Carmelite Habit

[Strictlyinkblot]

Hi everyone,

I know some of this information has been put up before but I just wanted to ask, what makes up a habit and what do you wear under it. I know it'll differ from place to place. I just want to get a general idea.

Thx

[faithcecelia]

Okay, quick and basic

Undies - pretty normal these days

Base layer - some have tunics, some 'normal' t-shirts, plus cotte (underskirt)

Tunic - main piece of habit, opens at the front (actually in all cases I have seen, barely does up - just a couple of poppers)

Tocque or collar, depending on which veils they have.

Scapular

Veil - with tocque 2 veils, modified vary dramatically, at Q we had old style veils pinned onto bands of varying descriptions, NH have a differently shaped veil which seems (I haven't looked closely) to fasten onto a cap with poppers. the caps are very cute!


Oh and mantle for Mass and Solemn Vespers and Lauds. Most still get mantle at clothing, Q not until Simple profession.

Edited October 22, 2011 by faithcecelia

[Feankie]

Am I assuming correctly that poppers are snaps?

[faithcecelia]

[quote name='Francis Clare' timestamp='1319308964' post='2325235']
Am I assuming correctly that poppers are snaps?
[/quote]

I guess so! Press studs...

[img]http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k216/ruthbale/imagesCAK8OQFP.jpg[/img]

[Aya Sophia]

More fascinating fasteners: At Kirk Edge there are hooks and "lackeys" (actually a French word spelled something like "laquee", although I only saw the written word once so don't remember and cannot find it anywhere on the internet). The hem of the tunic has two large brass hooks on it, almost at the sides of the tunic, for the purpose of hooking up the skirt ("tucking up", as the Sisters say) to a "lackey", a very large brass eye fixed to the back of the waistline on the tunic. (Being fascinated by etymology I would love to know the French word and its origin - I assumed it meant that the big brass eye was like a "slave" or a "lackey" for the hooks but this is probably nonsense.) The Sisters "tuck up" their outer skirt for all types of work and for self-service in the refectory (breakfast, for ex, when tea is self-serve from a trolley in the middle of the refectory) and for the HO ("Humble Office", i.e. the lav).

Edited October 22, 2011 by Aya Sophia

[brandelynmarie]

Humble Office...razzle dazzle name.

[faithcecelia]

[quote name='Aya Sophia' timestamp='1319312551' post='2325250']
More fascinating fasteners: At Kirk Edge there are hooks and "lackeys" (actually a French word spelled something like "laquee", although I only saw the written word once so don't remember and cannot find it anywhere on the interenet). The hem of the tunic has two large brass hooks on it, almost at the sides of the tunic, for the purpose of hooking up the skirt ("tucking up", as the Sisters say) to a "lackey", a very large brass eye fixed to the back of the wasteline on the tunic. (Being fascinated by etymology I would love to know the French word and its origin - I assumed it meant that the big brass eye was like a "slave" or a "lackey" for the hooks but this is probably nonsense.) The Sisters "tuck up" their outer skirt for all types of work and for self-service in the refectory (breakfast, for ex, when tea is self-serve from a trolley in the middle of the refectory) and for the HO ("Humble Office", i.e. the lav).
[/quote]


Yes most have a variation of this. On my brief live-in at NH I witnessed a very special and precious part of their attitude, as when I was being given some 'little work' (for recreation) the roberier was asking me how Q worked these hooks, buttons etc as she is looking at improving the way they do them there, and she was abviously genuinely interested, not making small talk (which of course a Carmelite wouldnt do in work time anyway!)

Did you have 2 or 3 hooks? At Q we had 3 so you could turn the very back up too, tucking the scapular inside, priceless for wet day walks, but I always felt like I had a nappy on!!

[Aya Sophia]

Now that you mention it, there was something about a third hook and a less frequent type of tuck up. I guess I was never inducted into the mysteries of this because I was still only a postulant with 2 hooks on her skirt....

Edited October 22, 2011 by Aya Sophia

[Guest hermanita]

[url="http://www.carmelitesistersocd.com/Events/slide_investiture_201103.asp"]http://www.carmelite...ture_201103.asp[/url] Probably many of you have seen this. It's the investiture ceremony/habit of the community I'm discerning with.

Edited October 22, 2011 by hermanita

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

I am not totally sure, but I absolutely adore the Carmelite habit with the large scapular. I have a question for you all, though. When you are a live-in or before you get your habit, will the convent allow you to wear a mantilla to Mass? I cover my head in the presence of the Eucharist (I'm sure I'm not the only one on here who does), and I was wondering if a Carmelite Convent would allow me to do that. Does anyone know?

[Aya Sophia]

Can't comment on a live-in in Carmel as haven't had one but I would ask the community if you can wear the mantilla in chapel for this. I can't imagine they would say no! Before receiving the habit, you would probably have a simple veil covering most or all of your hair, as part of your postulant's outfit.

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

razzle dazzle, thanks! Whoa, when I typed c-o-o-l it posted it as razzle dazzle, hm...

Edited October 22, 2011 by FutureCarmeliteClaire

[AccountDeleted]

I was clothed at Wolverhampton. We had much of what faith wrote here but not always the same names.... this is the order we put them on in the morning....


