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fides' Jack

Why I now reject climate politics nearly entirely

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fides' Jack

This is not at all comprehensive on even my own thoughts on the matter, but I've been wanting to write this for a while.  And since Phatmass is so amesome for letting people speak their minds...

When I first heard about "global warming" growing up, I was a skeptic.  In my teens a graph came out that showed the average global temperature had increased by .2 degrees during the hundred years prior to that.  I remember specific arguments I had with even family members who said you can't argue with statistics...

Fast forward a number of years, into my college life, and my mind changed.  I was still skeptical about certain aspects of it, as-in, I recognized there was a problem and that we should do something, but researching any of the proposed solutions showed pretty quickly they couldn't possibly succeed.  But we should still try to do our part, right?

I've been reading into this on my own time as I could while juggling full-time career, full-time school (for a long time) and a full-time family.  I'm convinced now that not only is it all a giant scam, but it's actually satanic in origin.

Here's the main premise of the argument:

1. Climate change is occurring (I agree with this)
2. It's largely man-made (I agree we've affected it to an extent, but all the most credible evidence suggests that it's an extremely small extent)
3. It's going to cause all sorts of other bad things (I definitely disagree with this one)

First, what is the point of all this, anyway?  It's one of 2 things (or perhaps both) - saving lives or saving the planet.  My goal is to show how both of these are lies.

What is the main cause of concern?  Pollution in the form of carbon dioxide.  

To this I just ask the simple question: why is carbon dioxide bad?  I think it's actually good, for these reasons:

  • Sea level rise
    • This could be caused by melting ice at the polar caps, and melting glaciers elsewhere.  I agree it's a valid concern for people on the coasts - which is a huge number of people.  However:
      • Studies have shown that the ice at the North cap is slowly losing mass while the ice at the southern cap is gaining mass...  which itself is interesting.  There is a big difference between the northern ice cap and the southern ice cap: the northern cap is floating (North of Greenland), whereas the southern cap is actually a continent.  This is very important to note because if floating ice melts, it doesn't add to the water level, or subtract from it.  This is a fact about ice that not many people realize.
      • If all the ice on Greenland melts, or all the ice in Antarctica, sea levels could rise slightly and affect people living on the coasts.
        • If this were to happen, the temperature at the poles would have to rise a lot faster than they are now, and even if they did, it would happen so gradually that no loss of life would even happen, anyway.  People would be evacuated to new cities farther inland years before it would reach the point of being dangerous to human life.
  • Plant life
    • Well, we know plant life would be WAY better off if the global temperature were a number of degrees warmer and the CO2 level in the atmosphere was many times higher than it is - that's just basic understanding of plants.  They breathe, and eat, carbon dioxide.  The more there is, the better for them.  Farmers actually sometimes increase CO2 in enclosed spaces when growing plants for this very reason.
  • Animal life
    • There's evidence to suggest that increased carbon dioxide is good for animal life, too.  The biggest concern is breathing too much of it, but it would have to be hundreds of times more abundant before this even becomes a concern (for human life).  For many animal species, introducing increased carbon dioxide into their natural environments shows increased health and body size.  Perhaps they get more nutrients from the healthier plants... Hard to say at this point why this is.
    • Some animal species have had to migrate north or south as local weather temperatures go up or down to stay comfortable.  But we know this would be happening regardless.  Climate is still going to change even if we aren't here, and animals will always migrate as a response to that.
  • Extreme weather
    • This is when severe weather happens more frequently, but nearly all indicators show that this type of thing is down, not up.
      • Droughts - lowest they've ever been
      • Floods - declining for the last 70 years
      • Tornadoes - EF3 and higher have been steadily declining since at least 1970
      • Hurricanes - decreasing since at least the late 1970s - also studies show that cooler temperatures (not warmer) result in more frequent and stronger hurricanes

Truthfully, there are solid counter-arguments to everything the main-stream media has been telling people for decades.  These are all scientific arguments.  I haven't cited any sources, just because they're too many and I didn't want to sift through them.  If you disagree with a specific point above, look into it.  Maybe you'll be surprised, or maybe you can point me to something showing I'm wrong...

However, these lies aren't even my biggest problems with the climate hysteria.  A much bigger problem is the lie about scientific consensus.  It's been oft-repeated that 97% of scientists agree...  Well, this number was reached when some government people (surely they don't have their own agenda, right??) took a sample of fewer than 80 scientists' opinions on the matter (out of the 10,000 they had available), and then said they reached a consensus they didn't.  Those scientists really only agreed on 2 very basic points: 1) that climate is changing (which is self-evident), and 2) that humans were responsible for some part of it.  They don't say how much (though very many agree with what I've already stated, that's it's very little), and they also don't even agree that it's even a bad thing.  

