Carmelite Customs

[John Paul]

How do the carmelites celebrate death do they take turns praying before the funeral ect.

[John Paul]

So anyone ?

[Nunsense]

This is another one of those 'every community has their own customs' type of answer. What particularly do you want to know?

[John Paul]

Do they pray the Ofiice of the dead?pray with the body till the funeral?

[vee]

The only funeral customs Ive seen are from the movies such as Teresa of the Andes and Im guessing things have changed a bit since.  Im sure calls have to be made such as to the funeral home for arrangements.  Likely the funeral home will come and take the body as well to keep in the cooler until the time of the wake/funeral and burial. If someone dies in the hospital all one has to do is notify a nurse and they will come and make a note of the time of death etc but Im not sure who one would call, likely their physician, if someone dies at home.  They may pray the Office of the Dead, depending on the liturgical calendar though.  If someone died on Christmas they may pray the office for that day instead.  Im pretty sure the Office of the Dead can be done at any time, so if anyone wants to pray it at any time for the souls of their departed loved ones go for it.

[John Paul]

What are the customs on the Teresa of the Andes movie ?

[Nunsense]

The only funeral customs Ive seen are from the movies such as Teresa of the Andes and Im guessing things have changed a bit since.  Im sure calls have to be made such as to the funeral home for arrangements.  Likely the funeral home will come and take the body as well to keep in the cooler until the time of the wake/funeral and burial. If someone dies in the hospital all one has to do is notify a nurse and they will come and make a note of the time of death etc but Im not sure who one would call, likely their physician, if someone dies at home.  They may pray the Office of the Dead, depending on the liturgical calendar though.  If someone died on Christmas they may pray the office for that day instead.  Im pretty sure the Office of the Dead can be done at any time, so if anyone wants to pray it at any time for the souls of their departed loved ones go for it.

​You have it right. Today, not every sister dies in the convent or has her body there before burial. In fact, some convents don't have their own graveyards any more because they either don't have permission from the local Council to use the land for that purpose or (as the case in one US convent), they were looking ahead to a time when they might have to close and decided that if they had to sell the property, they would then have to exhume all the bodies and rebury them elsewhere, at great expense. So yes, traditions have changed since Teresa of the Andes' time.

We used to pray the Office of the Dead once a month in Carmel and also when someone we knew or someone important had died (but not when there was a more important day to celebrate). We often did it on a Friday. When one of the sisters died at another convent (where she was being cared for) we prayed Office of the Dead in our convent, but only two of the sisters went to the funeral because it was not local. The rest of us stayed back in the convent and prayed for her there.

As I said before, every community does things differently. 

[John Paul]

Do the carmelite monks of wyoming  use the pre monastic form of the LOTH.The Tridentine 1570 form or the 1962 breviary

[truthfinder]

Do the carmelite monks of wyoming  use the pre monastic form of the LOTH.The Tridentine 1570 form or the 1962 breviary

​I believe they use the specific Carmelite breviary as it was before the reforms of 1584. 

(Edit: Actually, I can't be 100% sure of that because apparently they are using the 1935 OCarm missal.  Remember that these friars are OCarm derived not OCD). 

Edited April 17, 2015 by truthfinder

[John Paul]

!584 carmelie breviary and the missal of 35 ?

[truthfinder]

!584 carmelie breviary and the missal of 35 ?

​That would be my best guess - you'd have to contact them to be sure.

[John Paul]

I will contact Fr.Joseph Marie  and check .

[graciandelamadrededios]

 PAPER OF EXACTIONS

OF THE

Discalced Carmelite Nuns

OF THE ORDER OF

OUR LADY OF MOUNT CARMEL

taken from

the traditions of our Spanish Mothers and Foundresses.

 

Modesty and religious behaviour.

The Religious Habit requires, of those who have the honor of wearing it, great modesty shining forth at all times and in all places, especially in Choir, in Chapter, in the Refectory, and in walking through the House.

The sisters should be careful to regulate and compose their movements to the best of their power, in honor of the outward bearing of Our Lord and of His Blessed Mother. They should hold themselves upright whether speaking or walking, taking care to walk as quietly as they can. They should be modest and recollected when going about the house, keeping their hands under their Scapular unless they have something to carry. They should avoid turning their head or raising their eyes to look at anything out of curiosity or levity; thus their mortification will show how watchful they are to keep themselves occupied with the thought of the Presence of God. Our Spanish Mothers used sometimes to raise the Scapular of the sisters whom they met, particularly of the Novices, to see if they were holding their Rosary.