Undies and bra (or singlet - I don't like bras) and in my case pettipants, and for those who wanted them, socks
...changed frequently and sent to wash weekly but done and returned once a fortnight (every two weeks) as each week the wash alternated from 'tunic wash' (all clothes) to 'linen wash' (all sheets, towels, refectory napkins etc)

Tunic - we didn't call the main part of the habit a tunic as faith does, we called that the 'habit' - for us the tunic was the undershirt part - could be something as simple as a t-shirt or the full cotton tunic dress which looks like a nightie - sister's choice depending on weather, temperature etc - when we spoke of the 'tunic wash' we were referring to all underclothes - the 'habits were only washed once a year when they changed from winter to summer and vice versa (they were wool)

Cotte - brown underskirt - below knee length but not to the floor - good for working - cotte had a deep centre front pocket

Toque - the white headpiece that encloses the head and neck - we had a choice of using pins under the chin or having it sewn up permanently - not adjustable that way. I used a straight pin - sometimes this tried to fall out and had to be fixed!

Habit - this is what faith's community called the tunic - goes over everything else. It had a few large and heavy snaps from the neckline down towards the waist, a large opening at the waist to access the centre pocket of the cotte - a small pocket on the right side of the chest for spectacles and a piece of material on the left side for pinning and holding the Profession Crucifix (obviously not used by me!). There were two side pockets in the habit, not as deep as the center one in the cotte. At the hemline on either side and the centre back were large and heavy 'eyes' (as in hook and eye) - kind of like metal rings (unpleasant to kneel on!) for 'tucking up' the habit. The hook was placed in the back of the habit around waist height. Pockets were for a handkerchief (no tissues), a pocket knife, a small prayer book and other little things.

Scapular - was put on after the habit and the toque adjusted to lie flat over each shoulder under the scapular - the scauplars were pinned onto the shoulders of the habit (through the toque) with very large and strong straight pins with a brown bead at the ends that were attached by a strong brown string sewn onto each shoulder of the scapular so they couldn't get lost. They were designed to stop the scapular from moving around or falling off the shoulders. The scapular was one of the most dangerous parts of the habit - could get caught in car doors, make it hard to sit down, fall into the toilet etc etc - one learned to always move the scapular to the side before sitting down, especially when using the DO (or HO at Kirk Edge - the toilet). And the straight pins on the shoulds sometimes stabbed one with ferocity - during my clothing the Habit Sister actually dug one into my skin while pinning it on!

The working veil went on top of the toque and was pinned near the centre of the crown of the head and at the sides - took practice to get this right without mirrors and without getting stuck on the scapular pins!

The chapel veil went on over the working veil and was held in place by one pin only at the top of the head near the front. This was worn in choir at all times and on other more formal occasions (such as Mass) but usually taken off after leaving choir for work (the pin put into the veil) and then placed within easy reach to put back on when not working (for the next Office, or having meals or Recreation or going to the parlour, or any occasion of meeting outsiders such as going to the doctor, etc). A 'Sunday veil' was stored in the cupboard with one's mantle (which was worn during Mass, certain special occasions and during the singing of the Salve on Saturdays). We had three working veils (the bottom ones) - one for wearing, one for spare, and one in the wash - and two chapel veils - one for everyday and one for Sunday.

The last thing to put on was my favourite - the leather belt. It always made me think of Our Lord's words to St Peter when he said to him [b]'someone else will fasten your [color="#000000"]belt[/color] and [color="#000000"]take you where you[/color] don't [color="#000000"]want to go'.[/color][/b]

We could wear cardigans over the scapular or under - but trying to take one off when it was pinned at the shoulders was impossible in a hurry, so I wore one over my habit - didn't look as nice I suppose, but it was quick to take off when I got too hot.

We wore sandals - not the handmade ones - too expensive these days, but we could choose comfortable ones to suit our feet, and for those who had foot problems, they could wear shoes - but they had to be quiet on the wood floors.




I loved the habit - it always felt like it was cuddling me - I don't know how to explain it. I think it worked really well for England's climate. I could not have worn it in Perth - where temps are way over a hundred most of the summer. They were smart to modify their veils - get rid of toques and shorten the habits a little. But I do prefer the long ones with all the trimmings - not uncomfortable at all - bulky and clumsy at first but once one learned how to lift skirts going up and down stairs and sit down without sitting on the scapular and avoid door knobs with the large choir sleeves - well, it became a way of life, and I loved it. I hope to wear a habit again one day - God willing - and although it won't be the same one, I do hope it will be a traditional one that 'cuddles' me

[AccountDeleted]

I meant to include this as well - how to tuck up the habit!

One would first grab the scapular a little below the waist on each side and pull it up and fold it in two, then holding it against the waist with one hand while reaching down with the other to grab the bottom of the habit and pull it up to the waist on top of the scapular. Then sliding boths hands to each side along the hemline (while still holding it against the body and the scapular), locate and hold the 'eyes' at the hemline and slide them onto the centre back hook. This secures the front against the waist (enclosing the scapular). Finally reach back down to the eye at the back of the hemline and pull up the back part of the habit and hook it as well. This tucks up the whole habit. For quick tuck ups, we just used hooked up the sides and left the back down - either way it ended up looking like a 'bustle' that they used to wear in the old days!

[the171]

[quote name='nunsense' timestamp='1319338683' post='2325439']
I meant to include this as well - how to tuck up the habit!

One would first grab the scapular a little below the waist on each side and pull it up and fold it in two, then holding it against the waist with one hand while reaching down with the other to grab the bottom of the habit and pull it up to the waist on top of the scapular. Then sliding boths hands to each side along the hemline (while still holding it against the body and the scapular), locate and hold the 'eyes' at the hemline and slide them onto the centre back hook. This secures the front against the waist (enclosing the scapular). Finally reach back down to the eye at the back of the hemline and pull up the back part of the habit and hook it as well. This tucks up the whole habit. For quick tuck ups, we just used hooked up the sides and left the back down - either way it ended up looking like a 'bustle' that they used to wear in the old days!
[/quote]

someone needs to make a video. haahah