Jesuits Put Up One World Religion Monument

[Budge]

[quote]Monument of Peace
New on the Grotto Mountain New on the Grotto Mountain New on the Grotto Mountain

The monument is sponsored by Les Jésuites de Sudbury.

'' No service of faith without promotion of justice. No promotion of justice without dialogue with other traditions.'' (34th General Congregation 1995, Society of Jesus)

''From the beginning to the end WORKING TOGETHER FOR PEACE'' ALPHA AND OMEGA

Peace represented by a dove, a Christian Cross and the symbols in each of the letters A(lpha) and O(mega) represents the 12 current religions.

You can visit the monument of peace on the right hand side of the alter where Mass is celebrated on
the Grotto Mountain.
[/quote]

SEE PICTURES HERE:

[url="http://www.diocesessm.org/WorkspaceFolder.2004-12-08.0933900410/Workspace.2004-12-08.1056657607/News.2006-07-05.4439849939/en"]http://www.diocesessm.org/WorkspaceFolder....5.4439849939/en[/url]


Buddha, Allah, Yin Yang symbol included, so what do you folks think of this?

[Lahecil]

Personally I think it's beautiful.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='Budge' post='1019115' date='Jul 7 2006, 09:51 AM']
SEE PICTURES HERE:

[url="http://www.diocesessm.org/WorkspaceFolder.2004-12-08.0933900410/Workspace.2004-12-08.1056657607/News.2006-07-05.4439849939/en"]http://www.diocesessm.org/WorkspaceFolder....5.4439849939/en[/url]
Buddha, Allah, Yin Yang symbol included, so what do you folks think of this?
[/quote]
While there's nothing wrong with a monument that shows religions joining together (that's conjunction, not union) for peace, this seems to be more of the hippy persuasion.

Budge, if you want to make a statement against the Church, I suggest that you don't use odd findings which aren't supported, implicitly or explicitly, by the Church. Just because someone in the Church says or does something that's a bit "off" doesn't make it a representation of the Church. Sad to say it, but please take weird Jesuit things with a grain of salt.

[michaelorapronobis]

It is a violation of the First Commandment and is directly contrary to the First Article of the Creed. God says "Thou shalt not have strange gods before me". Jesus said "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me" (Jn 14:6). It is clear that there is only one God, and that Jesus is the only way to God.

For almost 2,000 years the Church has taught that "Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus" - Outside the Church there is no Salvation.

What the Church Says "There is but one universal Church of the faithful outside of which no one at all can be saved." --Pope Innocent III

"The most Holy Roman Catholic Church firmly believes, professes, and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church ... can have eternal life." --Pope Eugene IV, The Bull Cantate Domino 1441 A.D., Ex cathedra.

"We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff." --Pope Boniface VIII, The Bull Unnam Sanctam 1302 A.D., Ex cathedra

This monument is saying that the Church teaching is no longer true, and that all religions are valid paths to God. The people who made and commissioned this monument are therefore heretics.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='Michael' post='1019133' date='Jul 7 2006, 10:11 AM']
It is a violation of the First Commandment and is directly contrary to the First Article of the Creed. God says "Thou shalt not have strange gods before me". Jesus said "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me" (Jn 14:6). It is clear that there is only one God, and that Jesus is the only way to God.

For almost 2,000 years the Church has taught that "Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus" - Outside the Church there is no Salvation.

What the Church Says "There is but one universal Church of the faithful outside of which no one at all can be saved." --Pope Innocent III

"The most Holy Roman Catholic Church firmly believes, professes, and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church ... can have eternal life." --Pope Eugene IV, The Bull Cantate Domino 1441 A.D., Ex cathedra.

"We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff." --Pope Boniface VIII, The Bull Unnam Sanctam 1302 A.D., Ex cathedra

This monument is saying that the Church teaching is no longer true, and that all religions are valid paths to God. The people who made and commissioned this monument are therefore heretics.
[/quote]

Careful throwing the term "heretic" around. While your quotes are correct, there is nothing intrinsically wrong with an interfaith monument, unless it says something about all religions being equal.

That said, the monument is confusing at best, and heretical at worst (which I can't state definitively because I don't have enough information on what message the artists are trying to convey).

[Lahecil]

I guess it depends on how you take it. If you take it that all religions are correct it could be considered heretical by the standards in the quotes from Michael. On the other hand, it could also be an acknowledgement that other religions exist and that peace could be achieved if they all agree to disagree, basically.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='Lahecil' post='1019147' date='Jul 7 2006, 10:29 AM']
I guess it depends on how you take it. If you take it that all religions are correct it could be considered heretical by the standards in the quotes from Michael. On the other hand, it could also be an acknowledgement that other religions exist and that peace could be achieved if they all agree to disagree, basically.
[/quote]
Well, no, Christianity can never agree to disagree. We are here to set the world ablaze with the love of Christ. Agreeing to disagree would immediately dissolve the Church. It simply can't be done (seriously, it's not even possible).

[Lahecil]

Ouch. My naiveity is showing. Good thing I'm here to learn. I guess my only argument left is that I like it then.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='Lahecil' post='1019155' date='Jul 7 2006, 10:33 AM']
Ouch. My naiveity is showing. Good thing I'm here to learn. I guess my only argument left is that I like it then.
[/quote]

[Lounge Daddy]

interesting that the Jesuits are always good for this action these days
it has become very typical of them

[EcceNovaFacioOmni]

Actions of the Jesuit order do not imply Church approval.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='thedude' post='1019196' date='Jul 7 2006, 11:57 AM']
Actions of the Jesuit order do not imply Church approval.
[/quote]
Hehe...sounds like a warning label.