They should let no hurry or precipitation be seen in their actions, accustoming themselves to walk at a measured pace, but without being too slow; taking care not to drag their feet, and to make so little noise in walking as not to be heard. Our first Spanish Mothers were most exact in this practice, and strongly recommended it; they used to say that a Carmelite should be seen before she is heard.

When the sisters are sitting in their cells or in their offices, although no one sees them, they should not lie down, nor hold themselves badly. They should not stretch out their feet; but let their attitude be always full of modesty, without any desire to make themselves too comfortable since we ought always to observe a religious mortifica­tion.

Whilst hearing a Sermon, whether in the Choir or in the parlor, still greater care should be taken to be seated in a religious manner, without moving more than can be helped and without turning one's head; bowing when the preacher addresses himself to the Community, and when he pronounces the holy names of Jesus and Mary, and that of our holy Mother St. Teresa. If anyone were asleep, the sister nearest to her should awake her; it has been thus ordained from time immemorial.

They should never complain of little discomforts, such as cold, heat, fatigue, or infirmities, nor of anything disagreeable and mortifying which they may meet with amongst the things given to them for food, clothing, and other necessaries of life. They should be careful not to wear anything that is not clean and in good order.

The Professed sisters should never be without their upper veil, excepting when sweeping or work­ing in the laundry. In a word the mortification of Jesus Christ should at all times regulate and hold in subjection all their senses and all their move­ments both interior and exterior, and this, in all places, and in all their occupations, even the most laborious.

 

 

[graciandelamadrededios]

Primitive Rule and Constitutions for the nuns

of the Order of Notre‑Dame du Mont‑Carmel - 1865

ON THE FAST AND HABITS

1. From the Feast of the Exaltation of the Holy Cross in September until Easter, the Sisters are to fast, except on Sundays. They are never to eat meat, except though necessity, when the Rule so commands.

2. On Fasts of the Church and every Friday, except from Easter to Pentecost, the ordinary fare in the Refectory will not include eggs not dairy products. However, the Prioress can dispense from this requirement the sick, those with special needs and those who are made sick by fish.

3. The habit should be made out of serge, heavy woolen fabric of a smoky [brown] color, no dye used, called in Spanish “Xerga” or “Sayal.” The habit should be as spare as possible.

The sleeves should be straight and of equal length.

The habit should not have peats, be of equal length all around, and should reach down to the feet.

The Scapular should be made of the same material, four fingers shorter than the habit.

The Choir mantle also is to be serge, but white, and equal to the Scapular in length. For this mantle as little cloth as possible should be used in order to avoid superfluity.

The coif should be made of hemp, or rough linen, without pleats. The Scapular is to be worn over the coif.

The sheets are to be of linen or serge, and the cloth on the beds the same.

The footwear will be sandals made of chords that are called Alpargates, and, for the sake of integrity, the material used for the insert for the sandals should be rough like the Robe, cardboard [etoupe] or something similar.

The pillow cases are to be made of the same wool or serge, if necessary linen may be used.

The beds are to be without mattresses, but with palliase [straw mattress] only, for it is found by experience that this is sufficient for the weak and infirm. The beds are to be without curtains or hangings but, in case of necessity, a screen or matting made of rough wool, or another poor material may be used.

Each shall have her own separate bed. Tapestries are not to be used except for the Church, neither are carpets allowed. All this pertains to religion, and should be so. One remarks that by relaxing these rules, one forgets that they pertain to Religion and its obligations.

6. They are to have their hair cut so as not to lose time in combing it.

7. They are not to use mirrors or any frivolous object, but rather to have no self-preoccupation.

 

NOTE: The Rule and Constitutions observed during the time of St. Therese
 

 

 

[Therese1895]

On 6/26/2013 at 6:12 PM, Chiquitunga said:

For example Poor Clares typically eat a very small breakfast, really just bread and coffee, then a good size lunch, which is their main meal, and a small dinner (collation).  Are the Carmelites similar? 

 

Yes, Discalced Carmelites are very similar. It also depends on the time of the year. Their diet is a little more austere, if that's the right term here, from September 14th (Feast of the Exaltation of the Holy Cross) until Easter. Outside of that time, their breakfast is a little larger/has more variety like fruit, a sweet roll (depending on the particular Carmel of course) and collation is a little larger also. 

