Are Liberal Arts Degrees Worth It?

[Maggyie]

Liberal Arts degrees can be incredibly useful, especially if you plan carefully to avoid debt. Certain degrees like sociology and theology are relatively useless if you are planning to pursue them at the undergraduate level only.

If you are planning to become a PhD, obviously do the major. Otherwise you aren't going to get much value, intellectual or otherwise, from the degree. My mother's psychiatrist once told me that the undergrad psych majors were given just enough education to feel like they know more than the general population, and not nearly enough education to actually know anything about the field. 

Theology is similar. I once had an argument on here with an FUS theology grad who insisted that "giving the bride away" is part of the Catholic marriage rite. Of course, this concept is completely antithetical to orthodox sacramental theology and is not part of the rite, pre Vatican II or post.

However many theology undergrad students spend tens of thousands of dollars to not know these basics. That's because the undergraduate degree in these topics merely gives a foundational understanding of the field, it is not meant to confer expertise. 

[PhuturePriest]

Liberal Arts degrees can be incredibly useful, especially if you plan carefully to avoid debt. Certain degrees like sociology and theology are relatively useless if you are planning to pursue them at the undergraduate level only.

If you are planning to become a PhD, obviously do the major. Otherwise you aren't going to get much value, intellectual or otherwise, from the degree. My mother's psychiatrist once told me that the undergrad psych majors were given just enough education to feel like they know more than the general population, and not nearly enough education to actually know anything about the field. 

Theology is similar. I once had an argument on here with an FUS theology grad who insisted that "giving the bride away" is part of the Catholic marriage rite. Of course, this concept is completely antithetical to orthodox sacramental theology and is not part of the rite, pre Vatican II or post.

However many theology undergrad students spend tens of thousands of dollars to not know these basics. That's because the undergraduate degree in these topics merely gives a foundational understanding of the field, it is not meant to confer expertise. 

​Oh, I fully intended to get a masters in the field of theology. But all of this depends upon my discernment, of course.

[Maggyie]

​Oh, I fully intended to get a masters in the field of theology. But all of this depends upon my discernment, of course.

But a Masters in theology has no advantage to a bachelors. The terminal degree is what you want. 

[veritasluxmea]

But a Masters in theology has no advantage to a bachelors. The terminal degree is what you want. 

​idk is that just theology? I'm studying English for secondary education, and most teachers go on to get their masters. They're more likely to get hired then someone with just a bachelor's. 

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

​idk is that just theology? I'm studying English for secondary education, and most teachers go on to get their masters. They're more likely to get hired then someone with just a bachelor's.

​Yes, it's different for every major, and for what you want to do with the major. For example, for most employers, a Master's in Business (MBA) is sufficient for a professional job even at the highest level, and unless, for example, a person wants to teach at the university level, there would be no need to get a Doctoral degree.

And, you're right about teaching. Lots of teachers, especially those who want to teach at the secondary level, get their Master's. (I think many/most school districts in the U.S. pay teachers with a Master's a higher salary.) In some states in the U.S., a Bachelor's degree is not sufficient to qualify as a teacher (even an elementary school teacher), and teachers must get a Bachelor's and then go for another year of school to get a teaching certificate.

So, when making long-term plans, it's important not only to know the minimum education an employer normally requires for the position you're interested in, but also, the minimum education required if your proposed career requires professional certification by the state or some other body.

Edited April 11, 2015 by IgnatiusofLoyola

[Lilllabettt]

HIgh-five from a fellow pell grantee. 

they're not worth it if you have to take out private loans. period, end of sentence.

federal loans, even a huge amount of federal loans, will rarely get you in trouble.

I take that first part back. I had a roommate at harvard who was a trust fund baby. Millions of bucks in the bank, not accessible until age 25. I've heard rumors of these people's existence before but she was my first actual encounter. Her parents income (they had real estate) counted against her, so she paid full sticker price for school and borrowed it all privately. She will be fine, on account of being a trust fund baby.

So they're not worth it if you have to take out private loans and you are not a trust fund baby. 

 

Edited April 11, 2015 by Lilllabettt

[Lilllabettt]

​idk is that just theology? I'm studying English for secondary education, and most teachers go on to get their masters. They're more likely to get hired then someone with just a bachelor's. 

​that's not necessarily true, either. A masters degree will make you more expensive to hire and the nature of a principal's job is to be a  bean counter. It's a shame, but often they prefer a little less experience and education for that reason. 

Most teachers I know recommend getting into a district you like early in your career, if possible, and then staying put and getting a masters degree (and the salary boost) once you have tenure. I have an Ed.M and I didn't  do it that way ... but I didn't really want to go back into teaching. 

