A Few Of The Many Things That I Wish Would Be Restored

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Mr.CatholicCat' post='1225718' date='Apr 1 2007, 12:08 PM']I have no authority to judge either Mass Rite but I know from the Church that both are valid, licit, and holy rites of Mass even though one is very seemingly more solemn, pious, and reverent than the other personifying the teachings of Christ’s Church more fully.

My personal opinion in light of what the Church wishes is not relevant but in light to other faithful, I hope and pray for the traditional rite to be fully restored to bring nourishment for those Catholics seeking something more profound in their faith. Not only this but more...[/quote]
That's pretty much my take on things too.

[Fides_et_Ratio]

With his first Exhortation, I think our Holy Father is smoothing the path for some changes in the Liturgy-- to return to the authentic intent of the Council.

[quote]...the changes which the Council called for need to be understood within the overall unity of the historical development of the rite itself, without the introduction of artificial discontinuities (SC 3)...

...Beauty, then, is not mere decoration, but rather an essential element of the liturgical action, since it is an attribute of God himself and his revelation. These considerations should make us realize the care which is needed, if the liturgical action is to reflect its innate splendour. (SC 35)...

...The [i]ars celebrandi [/i]is the best way to ensure their [i]actuosa participatio[/i]. The [i]ars celebrandi [/i]is the fruit of faithful adherence to the liturgical norms in all their richness; indeed, for two thousand years this way of celebrating has sustained the faith life of all believers, called to take part in the celebration as the People of God, a royal priesthood, a holy nation (cf. 1 Pet 2:4-5, 9) (SC 38)[/quote]

[kateri05]

also, i think part of the problem is that the antiphons and recitation of the psalm (IE THE CHOIRS PART) is totally forgotten / nonexistent. sure the latin translation of the priest's part stinks, but the Church has to fix that. i think some of the richness and beauty can be brought back if the choir just sang/chanted the original stuff during the actual sprinkling.


oh wait, that would require NOT using the haugen and hass misselette. my bad

[N/A Gone]

Im tired, so slap me if I say something wrong. But I am pretty sure the ECF's would not have been so anal. Meeting in small houses and caves. Expressions of fellowship, and a sense of urgency not of legalism. Latin??? are you kidding me? I desire the respect and I wish the proto community had it, but good job reaching the world when you are literally speaking a different language.

If it wasnt for the sacraments I wonder if I would have converted

[Piamaria]

Bring back the Creed for every day, not just Sundays and solemnities.

Edited April 6, 2007 by Pia

[aalpha1989]

[quote name='phatcatholic' post='1224433' date='Mar 31 2007, 07:28 PM']i just wish the priest would turn back around, for cryin out loud[/quote]


[quote name='Akalyte' post='1224474' date='Mar 31 2007, 08:18 PM']yes and face the light of the east rather than the darkness of the west...[/quote]


Hear, hear!!!!!!!

it doesnt even make sense to face the people...when you think about it being the SACRIFICE of the Mass, is sacrificee being made TO the people? No....its being made to God...so why would the priest face the peopel for crying out loud?

[N/A Gone]

to involve them? Is God restricted to one direction?

[aalpha1989]

[quote name='Revprodeji' post='1231952' date='Apr 5 2007, 11:50 PM']to involve them? Is God restricted to one direction?[/quote]


it actually involves them less when the priest faces them. it becomes a show, obsession with what the priest is doing. it's not about the priest it's about transubstantiation. when the priest is facing away, we are with him offering the sacrifice of Jesus and the sacrifice of our hearts to God. when the priest faces the people it becomes a circle, closing God off. Even at the last supper they faced the same direction.....read The Spirit of the Liturgy by Ratzinger. i have it, so if you want i can quote from the section in which he talks about the direction of the altar...

[N/A Gone]

[quote name='aalpha1989' post='1231994' date='Apr 6 2007, 12:21 AM']it actually involves them less when the priest faces them. it becomes a show, [color="#A0522D"]obsession with what the priest is doing[/color]. it's not about the priest it's about transubstantiation. when the priest is facing away, [color="#008000"]we are with him offering the sacrifice of Jesus and the sacrifice of our hearts to God. when the priest faces the people it becomes a circle, closing God off[/color]. Even at the last supper they faced the same direction.....read The Spirit of the Liturgy by Ratzinger. i have it, so if you want i can quote from the section in which he talks about the direction of the altar...[/quote]


Honestly, I dont care.

I have read that book also, and I own it. If you want to cite the page and I will read it and find some passion with this issue.

my first citing from above--If someone wants to focus on the priest they will do it if his back is faced them, or his face. makes no difference. If you wanna stare at the hot girl getting communion you will do it. It doesnt make a difference.

Second part-I would hate to think you are restricting God and his inability to be present in a circle.

[N/A Gone]

I did make a point of issue on the last page

[quote]Im tired, so slap me if I say something wrong. But I am pretty sure the ECF's would not have been so anal. Meeting in small houses and caves. Expressions of fellowship, and a sense of urgency not of legalism. Latin??? are you kidding me? I desire the respect and I wish the proto community had it, but good job reaching the world when you are literally speaking a different language.

If it wasnt for the sacraments I wonder if I would have converted[/quote]

[Fides_et_Ratio]

Since I'm currently in the midst of my study of the "history and development of the liturgy" I feel like I need to jump in with regards to the ECFs... the early Christians were concerned about the form of the liturgy. Because they understood (far better than we do) that the liturgy is the expression of the faith of the Church. What they Church says and does in the liturgy is an expression of her faith. Even though there were slight differences of custom in various areas, the same basic outline pervaded the liturgy through the centuries... from the early Church right up to today. We have RECEIVED the liturgy (thus, it's not ours to tamper with without tampering with the authentic expression of faith).

And regarding Latin... Liturgy is not evangelization. It's our job upon being sent forth from the liturgy to reach the world. Liturgy draws us back to God and builds us up and offers due worship to the Creator. The language of the liturgy means many things, but the use of Latin connects the Roman rite of the Church--whether we're in Africa, the United States, or the middle east.

And lastly, a GREAT book recommendation: Yves Congar's [u]The Meaning of Tradition[/u]. It's amazing.

[Fides_et_Ratio]

whoops, double post.

Edited April 7, 2007 by Fides_et_Ratio

[franciscanheart]

Why do the others want the priest to turn around again? I don't understand why that's such a huge deal.

[MIKolbe]

I was told the Confiteor was optional..so we don't do it...wish we did...i'd like to have that restored (to my parish, at least)

[aalpha1989]

Also on the latin....

I've been to Latin Masses. its not hard to understand. Its pretty easy, actually, considering you have a missal with latin on one side and english on the other, compliments of the parish. also its more unifying if the whole church is in latin...no matter where you go if the liturgy is in latin it's the same...you will actually understand it BETTER than if it's in spanish, french, german, russian, you name it....the second vatican council did not make the vernacular the norm...it simply allowed it in special occasions. neither did it turn the altar around.