 

Speaking of diets, the JMJ Carmels (Valparaiso, Elysburg & Canyon) actually do not allow caffeinated drinks at all. Their coffee and tea is all decaf. They made this decision because some of the Sisters in Valparaiso were having trouble sleeping. I have never heard of this at any other Carmel however. Usually a cup of caffeinated coffee can be taken at breakfast and/or dinner (the mid-day larger meal)

I remember that we would have caffeinated coffee available on feastdays- but clearly marked! After a while some of the Sisters developed hyper-sensitivity to caffeine. Chiquitunga- could I PM you?

On 6/4/2013 at 3:49 PM, Chiquitunga said:

bookfinder.com is great!! Those shorter volumes of Divine Intimacy are a version of it re-arranged with the new/Ordinary Form calendar. I believe Buffalo Carmel probably still has copies of the old one volume leather version for $25

A number of Carmels read from DI before their mediation time every day. The JMJ Carmels even require those entering to bring their own personal copy when they enter.

With much love and respect, that is no longer asked. The only books required are a Bible, missal and Liber Usualis. An Imitation is highly recommended, as well as any other holy books you may have.

[CountrySteve937]

I would love to learn more about the customs of the Friars. Would you be able to recommend any literature on the topic?

[Chiquitunga]

Praised be Jesus Christ! Really quick, I am looking for where specifically the cross without a corpus on the wall of a cell in Carmel comes from. A friend asked me about it for a research project. Gracian, do you have in any of your books a specific reference to this? I've known forever that this is the custom in Carmel, but cannot find any specific reference to it in either the Constitutions (1926) or Ceremonial from the 20's. Those are the two main books that I have. 

Thanks if you can help 

[Nunsuch]

38 minutes ago, Chiquitunga said:

Praised be Jesus Christ! Really quick, I am looking for where specifically the cross without a corpus on the wall of a cell in Carmel comes from. A friend asked me about it for a research project. Gracian, do you have in any of your books a specific reference to this? I've known forever that this is the custom in Carmel, but cannot find any specific reference to it in either the Constitutions (1926) or Ceremonial from the 20's. Those are the two main books that I have. 

Thanks if you can help 

While this is not a formal reference, Mother Catherine Thomas, in her memoir "My Beloved," talks about this and says that it symbolizes that the Carmelite is to take the place of Christ on the Cross. I could find the exact quote if anyone wants it, as I have the book--but not by my side as I write.

[Chiquitunga]

Thanks nunsuch! I remember it being there and talked about in many other Carmelite works, but I was wondering, is there a place like their Constitutions or customary, something like that that gracian seems to have lots of knowledge of, that regulates this for all Carmels? In the Constitutions there are rules about a lot of specific things like this, and simplicity of the cell it talks about as well, but it doesn't actually mention the Cross.. so yeah, wondering.

I wonder also if/when Holy Mother St Teresa started this for her reform, or if it was used by other Orders as well, or the Incarnation. Or rather, it's my friend wondering this, but now me too!

that's a good reminder though, to take a look in My Beloved to see if it references anything, or has a little about its origins. A Few Lines to Tell You too

[graciandelamadrededios]

On 2/10/2017 at 6:45 PM, Chiquitunga said:

Praised be Jesus Christ! Really quick, I am looking for where specifically the cross without a corpus on the wall of a cell in Carmel comes from. A friend asked me about it for a research project. Gracian, do you have in any of your books a specific reference to this? I've known forever that this is the custom in Carmel, but cannot find any specific reference to it in either the Constitutions (1926) or Ceremonial from the 20's. Those are the two main books that I have. 

Thanks if you can help 

Hi Chiqui!

I need to check my copy of custom book which originated from a French Carmel.  

Please refer to:

"It doesn't take much work to empty the cell of a Carmelite.  There are so few things in it!  The furnishings include a wooden board on which a straw mattress rests and a large wooden cross without the figure of Christ, "a dry" cross, as Saint John of the Cross would say.  The cross reminds the Carmeltie that she must crucify herself in imitation of her Divine Spouse." Page 405

 

"In the Prioress' cell there is no cross, but only a small table.  This custom may derive from the fact that the Mother Prioress has enough crosses with her office." Page 406

 

From the book: Following the Path of Divine Love: Saint Maravillas, O.C.D., Daughter of the Church and of Saint Teresa of Jesus by the Discalced Carmelites of Cerro de los Angeles and La Aldehuela, Spain.  Translated to English by the Carmelite Nuns of Bufallo, New York, 2011.