Best, Complete, Factual Account Of What's Happening In Ferguson

[4588686]

This thread makes me ashamed to be white.

Mainly due to the fact everyone here is claiming it's a white v. Black thing.

No you clowns. It's a Blue thing.

Cops no longer serve and protect. They enforce and execute. Bunch of unprofessional Barney Fifes acting like they're BAMFs on the street because they passed a two month academy. These guys have no idea what the constitution is.

There are 18 and 19 year olds in Afghanistan who understand and execute escalation of force procedures better then 6 year vet cops. And those kids are actually in a war zone. They face actual death and combat every day.

It would be great if we could have all the facts, but gee I wonder who is holding on to them? Certainly not the civilians in Ferguson. That would be the cops, who will close ranks as usual and fumble away any and all evidence.

This stuff is happening everywhere in America. Happened in NY a week prior. But Darren Wilson will get a fair trial, something Mike Brown never got as he was gunned down 40ft away from his executer.

 

 

The mindset seems to be changing.  My Uncle was a cop who worked narcotics in a rough part of New Jersey for years.  And when they did raids they did raids.  They arrested some bad folks.  But there was a sense of proportionality and they sought to deescalate situations.  

 

My uncle did not want to be a soldier.  He wanted to be a cop.  

 

Now my best friends dates a cop.  He always wanted to be a soldier.  So did most of his friends who are also cops.  But they became cops instead.    They patrol an extremely safe and affluent community.  They giggle about having AR-15s and constantly do training for all kinds of insane scenarios.  When some idiot hipsters 'occupied' an abandoned building they sent in a SWAT team. 

 

We have a bunch of cops these days who don't want to be cops.  They want to be soldiers.  And that's fine.  But if they want to be soldiers and carry out massive raids with assault weapons then they need to go enlist in the Army or the Marines.  

 

We need cops who want to be cops.  

[4588686]

[Lilllabettt]

a person does not get a "fair trial" if the only reason they are indicted is because of political pressure from the community (see State v. Zimmerman).

that's called a political prosecution.

Although it is one step up from "show trial," which is when a guilty verdict is a foregone conclusion (see "To Kill A Mockingbird")

Which itself is one step up from "mob justice" (see Atticus Finch sitting outside lockup with a shotgun)

 

 

There are 18 and 19 year olds in Afghanistan who understand and execute escalation of force procedures better then 6 year vet cops. And those kids are actually in a war zone. They face actual death and combat every day.

 

You are right that there is a fundamental difference between police and military that is too often blurred. 

Police are "peace officers." Their raison d'etre is peace. Soldiers are war-makers - their job is to kill, destroy, etc. Problems arise when the police make war and soldiers are sent to make peace. 

 

[Winchester]

No, there isn't a difference. Everyone on this planet has the right to protect life and property. Nobody has a mission to "destroy". That's fictional garbage. The mission of the military is the same as any other force that forms to fight an evil. It's not that police are militarized, it's that they are focused on making people comply with their orders and the orders of worthless scumbags in political office.

 

This special moral rules BS has taken hold of everyone. Nobody is special. Nobody is exempt from the moral order. 

[Winchester]

This thread makes me ashamed to be white.

 

You should give up collectivism. It's stupid.

[Lilllabettt]

No, there isn't a difference. Everyone on this planet has the right to protect life and property. Nobody has a mission to "destroy". That's fictional garbage. The mission of the military is the same as any other force that forms to fight an evil. It's not that police are militarized, it's that they are focused on making people comply with their orders and the orders of worthless scumbags in political office.

 

This special moral rules BS has taken hold of everyone. Nobody is special. Nobody is exempt from the moral order. 

 

 

Yes, the military may be formed to fight evil. They fight. Police do not exist to fight. They exist to keep peace.

if a man joins the police because he wants to conquer and destroy the enemy, etc. he is in the wrong line of work.  If a man joins the military because he wants to build civil society and protect the weak he is in the wrong line of work.  

The military is not for protecting the weak, the military is for destroying the bad guys.

The police are not for destroying the bad guys, they are for protecting the weak. 

Yes, sometimes the one thing involves doing the other but the basic orientation is different. 

They should attract different kinds of people who want to do different kinds of things. 

[Winchester]

Yes, the military may be formed to fight evil. They fight. Police do not exist to fight. They exist to keep peace.

if a man joins the police because he wants to conquer and destroy the enemy, etc. he is in the wrong line of work.  If a man joins the military because he wants to build civil society and protect the weak he is in the wrong line of work.  

The military is not for protecting the weak, the military is for destroying the bad guys.

The police are not for destroying the bad guys, they are for protecting the weak. 

Yes, sometimes the one thing involves doing the other but the basic orientation is different. 

They should attract different kinds of people who want to do different kinds of things. 

 

 

You believe in special exemptions for the moral order. I don't. 

[Winchester]

“The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him.”--GK Chesterton.

 

This is true of everyone who sets himself up as a protector. Costume, title, etcetera, mean nothing. You can go as far as to defend life. Sometimes, that requires taking the life of aggressors.

 

Total war has never been and will never be compatible with Catholicity. Soldiers are peace officers facing a more aggressive, organized, and numerous enemy of life, in stages well beyond the beginnings or aftermath of conflicts with which police deal.

[Lilllabettt]

You believe in special exemptions for the moral order. I don't. 

 

 

well I'm not talking about an "ideal" world, I'm talking about the world as it exists right now, the one with cops and soldiers who wear special uniforms and are special. 

[Lilllabettt]

“The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him.”--GK Chesterton.

 

Yes.

Soldiers love their home, so they go out to vanquish their home's enemy. They are going to undermine the progress, the welfare of the enemy.

Police are not supposed to set out to vanquish anybody. Their mission is not raining hellfire on badguys.

They are different jobs. If you think they are the same then that's the problem right there. 

 

The moment cops are asked and outfitted to work like soldiers in warzones (and some American neighborhoods are warzones) there are problems. Same thing with soldiers being asked to patrol like cops, and we're not sure who the enemy is, and also here are some really complex rules of engagement, but basically don't shoot anyone. 

[Credo in Deum]

[veritasluxmea]

[Anastasia13]

Ok, time to start following this news story. It's a little less scary than ebola. God save those people.

[Winchester]

well I'm not talking about an "ideal" world, I'm talking about the world as it exists right now, the one with cops and soldiers who wear special uniforms and are special. 

Oh. I thought you were involving morality. 

 

I like to say things like "Stealing is wrong", not "When you steal, you need to be nice about it." Since we don't live in an ideal world where people don't steal.

[Winchester]

Yes.

Soldiers love their home, so they go out to vanquish their home's enemy. They are going to undermine the progress, the welfare of the enemy.

Police are not supposed to set out to vanquish anybody. Their mission is not raining hellfire on badguys.

They are different jobs. If you think they are the same then that's the problem right there. 

 

The moment cops are asked and outfitted to work like soldiers in warzones (and some American neighborhoods are warzones) there are problems. Same thing with soldiers being asked to patrol like cops, and we're not sure who the enemy is, and also here are some really complex rules of engagement, but basically don't shoot anyone. 

Yes, I understand your position. Your focus is wrong. You have a bad premise regarding the use of violence and protection of life.