I Am A Die-hard Republican Because...

[RandomProddy]

Just to point out, almost all protestants want to be part of the UK, but a third of Cathollics in NI want to be too:

"The votes for unionist parties in the last general elections were 65%. The statistics of 1991 show that,

British domination- 92% of Protestants, 35% of Catholics

United Ireland- 4% of Protestants, 53% of Catholics

No Idea/No answer- 4% of Protestants, 12% of Catholics"

[MorphRC]

[quote name='PedroX' date='Jun 25 2004, 12:54 AM']
How is murder different from murder? I must have missed the high level philosophy class that taught that distinction. Strangely, Ghandi and Martin Luther King Jr. missed it too.

peace... [/quote]
Hmm. I guess then all wars, were all murderous, even WWII, stopping the Nazis from slaughtering Jews, I didnt use murder, because what the Jews went thru murder doesnt even compare to describe. Umm what about the Crusades? Well heck lets just say any war that involved some sort of fight for freedom, was murderous, remember Murdering is more defined than the word 'kill'.

Also Proddy heres something interesting:

[b]S Continuing Stalemate in the Province:[/b]

[i]The UDA was linked to rioting in north Belfast in the late summer and also was suspected of the blast bomb attack on police who were protecting Catholic schoolgirls making their way to the Holy Cross School in north Belfast through a staunchly Protestant area.[/i]

[b]Microsoft Encarta 2004 Standard
© 1993-2003 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.[/b]

Seems your friends are also on the same level as Al-Qaeda, as you tried with the IRA.

----------------

[quote]Right. Unlike you, I am actually from Northern Ireland..[/quote]

My whole family is from ireland, including some of my reletives in Northern ireland. Derry..so dont try and pull that line, as if it makes any difference on information and viewpoints.

[RandomProddy]

[quote name='MorphRC' date='Jun 24 2004, 06:03 PM'] My whole family is from ireland, including some of my reletives in Northern ireland. Derry.. [/quote]
Ah, cool. I'm from Ballymoney, Co. Antrim

And I'm not affiliated with the UDA in any way.

Edited June 24, 2004 by RandomProddy

[crusader1234]

[quote]Crusader 1234,

Good to see someone who knows their history. I get so frustrated with inaccuracies presented as fact. Good to have you on board.

peace... [/quote]

Haha, I've always kind of been a history nerd, when I was little my parents gave me this card Game with all the kings and queens and stuff and I never played the game I just memorized them and since then I've just sort of been reading about everything.

[quote]Hmm. I guess then all wars, were all murderous, even WWII, stopping the Nazis from slaughtering Jews, I didnt use murder, because what the Jews went thru murder doesnt even compare to describe. Umm what about the Crusades? Well heck lets just say any war that involved some sort of fight for freedom, was murderous, remember Murdering is more defined than the word 'kill'.[/quote]

Hi, theres a big fact you are missing here. There is a difference between murder, terrorism, and war. There is such a thing as just war, just check the CCC I think the 2300's deal with just war criteria. However, terrorism and murder are never justified.

The IRA, and I'm a Catholic and I'm an O'Brien so don't get me wrong, is totally unjustified.

[quote]bombing hotels - British Ones or Possible Informers - Doesnt Bother Me
police stations - British Ones or Possible Informers - Doesnt Bother Me
finincial districts - British Ones or Possible Informers - Doesnt Bother Me
[/quote]

Sorry, but thats disgusting. Here are a few CCC quotes that make that statement contrary to Catholic teaching:

[quote][b]2261[/b] Scripture specifies the prohibition contained in the fifth commandment: "Do not slay the innocent and the righteous."[61] The deliberate murder of an innocent person is gravely contrary to the dignity of the human being, to the golden rule, and to the holiness of the Creator. The law forbidding it is universally valid: it obliges each and everyone, always and everywhere.

[b]2263[/b] The legitimate defense of persons and societies is not an exception to the prohibition against the murder of the innocent that constitutes intentional killing. "The act of self-defense can have a double effect: the preservation of one's own life; and the killing of the aggressor.... The one is intended, the other is not."[65]

[b]2268[/b] The fifth commandment forbids direct and intentional killing as gravely sinful. The murderer and those who cooperate voluntarily in murder commit a sin that cries out to heaven for vengeance.[68]
Infanticide,[69] fratricide, parricide, and the murder of a spouse are especially grave crimes by reason of the natural bonds which they break. Concern for eugenics or public health cannot justify any murder, even if commanded by public authority.
[/quote]

The IRA doesn't qualify as 'war' so therefore it cannot be justified. The war is not in self defense so it cannot be justified. Not being bothered by something like that which is totally contrary to God's law is wrong.

