Guns As A " God-given Right"

[Norseman82]

I am managed by the state. According to the state, the employer is the people.

 

If that is the case, the same can be said about the police, the DEA, the FBI, etc.

[Winchester]

If that is the case, the same can be said about the police, the DEA, the FBI, etc.

 

It is.

 

Are you interpreting that as a justification? It's not meant as one. It's a clarification, only.

[StMichael]

Funny how this is not understood, yet many believe you have a right to be protected, which does not exist.

 

Another funny thing, prior to 1969 an eight year old  could go into any gun store and purchase a gun and bullets. No ID. No background checks, etc. Never any mass shootings or school shootings.

 

But back to your question of why America instituted a 2nd Amendment. Over the course of time, the first thing a tyrannical government takes away is your arms, this happened to the Jews in Germany, the Russians under Lenin, the Chinese under Mao, the Cubans under Castro, etc. The Constitution was created where fear of the people would keep the government in check (whereas fear of the government and its whimsy is tyranny). So the 2nd Amendment protects the other amendments.

 

As for the founders:

 

"A free people ought to be armed."
- George Washington

 

"The Constitution of most of our states (and of the United States) assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed."

- Thomas Jefferson

 

"Arms in the hands of citizens may be used at individual discretion in private self defense."

- John Adams

 

Of course, we are now faced with a society that is far more secular, horrific images fill their everyday (video games, the news, online, etc.) Look at the 12 year olds who attempted to kill their friend for a belief in something called Slenderman (this is also connected to another girl who killed or tried to kill her mother and few others.).  I wonder how the Bundy Ranch situation would have turned out if armed citizens were not present?

 

Yes, we have plenty of illegal guns on the street (look at Chicago where their unconstitutional laws prevent ownership, it is practically the wild west) and we have broken families that beget these young men to act like animals. There are a host of causes, but none lie in the ownership of a gun, rifle, etc. Yes, you will hear how the Santa Barbara killings could have been prevented, but that man's first 3 kills were not with a gun, but a knife. The very police we look to for help, while being militarized, are doing a poor job in assessing some of these criminals (and that is what they are). The Santa Barbara murderer didn't slip through the cracks, they had him and blew it. He would have found other ways to perform his evil.

 

Sen. Feinstein (CA) has a conceal carry permit, if you live in CA, you can't get this (unconstitutional), is her life more valuable then say the owner of a silicon valley business who is denied the same? 

 

As an American, I have a right, a God given right to protect my life, the lives of my family, etc. which no politician has been granted such a right to tell me or anyone else your life is nothing and you don't need it. 

 

Think of the people that could have been saved in Santa Barbara or Virgina or wherever people are stripped of their ability to protect themselves. It is like shooting fish in a barrel. The Colorado shooter (I forget where), avoided all the movie theaters that allowed open carry and targeted the one that was within a no carry area. 

 

And then there is the lack of familiarity with guns by those who are not around them (that would be me), we are taught to be afraid of them to a point where this piece of metal is the epitome of evil. Talk to a gun owner, let them take you to a range, hold it, hit the target. You fully understand the power of this and how it needs full respect. In fact, those I have met have nothing but the highest regard for life and have no interest in ever putting to use their skills, nor do they brag or ever hold a hand gun sideways.

 

Even the police would rather have us armed, not against them, but the crime rate plummets in areas where there are legal, law abiding gun owners.

 

Sorry about the long winded post, but there was a time where I didn't quite get it until I realized, I am fully responsible for my own well being and can't sue the police department if they didn't protect me or my family. We are on our own at 2 am when some hapless idiot breaks into your home, who are you turning to then? The phone?

 

 

 

Can someone explain this to me? I just don't see how guns are an inherent right as human beings. Life, education, proper medical care, these are human rights. How is shaped metal that shoots shaped metal a human right? I don't understand this line of thinking, and I've been led to believe that the only reason people say it is is because 'Murica. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. I can't promise you'll change my opinion, but I am genuinely curious as to how this logic works.

 

[KnightofChrist]

They might be more right or more wrong. It wouldn't change the fact that they're interpreting.

It doesn't matter.

[Socrates]

Well that's just your subjective human interpretation man. Someone else could hold a equally valid subjective interpretation that the State is god and you and everyone else its happy little slaves and be no more right or wrong than you. 

 

There is no State, and there are no anarchists.

 

It's all illusory, man.

 

 

*takes another toke*

 

Heavy, man.

[Winchester]

[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ePTZezN_Iw[/media]

[superblue]

Sometimes I find discerning your wit and wisdom as difficult as a squirrel attacking a lion. Please clarify for this squirrel, the concept of a State is inherently evil?

 Evidently you underestimate the kung foo of the squirrel !

[superblue]

 

http://news.yahoo.com/two-men-girl-human-shield-until-her-father-040007545.html;_ylt=A0LEV0JKfZpTgUoAl7BXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTEzYTdnaDI2BHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMQRjb2xvA2JmMQR2dGlkA1ZJUDQ1M18x

 CURSE THOSE STUPID AMERICANS WHO HOLD ONTO THE SECOND AMENDMENT SO MUCH, GET WITH THE REST OF THE WORLD ALREADY, GUNS ARE BAD !