Since that number came out, things have changed quite a lot.  Now there is no real science here.  Sure, you have a lot of scientists working on it, but there is no room for criticism.  Any professor who shows any kind of out-of-the-box thinking on this matter is immediately targeted, and his career (and often whole life) destroyed.  This is my 2nd biggest peeve with the whole mess.  You can't have scientific credibility if dissenters are silenced.  And just about every single dissenter on this matter is.  It's become a witch-hunt.

Another giant problem is that it's so largely political that we now know for sure that a lot of statistics regarding weather and temperature from years past have actually been wholly fabricated.  They've been caught red-handed.  Climate-gate happened in 2009, but for some reason because they explained away one person's activities in 1 school, the media dismissed it as a non-issue.  The investigation into that was a joke.  Be that as it may, I would feel much better about the stats if they weren't owned by government pawns.  The most outspoken people about fixing climate change are high-up members of the government or professors in state-sponsored schools...  If the government, which lies about everything, had less to do with it, I could believe it more easily.

But still, there's another problem, which in my opinion, is even more problematic.  Many high-profile individuals (including celebrities and politicians) have likened their work saving the earth to a form of religion.  They see (and have publicly and explicitly stated) that mother earth is some kind of goddess, and many people literally pray to mother earth to help stop climate change.  This is very obviously mortally sinful and blasphemous and idolatrous.  The more that comes out, the more we see this kind of thing is at the heart of stopping climate change.  It seems evident to me now that it's been at the heart of it this whole time.  

I can get behind trying to change things - even if there is no obvious gain for anyone or anything.  I will absolutely NOT be a party to idolatry.  I hereby reject ALL of the climate change programs, if that is at its core.  I would rather the entire planet, and all the inhabitants of it, die horribly gruesome deaths, than be a party to the satanic culture behind it.  Many people will find this melodramatic.  I don't think it is.

I recommend the book "The Politically Incorrect Guide to Climate Change" that covers some of these issues much better than I ever could, and actually gives sources.

Edited by fides' Jack

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Didacus

The climate has always varied on the earth 

To wish for climate to remain constant would be wishing for the exception to the general rule.

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fides' Jack
On 8/21/2019 at 9:17 AM, Didacus said:

The climate has always varied on the earth 

To wish for climate to remain constant would be wishing for the exception to the general rule.

It would be pretty stupid to want the climate to remain constant, methinks...  

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linate

droughts are increasing
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/climate-change-has-made-droughts-more-frequent-1900-180972087/

hurricanes are increasing. see the graph in the article. 
https://www.theguardian.com/weather/ng-interactive/2018/sep/11/atlantic-hurricanes-are-storms-getting-worse

antarctica is losing ice such that sea levels are rising

https://skepticalscience.com/antarctica-gaining-ice-intermediate.htm

there is a strong consensus that man is the main cause of climate change
https://skepticalscience.com/97-percent-consensus-robust.htm

more carbon dioxide isnt necessarily all that great for plants

https://skepticalscience.com/co2-plant-food-basic.htm

we have more carbon than we've had for millions of years, and more than twice as much as weve had for hundreds of thousands. 

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BarbaraTherese

The earth has experienced climate changes over its existence.  That does not mean that today we have not contributed to climate change and the damaging effects we now experience.  Without the human element, climate change may not be as destructive as it now seems to be and the human element may well be a cause with a consequent effect and the predictions of science.

If human behaviour is having a detrimental effect, even if not the sole cause of climate change, we still do have an obligation and responsibility to modify our behaviour. 

God created the earth and saw that it was good and created us His stewards over His creation.

___________

Steward: "5.2  - A person whose responsibility it is to take care of something." https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/steward

On 8/29/2019 at 5:00 PM, vee said:

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41QeEgIb-KL._SX425_.jpg

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BarbaraTherese
On 9/14/2019 at 7:03 AM, dominicansoul said:

the world is supposed to end, that's what the Book of Revelation is all about...

Spot on!  And we are not called to bring about the end of the world. :) 

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dominicansoul

Exactly, we are not called to bring about the end of the world, becuase we peons can't do a thing to bring it!  

This billions year old planet that has seen even worse catastrophes on monumental scales...can't be brought down from a measly 100 years of the Industrial age... 

Sure, do what we must for the environment...recycle, make trash more biodegradable....but kill babies??? sterilize the unwanteds??? give total control to governments on what we can eat, drink, drive..?? nah...

This entire ridiculous scheme is a grab for power by leftists individuals who don't even practice what they preach... they certainly don't believe in global warming looking at how they live ...huge mansions by the oceans, private jets, private yachts, guzzling oil, gas, resources... ELITISM...THEY WANT us to suffer while they take the planets resources for themselves... 

 

Growing up I heard scary tales of the world freezing by the time I turned 20... alas, I'm almost 50 and it's hot as normal where I live... 

WE need to focus on what will never end, our souls... but the Book of Revelation tells us...the Earth will be no more...