[PedroX]

Morph,

I know you have claimed that you are apostate now, but really I expect better from thinking people, regardless of belief system. Terrorism cannot be compared to just war. Read up on just war theory and tell me how the IRA or the UDA or Al Quaida fits just war theory. Then, maybe, we can have a conversation.

peace...

[MorphRC]

[quote]Hi, theres a big fact you are missing here. There is a difference between murder, terrorism, and war. There is such a thing as just war, just check the CCC I think the 2300's deal with just war criteria. However, terrorism and murder are never justified.[/quote]

I dont need the CCC to justify anything..Remember I aint Christian, so Im not restrained by those laws anymore.

I agree that terrorism and murder cant be justified to many extends, but please tell me what other options did the Irish have?

[quote]Sorry, but thats disgusting. Here are a few CCC quotes that make that statement contrary to Catholic teaching:[/quote]

Again Dont care for that. Also. How is it disgusting? That finally Britian gets a taste of its own medicine? That after nearly a thousand years of doing that to people around the world, they get pay back? Then there screaming WERE VICTIMS, just like Blair after 9/11 trying to get the US to help him take out the IRA, and the PIRA. England deserves everything it gets, to bad Napolean went for Russia, would have been nice to have england wiped off the map.

[quote]The IRA doesn't qualify as 'war' so therefore it cannot be justified. The war is not in self defense so it cannot be justified. Not being bothered by something like that which is totally contrary to God's law is wrong. [/quote]

[quote]The war is not in self defense so it cannot be justified.[/quote]

Your a smart man, Ive seen it, but that is the stupidest statements Ive seen you write on here, youve learnt history, even you yourself said '[i]I've always kind of been a history nerd[/i]' yet you think that the IRA, PIRA and other groups that fought the english for freedom after 900years is not self-defense.

Either is Afghanistan or Iraq. There wars on Islam.

[MorphRC]

BTW Just incase ICE or someother host tries to take my statement out of context. I WAS saying his statement was stupid, NOT HIM!

[MorphRC]

[quote name='PedroX' date='Jun 25 2004, 02:55 PM'] Morph,

I know you have claimed that you are apostate now, but really I expect better from thinking people, regardless of belief system. Terrorism cannot be compared to just war. Read up on just war theory and tell me how the IRA or the UDA or Al Quaida fits just war theory. Then, maybe, we can have a conversation.

peace... [/quote]
I am PedroX. I dont have to follow those laws anymore.

Any means to get freedom in Northern Eire is acceptable.

'[i]Means to an End[/i]'

[crusader1234]

Hey, sorry, I didn't know you werent Catholic. Now theres a little thing below your name that clears that up for me.

I'm sorry you think thats the 'stupidest thing' I've said here, but as a Catholic I personally believe that you shouldn't kill a person unless there is a personal imminent threat to your life or it is during war (in which case there is usually a threat). Killing innocent people is totally unacceptable.

Now I understand you want freedom, but it is totally unacceptable - especially this day in age - to be using terrorist tactics to gain political independence.

I want the Emerald Isle to be all under Irish rule, but seeing as how the North isn't being murdered or even having their human rights violated by England, there is no need for warfare.

[Aloysius]

and some ppl were against the little red warning!

[MorphRC]

I understand its your stance, due to catholicism, and its respectible.

INA/IRA Statements:

[url="http://inac.org/ina/statements.html"]http://inac.org/ina/statements.html[/url]

[crusader1234]

Those statements are great, however the terrorism hasn't exacltly ended now has it? I know in 1994 they said they got rid of all arms - but that doesn't mean they actually have.

[MorphRC]

[quote name='crusader1234' date='Jun 25 2004, 05:07 PM'] Those statements are great, however the terrorism hasn't exacltly ended now has it? I know in 1994 they said they got rid of all arms - but that doesn't mean they actually have. [/quote]
You really think the IRA are so stupid as to totally disarm with englands history of supporting protestant murder squads? Also I remember the IRA willing to disarm, but never heard a word of the prot murder squads though.

[RandomProddy]

[quote name='MorphRC' date='Jun 25 2004, 07:26 AM'] England deserves everything it gets, to bad Napolean went for Russia, would have been nice to have england wiped off the map. [/quote]

Haha, good luck mate. Napoleon couldn't do it, Hitler couldn't do it, Philip II with the Spanish Armada couldn't do it. Don't forget, god's on our side, that's why we still have Northern Ireland despite the best efforts of the IRA to kill as many protestants and rebellious Catholics as possible.