[cmotherofpirl]

This is what it says:

"No service of faith without promotion of justice.
No promotion of justice without dialogue with other traditions.''

It doesn't say anything about equality.
It does mention faith and works, and dialogue. Dialogue does not imply equality, but conversation. ...
We cannot convert people that we don't talk to! :

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1019209' date='Jul 7 2006, 12:03 PM']
This is what it says:

"No service of faith without promotion of justice.
No promotion of justice without dialogue with other traditions.''

It doesn't say anything about equality.
It does mention faith and works, and dialogue. Dialogue does not imply equality, but conversation. ...
We cannot convert people that we don't talk to! :
[/quote]
Yes, we just want to be sure that their definitions of "justice" and "dialogue" are the orthodox ones, rather than the popular ones.

[dUSt]

Looks to me to be a symbol that Christianity is the one true religion, seeing that the cross is above all of the other symbols, in a position of superiority.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='dUSt' post='1019244' date='Jul 7 2006, 12:36 PM']
Looks to me to be a symbol that Christianity is the one true religion, seeing that the cross is above all of the other symbols, in a position of superiority.
[/quote]
This is true, it could certainly be interpretted that way.

Anyway, the fact of the matter is that a piece of art designed by a Jesuit is hardly a magisterial statement.

[Tufsoles]

I do see that the Jesuits are doing something great. However, I am bit skeptical about the the artwork for reasons already mentioned.

[XIX]

[quote name='Lahecil' post='1019155' date='Jul 7 2006, 08:33 AM']
Ouch. My naiveity is showing. Good thing I'm here to learn. I guess my only argument left is that I like it then.
[/quote]
LOL I know the feeling! It's okay, even the most knowledgable theologians started out knowing peanuts about the faith.

[Budge]

[quote]

Budge, if you want to make a statement against the Church, I suggest that you don't use odd findings which aren't supported, implicitly or explicitly, by the Church. Just because someone in the Church says or does something that's a bit "off" doesn't make it a representation of the Church. Sad to say it, but please take weird Jesuit things with a grain of salt.[/quote]


Your above attempt to disclaim this as just an individual going off the tracks has been used before.
[quote]
The following important observations were made in 1851:
[size=5]
* “We cannot allow that every private Priest or member of the Church of Rome should give his own opinions merely as the standard of doctrine.[/size] We will have recourse to the oracular response of the Church, and insist that they be represented by themselves; not, however, by private individuals, but by their legal representatives




But, then, there is nothing which they dread so much as the testimony of their own Church. ...
[size=5]IT IS A PRINCIPAL AIM OF ALL [ROMAN CATHOLIC] CONTROVERTISTS TO EMPLOY EVERY MODE OF EVASION IN ORDER TO DISCONCERT THEIR OPPOSERS.[/size]
There is even a marked difference between the tone of these Romish Divines
who speak dogmatically for the instruction of their own members
and that of those who attempt to answer the objections of their antagonists.
With the former, all is matter of downright certainty;
with the latter, all is doubt, difficulty, subterfuge, and evasion.

When the faithful are to be instructed, every Priest becomes the sure depositary
of the infallible decisions of an infallible Church;
[size=5]
but when Protestants are to be confuted,
the declarations of their most illustrious men are of no authority.
Councils are discovered to have been but partly approved
Popes did not speak ex cathedra;
Cardinals and Bishops are but private Doctors;
And who cares for the opinion of an obscure Priest or Friar?[/size]

Thus nothing is so difficult as to know what the belief of Roman Catholics really is; and
WHEN A PROTESTANT ADDUCES THEIR OWN WRITERS AS WITNESSES,
HE IS FREQUENTLY TOLD THAT HE {The Catholic Writter} IS A MISREPRESENTER OF THEIR CHURCH”

(Charles Elliott, Delineation of Roman Catholicism, London: John Mason, 1851, p. 23).[/quote]


[quote]It is a violation of the First Commandment and is directly contrary to the First Article of the Creed. God says "Thou shalt not have strange gods before me". Jesus said "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me" (Jn 14:6). It is clear that there is only one God, and that Jesus is the only way to God.[/quote]

Thank you,glad you agree.

Remember the whole outside the church thing, they are using that to FOOL you, what they are DOING is expanding the umbrella...[so one day all these folks will be considering a part of the church.
[quote]
This monument is saying that the Church teaching is no longer true, and that all religions are valid paths to God. The people who made and commissioned this monument are therefore heretics.[/quote]

Did you know Benedict has planned an Assisi III, this means they will AGAIN sponser false religions each praying to their own demon in seperate rooms.

I should post on that, guess I will so people know its coming,.
[quote]On the other hand, it could also be an acknowledgement that other religions exist and that peace could be achieved if they all agree to disagree, basically.[/quote]

Sigh...what is the use of that but to confuse people.

Any kid seeing that thing is going to think...hey its cool to be a Buddhist too!


[quote]Actions of the Jesuit order do not imply Church approval.[/quote]

See above.

Edited July 7, 2006 by Budge

[Lahecil]

[quote][quote]On the other hand, it could also be an acknowledgement that other religions exist and that peace could be achieved if they all agree to disagree, basically.[/quote]

Sigh...what is the use of that but to confuse people.

Any kid seeing that thing is going to think...hey its cool to be a Buddhist too![/quote]

My argument was already proved impossible. I don't see how confusing it is though.

And I doubt that many kids would convert to Buddhism because they saw Buddha on a monument.