latin Mass
and Ordinary -English (or of the language of the people).

[Resurrexi]

The ordinary form is often celebrated in Latin, too, as it should be

[OraProMe]

[quote name='Resurrexi' post='1878818' date='May 30 2009, 11:01 PM']The ordinary form is often celebrated in Latin, too, as it should be [/quote]
I don't like the term Latin Mass. It makes people think that the only difference between the Tridentine Mass and the Novus Ordo Missae is the language. My RE teacher was surprised when I told her that the prayers are completely different and it's not just a matter of the language and position of the priest.

[princessgianna]

actually the main part of the Mass is suppose to be in Latin.

[OraProMe]

[quote name='princessgianna' post='1878933' date='May 30 2009, 11:44 PM']actually the main part of the Mass is suppose to be in Latin.[/quote]

:s Really?
What's the "main part"?

I know that when the liturgical reforms began priests still recited the Roman Canon in Latin. But now there are a whole lot of new Eucharistic prayers too ):

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='princessgianna' post='1878815' date='May 30 2009, 11:00 PM']Extraordinary Form usually is used to talk about the Latin Mass
and Ordinary -English (or of the language of the people).

[/quote]
Actually, both forms are "Latin Masses". Latin should be in both

[quote name='OraProMe' post='1878957' date='May 31 2009, 12:57 AM']:s Really?
What's the "main part"?

I know that when the liturgical reforms began priests still recited the Roman Canon in Latin. But now there are a whole lot of new Eucharistic prayers too ):[/quote]
It would do well for the ordinaries to be in Latin (especially with the current translation "issues". Good thing there is a more accurate translation coming out). But, the main reason for there to be some Latin in the ordinary form is to prevent vernacularism, and helps prevent "improvisation", 'cause the priest has to be a servant of the liturgy. The music, in a way, should serve the liturgy too. But that's not the entirety of the music.

Edited May 31, 2009 by Sacred Music Man

[Resurrexi]

I think that the form of each of the Sacraments (except Matrimony) should be said in Latin. That way you don't have to get the Holy See's recognitio on whether a translation is valid or not. However, before that step can be taken, the priests all need to learn to pronounce Latin correctly.

Edited May 31, 2009 by Resurrexi

[princessgianna]

[quote name='princessgianna' post='1878933' date='May 30 2009, 11:44 PM']actually the main part of the Mass is suppose to be in Latin.[/quote]


[quote name='OraProMe' post='1878957' date='May 30 2009, 11:57 PM']:s Really?
What's the "main part"?

I know that when the liturgical reforms began priests still recited the Roman Canon in Latin. But now there are a whole lot of new Eucharistic prayers too ):[/quote]
The parts that don't change /are universal. Though i think the priest should say the readings in the language before the gospel. (obviously he would read it twice).

[quote name='Sacred Music Man' post='1879453' date='May 31 2009, 03:59 PM']Actually, both forms are "Latin Masses". Latin should be in both [/quote]
Said that but thanks for adding and clarifying.

[elizabeth09]

The only music should be at mass is when it is in Latin, if that.

[jeffpugh]

You could have death-metal in Latin. There is more criteria than that.

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='Sacred Music Man' post='1883737' date='Jun 4 2009, 11:41 PM']You could have death-metal in Latin. There is more criteria than that.[/quote]



The forms of music most appropriate for the Roman Liturgy are Gregorian chant and Renaissance polyphony.

Classical music is also particularly appropriate.

[princessgianna]

[quote name='Resurrexi' post='1883740' date='Jun 4 2009, 10:44 PM']

The forms of music most appropriate for the Roman Liturgy are Gregorian chant and Renaissance polyphony.

Classical music is also particularly appropriate.[/quote]
Most(if not all) classical music was written for Roman Catholic Mass!

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='princessgianna' post='1883870' date='Jun 5 2009, 01:42 AM']Most(if not all) classical [u]period sacred[/u] music was written for Roman Catholic Mass![/quote]
fixed that for ya! Oh, and yes and no...

[princessgianna]

[quote name='Sacred Music Man' post='1884446' date='Jun 5 2009, 06:29 PM']fixed that for ya! Oh, and yes and no... [/quote]
If you can explain please.
Thanks
Gianna

[jeffpugh]

I said classical period sacred music cause classical music is a term to generalise all of the music of that era (and sometimes to generalise everything that's not contemporary). There were some mass settings that weren't for the Catholic mass... I believe Byrd wrote for the CoE, but secretly for the CC. That's one example.

[VeniteAdoremus]

[quote name='Sacred Music Man' post='1886140' date='Jun 8 2009, 08:09 AM']I said classical period sacred music cause classical music is a term to generalise all of the music of that era (and sometimes to generalise everything that's not contemporary). There were some mass settings that weren't for the Catholic mass... I believe Byrd wrote for the CoE, but secretly for the CC. That's one example.[/quote]

as did Tallis. Although the latter could do it more openly since Elizabeth (I) liked him so much.

So... would you say the only music you can sing at Mass is music specifically written for a Catholic Mass (if secretly)? Or is it possible to draw appropriate music from other sources?

I voted "no", although in principle my answer is "yes". It is just, in my experience, too difficult to get the focus on the liturgy itself, away from only the musical part of it.

I agree that this would be much easier in the EF. But there, also, the choir is supposed to [i]lead[/i] - and it is difficult to pray along unless you are really familiar with the music.

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='VeniteAdoremus' post='1886323' date='Jun 8 2009, 11:09 AM'] as did Tallis. Although the latter could do it more openly since Elizabeth (I) liked him so much.

So... would you say the only music you can sing at Mass is music specifically written for a Catholic Mass (if secretly)? Or is it possible to draw appropriate music from other sources?

I voted "no", although in principle my answer is "yes". It is just, in my experience, too difficult to get the focus on the liturgy itself, away from only the musical part of it.

I agree that this would be much easier in the EF. But there, also, the choir is supposed to [i]lead[/i] - and it is difficult to pray along unless you are really familiar with the music.[/quote]
I would assess the music on their relation to gregorian chant, the solemnity, etc, not on who produced it for what ecclesial community. Way back then, the Church of England was a little more valid than it is now, sacramentally.

[VeniteAdoremus]

[quote name='Sacred Music Man' post='1886596' date='Jun 9 2009, 12:16 AM']I would assess the music on their relation to gregorian chant, the solemnity, etc, not on who produced it for what ecclesial community. Way back then, the Church of England was a little more valid than it is now, sacramentally.[/quote]

Well, personally I think Byrd for five voices is possibly the best thing since Trent, so I won't debate you on that

What do you think of part-orchestral Mass, part-Gregorian? (For example, a chanted Gloria?)

[AngelofMusic]

As a member of the choir at my own church, I think that orchestral pieces do have a place there, as do electric guitars and drum sets! God gave us musical talent in order to worship him more fully.

Also, I believe that when you sing, you are praying twice. As long as the musical instruments are accompanied by voices, the mass only increases in beauty.

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='VeniteAdoremus' post='1886649' date='Jun 8 2009, 06:45 PM']Well, personally I think Byrd for five voices is possibly the best thing since Trent, so I won't debate you on that

What do you think of part-orchestral Mass, part-Gregorian? (For example, a chanted Gloria?)[/quote]
Could you expand further what you mean? What do you have in mind? I think it sounds like an interesting idea. I wouldn't want it to become un-organic... or like the two parties are "taking turns"