Edited June 25, 2004 by RandomProddy

[thicke]

[quote name='Aloysius' date='Jun 23 2004, 12:38 PM'] get out of Northern Ireland, all the Protestants can go with you back to England! LEAVE IRELAND ALONE. arg [/quote]
Actually, most of the Protestants in Northern Ireland would need ot go back to the Scottish lowlands, not England.

[RandomProddy]

[quote name='thicke' date='Jun 25 2004, 05:06 PM'] Actually, most of the Protestants in Northern Ireland would need ot go back to the Scottish lowlands, not England. [/quote]
Or they could stay in the UK where they belong..

[thicke]

[quote name='RandomProddy' date='Jun 25 2004, 10:09 AM'] Or they could stay in the UK where they belong.. [/quote]
I don't really care who goes or stays where. I just wish people would stop killing people for childish, outdated reasons. If the Protestants and Catholics in Northern Ireland started living their faith, instead of being so concerned with the color of the blood that flows through their veins, there wouldn't be so much (any?) bloodshed.

Just stating my opinion, no matter how much it smells.

Edited June 25, 2004 by thicke

[thicke]

[quote name='RandomProddy' date='Jun 24 2004, 09:08 AM']* Catholic mother of ten, Jean McConville, is executed by the Provisional IRA for cushioning the head of a dying British soldier, although it is also claimed that she was informing the British Army of PIRA activities. The PIRA would deny any involvement in the killing until the 1990s, when it would acknowledge its action.
[/quote]
Sorry proddy, but I must point out a vocabulary error in you post here..

Webster's defines execution as the following:

[quote]
Main Entry: ex·e·cu·tion
Pronunciation: "ek-si-'kyü-sh&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French, from Latin exsecution-, exsecutio, from exsequi to execute, from ex- + sequi to follow -- more at SUE
1 : the act or process of executing : PERFORMANCE
2 : a putting to death especially as a legal penalty
3 : the process of enforcing a legal judgment (as against a debtor); also : a judicial writ directing such enforcement
4 : the act or mode or result of performance
5 archaic : effective or destructive action <his brandished steel, which smoked with bloody execution -- Shakespeare> -- usually used with do <as soon as day came, we went out to see what execution we had done -- Daniel Defoe> [/quote]

It looks like "executed" is improperly used. I would suggest the following word:

[quote]
Main Entry: 1mur·der
Pronunciation: 'm&r-d&r
Function: noun
Etymology: partly from Middle English murther, from Old English morthor; partly from Middle English murdre, from Old French, of Germanic origin; akin to Old English morthor; akin to Old High German mord murder, Latin mort-, mors death, mori to die, mortuus dead, Greek brotos mortal
1 : the crime of unlawfully killing a person especially with malice aforethought
2 a : something very difficult or dangerous <the traffic was murder> b : something outrageous or blameworthy <getting away with murder>  [/quote]


There is another thread about martyrs. It seems to me that this woman was acting compassionately with perfect Christian charity and died for it. She is a Catholic martyr in my opinion.

[RandomProddy]

[quote name='thicke' date='Jun 25 2004, 05:42 PM'] There is another thread about martyrs. It seems to me that this woman was acting compassionately with perfect Christian charity and died for it. She is a Catholic martyr in my opinion. [/quote]
Essenitally, yes. Though she's Catholic I'd extend her actions as a beacon for all christians to follow.

[MorphRC]

[quote name='RandomProddy' date='Jun 26 2004, 01:36 AM']
Haha, good luck mate. Napoleon couldn't do it, Hitler couldn't do it, Philip II with the Spanish Armada couldn't do it. Don't forget, god's on our side, that's why we still have Northern Ireland despite the best efforts of the IRA to kill as many protestants and rebellious Catholics as possible. [/quote]
Napolean left England, decided for Russia. The same with Hitler. Hitler decided that Russia would be a perfect way to grap the oil fields in the Middle East. Either way they both made stupid mistakes, but the way terrorism is going today, and with North Korea and Iran, I suspect the US and England wont exist for another 100years, if they dont be careful. And with the current attitude towards Englands 'War-Campaign' I dont think many people would break a tear over it.

Also why do you say God is on your-side? Are you saying God condones murders, stealing peoples money, and land? Raping their 14yr daughters? Shooting children going to Church?

Youve got a weird God then, and it definately aint the ones true Christians[Catholics] worship.