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fides' Jack
On 9/3/2019 at 11:16 PM, BarbaraTherese said:

The earth has experienced climate changes over its existence.  That does not mean that today we have not contributed to climate change and the damaging effects we now experience.  Without the human element, climate change may not be as destructive as it now seems to be and the human element may well be a cause with a consequent effect and the predictions of science.

If human behaviour is having a detrimental effect, even if not the sole cause of climate change, we still do have an obligation and responsibility to modify our behaviour. 

Give me any evidence at all that 1) human behavior is having an effect on climate (which I will grant you for the sake of argument without any other qualifications - even though there is no direct evidence, so you can't), and 2) that the effect is bad, let alone detrimental.

We are experiencing effects of the climate changing, sure, and some of those effects are damaging.  That's the nature of the world.  If anything, the human element has already made it better in a lot of ways.  We've learned lessons along the way, but we're doing really, really well in this regard.

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BarbaraTherese
19 hours ago, fides' Jack said:

Give me any evidence at all that 1) human behavior is having an effect on climate (which I will grant you for the sake of argument without any other qualifications - even though there is no direct evidence, so you can't), and 2) that the effect is bad, let alone detrimental.

opinion.  https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/

Jack wrote: We are experiencing effects of the climate changing, sure, and some of those effects are damaging.  That's the nature of the world.  If anything, the human element has already made it better in a lot of ways.  We've learned lessons along the way, but we're doing really, really well in this regard.

https://www.wwf.org.au/what-we-do/climate#gs.65dnnv

Opinions and valid only as an individual's opinions.  Jack, can you quote some reputable websites to underscore your comments please, as I have tried to do in response to you, as you asked.

Jack, with respect, my post which you quoted and responded to was simply my opinion and valid as my opinion only. I never claimed otherwise.

Please do not get tied up in knots about it :) 

 

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Gary david
On 9/13/2019 at 5:33 PM, dominicansoul said:

the world is supposed to end, that's what the Book of Revelation is all about...

Excellent point!

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fides' Jack
On 9/28/2019 at 9:49 AM, BarbaraTherese said:

https://www.wwf.org.au/what-we-do/climate#gs.65dnnv

Opinions and valid only as an individual's opinions.  Jack, can you quote some reputable websites to underscore your comments please, as I have tried to do in response to you, as you asked.

Jack, with respect, my post which you quoted and responded to was simply my opinion and valid as my opinion only. I never claimed otherwise.

Please do not get tied up in knots about it :) 

 

I'm not tied up in knots about it.  And much of what I posted is opinion, also.

But...  define reputable, please.  If the World Wildlife Fund is reputable, just a simple DuckDuckGo search (not Google, because Google is nothing more than a leftist echo chamber, now) will give you tons of information on both sides that are equally as reputable as the WWF (which is clearly a leftist organization - and paid to say whatever the left wants them to).

For the claim I made that the 97% consensus is bogus, and also that carbon dioxide is a good thing for the planet: http://www.petitionproject.org

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BarbaraTherese

We can only do what we can and in this case,what one believes to be the right thing to do.........then leave the rest to God.  What more can one do than that which he/she is able?

Most times if you enter into Google for example "Is such and such a sound resource", it will throw up some reviews - then the task is to ensure insofar as we can if the reviews themselves are sound resources.  I did this with the website you quoted:

5 hours ago, fides' Jack said:

We need to make up our own minds.  We can only do what we can.  Then leave the rest to God.

We can do nothing beyond what we can do.  For some it might be minimal for others it may be much more.  But The Lord is in the driver's seat,in that of individuals and in that of the whole world, our Doctrine of Divine Providence.

What we believe is not something we acknowledge in our heads as truth, without internalising and living it out in our lives.

V - God Carries Out His Plan: DIVINE PROVIDENCE (Catholic Catechism)  #302 - #314.

I am wondering, Jack, if you have heard what I said HEREpreviously.  If we humans are doing some damage to the environment, then we must cease.  The Lord has appointed us as stewards over the whole of His Creation, which "And God looked upon all that He had made, and indeed, it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning— the sixth day. " Genesis Ch1

Now if we are damaging our environment, we are acting against what is very good.  Acting in fact as a destructive agent of the very good.  We all probably know what that is called.  And what is contrary to God in any way comes from the evil one.

Edited by BarbaraTherese

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Gary david

I think that if this goldfish bowl we are living in were much smaller, one we could put on a table then we could see what we are doing is so wrong. We wouldnt be so quick to throw trash in the corner and walk away. It is always when it's to late when people realize they shouldnt have done something. It is always accompanied by some desire that suits them at the time. For the human race it seems that for the most part it is driven by selfish means one way or the other. Its about power, money and to be in a position better than the other. These are just some of the things that generate the troubles we endure today. Its how people are if they dont live God's words. I really do believe it is as simple as that. The difficult part is getting everyone to live them.

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