kujo Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 [quote name='Amory' timestamp='1338421364' post='2438207'] Whether or not my comment was bigoted has little if anything to do with its correctness. It seems that you--like others of your persuasion--are just using the "bigot" epithet to dismiss without sufficient argument a point of view you find distasteful. [/quote] I addressed it with roughly the same thought and evidential support as you did. And which "persuasion" are you referring to? A Catholic? A Republican? A straight male pursuing a Master's Degree in Political Science? An Irish-American? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amory Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338421159' post='2438204'] Why can't gay people be athletic coaches, teachers or scout leaders? Being gay doesn't make you a child abuser, nor does is it an evangelical activity. [/quote] If I were the one making hiring decisions, I would certainly choose not to hire those who openly persist in homosexual acts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 [quote name='Anomaly' timestamp='1338421524' post='2438210'] Why can't men go camping with girl scouts, be in the girls shower room when they're the coach, or drive a youth group member home in your car? Being a man doesn't make you a sex fiend and child abuser. [/quote] Men and women are different. The explanation behind the examples of separation you offered is because of the different genders of those involved. Excluding people from working closely with children because they are gay is often based on the misplaced idea that homosexuality is the same thing as pedophilia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 then i guess I am glad you are not the one making the hiring decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 [quote name='Amory' timestamp='1338421807' post='2438215'] If I were the one making hiring decisions, I would certainly choose not to hire those who openly persist in homosexual acts. [/quote] And that would make you guilty of discrimination and liable in civil court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338422065' post='2438221'] And that would make you guilty of discrimination and liable in civil court. [/quote] In other words, some thugs would violate your property rights. floopy the state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amory Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338421712' post='2438214'] I addressed it with roughly the same thought and evidential support as you did.[/quote] I will attempt to provide support (or at least reasoning) for my position now, if what I said above was insufficient. Each of us has a duty to encourage proper morality not only in himself but in society as a whole. Man is a social creature, and his individual wellbeing depends upon that of the society in which he lives. One vice that afflicts human societies is homosexual activity, particularly when done openly. Like other behaviors (both good and bad), the practice of this vice decreases when discouraged by society. Thus, individuals should choose to create and maintain a culture in which homosexual acts are stigmatized. One, fairly simple way to do this is refusing to hire those who consistently and openly engage in such behavior. Historical American culture (and other cultures, particularly early modern ones in the West) was rather successful at decreasing the prevalence of same-sex intercourse by deeming it socially unacceptable. [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338421712' post='2438214'] And which "persuasion" are you referring to? A Catholic? A Republican? A straight male pursuing a Master's Degree in Political Science? An Irish-American? [/quote] I case it wasn't clear from the context of the thread, I was referring to the persuasion that supports the destigmatization of homosexual acts. [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1338422065' post='2438221'] And that would make you guilty of discrimination and liable in civil court. [/quote] That would depend upon the state and (to broaden the scope of this discussion) country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4588686 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 [quote name='qfnol31' timestamp='1338415508' post='2438131'] Metaphysically right concepts can in fact be rationally demonstrated and defended, contrary to popular opinion after 1620. [/quote] If you have an argument that can be demonstrated through rational means that homosexuality is wrong I'd love to hear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4588686 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 [quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1338422971' post='2438226'] In other words, some thugs would violate your property rights. floopy the state. [/quote] I don't see how property rights are a coherent idea outside of the context of a state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socrates Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 (edited) [quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1338421041' post='2438200'] Not bigoted, not unjust. [size=5]"[color=#000000][font=Times]10. "Sexual orientation" does not constitute a quality comparable to race, ethnic background, etc. in respect to non-discrimination. Unlike these, homosexual orientation is an objective disorder (cf. "Letter," No. 3) and evokes moral concern.[/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=Times]11. There are areas in which it is not unjust discrimination to take sexual orientation into account, for example, in the placement of children for adoption or foster care, in employment of teachers or athletic coaches, and in military recruitment.[/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=Times]12. Homosexual persons, as human persons, have the same rights as all persons including the right of not being treated in a manner which offends their personal dignity (cf. No. 10). Among other rights, all persons have the right to work, to housing, etc. [u]Nevertheless, these rights are not absolute. They can be legitimately limited for objectively disordered external conduct. [b]This is sometimes not only licit but obligatory.[/b] This would obtain moreover not only in the case of culpable behavior but even in the case of actions of the physically or mentally ill. Thus it is accepted that the state may restrict the exercise of rights, for example, in the case of contagious or mentally ill persons, in order to protect the common good."[/u][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=Times]--[url="http://www.ewtn.com/library/curia/cdfhomol.htm"]The Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith[/url].[/font][/color][/size] [/quote] Hey bro, in Newchurch nobody gives a poo about the CDF, or other boring Dark Ages holdovers. Now it's all about following the Primacy of one's Conscience, popular opinion, and the Irresistible March of History. The fallible personal opinions of square old white guys like that Ratzinger cat are irrelevant. Today, we have more important people to look to for moral guidance and inspiration, like Lady Gaga. Time you got hip to it, brother. Edited May 31, 2012 by Socrates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 [quote name='Socrates' timestamp='1338425004' post='2438255'] The fallible personal opinions of square old white guys like that Ratzinger cat are irrelevant. Today, we have more important people to look to for moral guidance and inspiration, like Lady Gaga. Time you got hip to it, brother. [/quote] Funny, I always figured you as a Bette Midler type. Duly noted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Bette Midler is a boring old biddy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 [quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1338427677' post='2438280'] Bette Midler is a boring old biddy. [/quote] Yeah but "The Rose" is 2die4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 stop. just stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1338428697' post='2438300'] stop. just stop. [/quote] I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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