Interview With Pope Francis In America Magazine

[Apotheoun]

Era,

 

Just to be clear: I recognize that Pope Francis is the duly elected bishop of Rome, so I really do not understand why you emphasized in one of your earlier posts that Francis is the pope. Have I ever denied that he is the pope? I do not remember doing that. Nevertheless, I do not have an ultramontanist view of papal authority. Maybe Roman Catholics are now attributing pontifical importance to media interviews, but I see no reason to do that myself.

 

God grant you many years.

[Apotheoun]

Um, Pope Francis lives a life of vowed poverty, chastity, and obedience. The man has been living a life of action his whole life. It's unfortunate that you can't appreciate the witness of a man who has lived and thought deeply about following Christ. I don't agree with everything he says either, but I don't need to agree with everything someone says to recognize when something special has come along, and indeed, what Pope Francis says in this interview is very prophetic.

Does the pope worry about where he will live tomorrow? Does the pope worry if he will have an evening meal. It is easy to be poor when you are pope.

[Era Might]

Era,

 

Just to be clear: I recognize that Pope Francis is the duly elected bishop of Rome, so I really do not understand why you emphasized in one of your earlier posts that Francis is the pope. Have I ever denied that he is the pope? I do not remember doing that. Nevertheless, I do not have an ultramontanist view of papal authority. Maybe Roman Catholics are now attributing pontifical importance to media interviews, but I see no reason to do that myself.

 

God grant you many years.

 

It's not prophetic because he's the pope. It's prophetic because he is a man with a special charism shaped by his many years as a Jesuit, and is saying something very profound about the life of the church and the hearts of Christians.

[Apotheoun]

It's not prophetic because he's the pope. It's prophetic because he is a man with a special charism shaped by his many years as a Jesuit, and is saying something very profound about the life of the church and the hearts of Christians.

I see, so it is not because he is the pope; instead it is because you personally believe that he has a special charism, and that is what makes what he says important. Prove to me that he has this special charism.

Edited September 23, 2013 by Apotheoun

[Apotheoun]

I respect Pope Francis because he holds the office of the bishop of Rome, but that does not mean that I have to agree with everything he says in the media.

[Era Might]

I see, so it is not because he is the pope; instead it is because you personally believe that he has a special charism, and that is what makes what he says important. Prove to me that he has this special charism.

 

Hold on, I'll write up the theorem to prove it.

[Era Might]

I respect Pope Francis because he holds the office of the bishop of Rome, but that does not mean that I have to agree with everything he says in the media.

 

That's fine. But I appreciate the witness Pope Francis has given here. Ignatius has spoken through Francis, and it's a remarkable interview.

[Apotheoun]

Hold on, I'll write up the theorem to prove it.

Thanks, you said all I needed to know in this post.

[Apotheoun]

That's fine. But I appreciate the witness Pope Francis has given here. Ignatius has spoken through Francis, and it's a remarkable interview.

I am glad for you. I suppose we will have to agree to disagree as far as the interview is concerned.

[Apotheoun]

Era, I am glad that you see something special in Pope Francis, and I hope that that feeling gives you comfort. 

 

I see something special in many of the people I interact with in my own life, and you might agree with me about some of them, and not about others. 

 

I suppose these types of feelings must simply be a part of the mystery of human existence.

[Era Might]

 

Era, I am glad that you see something special in Pope Francis, and I hope that that feeling gives you comfort. 

 

I see something special in many of the people I interact with in my own life, and you might agree with me about some of them, and not about others. 

 

I suppose these types of feelings must simply be a part of the mystery of human existence.

 

 

Yes, there are moments of grace in many areas of life. But when it converges on such a major stage, such as the Papacy, and such unique circumstances, such as a Jesuit Pope, then it becomes part of the stream of history and not merely personal experience. Unfortunately, I don't think what the Pope is saying will be much received, and the people who understand what he is saying are probably already doing the transformative work he is speaking about.

[Apotheoun]

Yes, there are moments of grace in many areas of life. But when it converges on such a major stage, such as the Papacy, and such unique circumstances, such as a Jesuit Pope, then it becomes part of the stream of history and not merely personal experience. Unfortunately, I don't think what the Pope is saying will be much received, and the people who understand what he is saying are probably already doing the transformative work he is speaking about.

For you that may be true, but I see no "special charism." For me Pope Francis is the bishop of Rome, and because he holds that office he is important to Catholics, most especially to Roman Catholics. But I do not consider him to be any more special than Pope Benedict or Pope John Paul II. I liked Pope Benedict greatly, but I never would have claimed that he had some "special charism" that made him important; instead, he was important because he was the Patriarch of the Roman Church.

Edited September 23, 2013 by Apotheoun

[Era Might]

For you that may be true, but I see no "special charism." For me Pope Francis is the bishop of Rome, and because he holds that office he is important to Catholics, most especially to Roman Catholics. But I do not consider him to be any more special than Pope Benedict or Pope John Paul II. I liked Pope Benedict greatly, but I never would have claimed that he had some "special charism" that made him important; instead, he was important because he was the Patriarch of the Roman Church.

 

I believe God works through people and their charisms. If I had not not known the person being interviewed was a Pope, I still would be humbled at the profound things he has to say. He just happens to be the Pope. And as his comments suggest, that could work against him...as he says, the prophetic and the institutional do not coincide.

[Apotheoun]

I do not have a problem with that, but I just do not see this "special charism" that you are talking about when it comes to Pope Francis. If anything I am somewhat unimpressed by his pontificate so far.

[Era Might]

I do not have a problem with that, but I just do not see this "special charism" that you are talking about when it comes to Pope Francis. If anything I am somewhat unimpressed by his pontificate so far.

 

It's unfortunate that for a man who has served Christ as a Jesuit priest, bishop, and now Pope, you cannot see any special charism in what this man brings to the church and the world. It's kind of ironic that you are criticizing him for what you perceive as his failure to meet your standard of how the Gospel should live and move in the world, and yet here is a man whose entire life has been given over to the Gospel, in a very literal way: poverty, chastity, and obedience. If you are unimpressed, perhaps it is because you seek signs and wonders, and cannot see in this interview a man giving birth to Christ in much of what he is saying. If I were in a conversation with him, I would love to discuss much of what he says...respecting someone does not mean agreeing with every nuance of what they say. But it is a travesty when a wise man speaks, and the deep truth of what he says gets drowned out in petty nuances. I don't know how anyone reading this interview could come away thinking: well, so much for truth and morality. If anyone follows what Francis is saying, it is that Christ is everything, not our self-righteousness, not our sin, not our ideologies, not our knowledge, but Christ is all in all, and that to follow him as Pope Francis has done is a profound journey. I'm sorry you cannot see a special charism in a man who is overflowing with it.