[Norseman82]

It is.

 

Are you interpreting that as a justification? It's not meant as one. It's a clarification, only.

 

I'm just noting the irony of your anti-state rants while you yourself are employed/managed by them.  It calls to mind the line in the Godfather part 2 where Michael Corleone tells Senator Geary "we're part of the same hypocrisy". 

[Norseman82]

Sometimes I find discerning your wit and wisdom as difficult as a squirrel attacking a lion. Please clarify for this squirrel, the concept of a State is inherently evil?

 

 

 Evidently you underestimate the kung foo of the squirrel !

 

[Winchester]

I'm just noting the irony of your anti-state rants while you yourself are employed/managed by them.  It calls to mind the line in the Godfather part 2 where Michael Corleone tells Senator Geary "we're part of the same hypocrisy". 

I made a Morpheus meme about it some time ago. I've also mocked my situation in here.

 

The inherently evil portion of my job is the mechanism by which I get my money. 

[superblue]

Funny how this is not understood, yet many believe you have a right to be protected, which does not exist.

 

Another funny thing, prior to 1969 an eight year old  could go into any gun store and purchase a gun and bullets. No ID. No background checks, etc. Never any mass shootings or school shootings.

 

But back to your question of why America instituted a 2nd Amendment. Over the course of time, the first thing a tyrannical government takes away is your arms, this happened to the Jews in Germany, the Russians under Lenin, the Chinese under Mao, the Cubans under Castro, etc. The Constitution was created where fear of the people would keep the government in check (whereas fear of the government and its whimsy is tyranny). So the 2nd Amendment protects the other amendments.

 

As for the founders:

 

"A free people ought to be armed."
- George Washington

( until they threaten to dismantle the republican and democratic parties that are destroying this country )

 

"The Constitution of most of our states (and of the United States) assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed."

- Thomas Jefferson

 

( unless it is a white man defending himself from a black man who is perpetrating a crime that is considered racist , there must be rules in place which prevent racists from getting guns )

 

"Arms in the hands of citizens may be used at individual discretion in private self defense."

- John Adams

 

( Only in the State of Texas, all other states, good luck and expect your butt to be dragged into court. )

 

 

 

 

Even the police would rather have us armed, not against them, but the crime rate plummets in areas where there are legal, law abiding gun owners.  ( now you know the only ones we can really trust to tell us who should have a fire arm is the government more over the democratic party, if they say only the police and federal agents should have them, then by gosh we should listen an respect them because they are more educated than the rest of us. )

 

Sorry about the long winded post, but there was a time where I didn't quite get it until I realized, I am fully responsible for my own well being and can't sue the police department if they didn't protect me or my family. We are on our own at 2 am when some hapless idiot breaks into your home, who are you turning to then? The phone?

 

 

The posts for keeping our right to bear arms always needs to be long winded and very detailed, as sarcasm flies over the heads of those against the second amendment.  

 

And someone answer this,  if the second amendment were to be removed, and Americans no longer had the right to own any firearm for any reason, who are we to turn to if and when the day comes that a president or anyone else in the government decides to go on a door to door raid for any reason, as what happened during the Boston Bombing.  Raiding those homes did absolutely nothing, and incase anyone forgot, the kid was found in the back yard of a boat and reported by the home owner.  Those door to door raids were nothing but an exercise in prepping Americans to be conditioned to such acts.

 

Or are we to each send a petition to the UN to come and save us when our government crosses a line ? Or are we to rely on military generals who are more concerned about their prestigious rank and esteem to suddenly drop that, risk the safety of their retirement and lively hoods and send a counter order to not obey a direct order from the commander in chief ? Or are we to rely on an out gunned police force to protect us from a military that will blindly follow any order ?

 

Who are we as a Free people to really trust 100% with our lives and freedom if we give up our right to protect ourselves with a fire arm of our choice.

[Winchester]

If the second were removed, it would not amount to an enumerated power.

[Norseman82]

 

 

But back to your question of why America instituted a 2nd Amendment. Over the course of time, the first thing a tyrannical government takes away is your arms, this happened to the Jews in Germany, the Russians under Lenin, the Chinese under Mao, the Cubans under Castro, etc. The Constitution was created where fear of the people would keep the government in check (whereas fear of the government and its whimsy is tyranny). So the 2nd Amendment protects the other amendments.

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lDb0Dn8OXE

 

 (look at Chicago where their unconstitutional laws prevent ownership, it is practically the wild west)

 

Actually, Chicago was forced to scrap the handgun ban after the Heller and McDonald decisions.  However, there is still an anti-gun bias among the local pols, such adopting a broad definition of "assault weapon".

Edited June 13, 2014 by Norseman82

[superblue]

If the second were removed, it would not amount to an enumerated power.

 

 

That is a crock, because if it were the case, the founders would not have bothered with it in the first place, but that is the least of our worries with a two party political machine that is constantly working together to make sure the other stays in power and no one else can rock the boat.

 

And if you trust the military to always do the right thing at all times, and has the best interest for the country, and will not just blindly follow orders, history has already proven that wrong, and in those instances, the police were no where around to stop them nor could they even if they wanted to, at least not with out a real fight.

Edited June 13, 2014 by superblue