[tinytherese]

But a Masters in theology has no advantage to a bachelors. The terminal degree is what you want. 

If you want to be a professor, then yes you'll need to either have a phd or be pursuing it. Even then, you still may not be able to find a full-time professor position. Theology professors don't appear to be in demand. 

Some jobs at parishes or for a diocese require a masters degree plus experience. Others want a bachelors degree and experience. There are not a lot of either of those jobs anyway. 

[truthfinder]

Yes, the teaching thing is one where you must consider both the legalities and the current practice of schools where you might want to teach.  Where I'm from, just about every teacher has a BA or a BSc plus a BEd (which depending on where they do the schooling or what level they want to teach at is a one or two year program).  It used to be that a BEd was sufficient (at the time it was a four year program) but you will rarely find these in teachers anymore because they ended about twenty years ago.  Teachers rarely do MEd's until after they've begun teaching (unless they are specializing in teaching for special needs students).  Some will get extra certification for teaching math or chemistry or the like, but most MEds are reserved for those who want to join administration - it's general practice in my province that all people in principal roles must have a masters.  

On the pay frame, having a masters in anything will automatically get you paid 8-10 thousand dollars more over another candidate.   

[PhuturePriest]

But a Masters in theology has no advantage to a bachelors. The terminal degree is what you want. 

​You're assuming I want to go into something like teaching, which I don't. Or at least not at a school, anyway.

[PhuturePriest]

Good news: I attended accepted student day earlier at the aforementioned university I was accepted in. I asked all of my rather important questions, got satisfactory answers, and received an incredibly satisfactory financial aid package that I never could have dreamed of getting at a State school. I'll be paying very little at the end of the day for my schooling, and my debt at the end will not be substantial enough to harm me in any major way financially.

[PhuturePriest]

But a Masters in theology has no advantage to a bachelors. The terminal degree is what you want. 

​What is a "terminal" degree, out of curiosity? Sounds like a real job killer, if you ask me.

But really, what is it?

Edited April 12, 2015 by PhuturePriest

[puellapaschalis]

The last degree you can earn in a field. Normally refers to some sort of doctorate.

[Catlick]

Lots of talk about money here. 

More important is the high price paid by the souls of many students in the humanities. If you let them, these academics completely brainwash you with Satan's lies: feminism, postcolonialism, 'antiracism', 'qwerty theories', etc. etc. 

As a history graduate I'd advice young people to study something more useful during the day (law, chemistry) and serious orthodox theology during the night. 

Edited April 12, 2015 by Catlick

[PhuturePriest]

Lots of talk about money here. 

More important is the high price paid by the souls of many students in the humanities. If you let them, these academics completely brainwash you with Satan's lies: feminism, postcolonialism, 'antiracism', 'qwerty theories', etc. etc. 

As a history graduate I'd advice young people to study something more useful during the day (law, chemistry) and serious orthodox theology during the night. 

​I'm attending a solid Catholic University, not UCLA.

[PhuturePriest]

The last degree you can earn in a field. Normally refers to some sort of doctorate.

​That doesn't sound expensive or time-consuming at all.

[Lilllabettt]

Lots of talk about money here. 

More important is the high price paid by the souls of many students in the humanities. If you let them, these academics completely brainwash you with Satan's lies: feminism, postcolonialism, 'antiracism', 'qwerty theories', etc. etc. 

As a history graduate I'd advice young people to study something more useful during the day (law, chemistry) and serious orthodox theology during the night. 

OK Ayatollah. Generally anything that doesn't correspond with your political ideology is from Satan, correct? 

Let's make a list of Satan's Lies. It will be great for people who have weak minds/faith/formation and are at risk of brainwashing in college. 

Satans Lies

postcolonialism

eleanor roosevelt

pantaloons on women

leggings

....lets keep it going. Add on to the list. 

 

[Gabriela]

Actually, I tend to agree with Catlick on this point. Humanities departments at state universities are really just poorly veiled liberal indoctrination machines these days.

Philosophy departments are typically safe, though, if you have your own solid grounding in religion already (which FP obviously does).

[PhuturePriest]

Actually, I tend to agree with Catlick on this point. Humanities departments at state universities are really just poorly veiled liberal indoctrination machines these days.

Philosophy departments are typically safe, though, if you have your own solid grounding in religion already (which FP obviously does).

​I'm minoring in philosophy, as it so happens. Possibly a double minor in history as well, just because.

[Maggyie]

I dunno. I think anyone who is indoctrinated in college just don't know how to think for themselves or are too accepting of authority. Easily led etc. 

Oh those evil academics with their book larnin besides the Bible and their belief that racism exists. Errrrr.