Homosexuals

[rckllnknny]

no but im not trying to sound ridiculously far fetched either. actually more realistic. but it doesnt mean we need to give up hope either tho. God had an original plan to begin with. but everything got all messed up. it would be nice tho if everything worked in the end tho.

[rckllnknny]

thats what i meant no more twisting words.

[Alycin]

See Rick, that's the thing. You may be following your conscience in trying to make God's rules more lenient or less strict; I used to do that too.

But all of us here who believe in adhering to God's laws as they have been laid down, and not trying to change them ourselves, we do that because we are following our conscience. So you have to understand that while you may think and believe with all your heart that YOUR beliefs are right, we also think and believe with all our hearts.

Of course it is nice to hope that everyone gets to heaven--no one with any charity in their hearts wishes hell upon anyone. But neither can we keep anyone out of hell by wishing they won't go there. The surest and safest way to get as many people to heaven as possible is by leading them to Christ, the Church HE founded, and helping them to submit to the laws God provided.

God doesn't change for people, people change for God.

[rckllnknny]

[quote name='Alycin' post='1560920' date='Jun 6 2008, 10:56 AM']See Rick, that's the thing. You may be following your conscience in trying to make God's rules more lenient or less strict; I used to do that too.

But all of us here who believe in adhering to God's laws as they have been laid down, and not trying to change them ourselves, we do that because we are following our conscience. So you have to understand that while you may think and believe with all your heart that YOUR beliefs are right, we also think and believe with all our hearts.

Of course it is nice to hope that everyone gets to heaven--no one with any charity in their hearts wishes hell upon anyone. But neither can we keep anyone out of hell by wishing they won't go there. The surest and safest way to get as many people to heaven as possible is by leading them to Christ, the Church HE founded, and helping them to submit to the laws God provided.

God doesn't change for people, people change for God.[/quote]



i dont disagree with that at all.

[Jaime]

[quote name='Apotheoun' post='1560886' date='Jun 6 2008, 10:20 AM']A State that does not recognize the natural institution of marriage is not a proper State, and no one is bound to any law passed by a State that fails to fulfill its proper function.

The State does not have power over marriage, it only has power to recognize a legitimately contracted marriage, natural or sacramental, and give that marriage certain legal benefits in relation to the State. The existence of the family is logically antecedent to the State.

hot stuff,

I am concerned because you do not seem to understand that the natural law is written into creation, and that the State is required to recognize the right and proper use of created gifts.[/quote]


I am concerned about the fact that you don't seem to acknowledge that the state through civil law, does not recognize the proper use of created gifts.

Please demonstrate for me how a civil marriage witnessed by a justice of the peace, shows any requirements necessary to fulfill Natural Law.

[Veridicus]

[quote name='Socrates' post='1560517' date='Jun 5 2008, 09:12 PM']From John Adams:
"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." --October 11, 1798[/quote]

Eerilly Prophetic...

[Veridicus]

[quote name='rckllnknny' post='1560896' date='Jun 6 2008, 09:41 AM']o and i beleive we are all going and have went to heaven. we all are kings and queens and angels and animals are angels there too.[/quote]

[Veridicus]

[quote name='Apotheoun' post='1560874' date='Jun 6 2008, 08:36 AM']The State does not create marriage; instead, marriage is a natural institution created by God, which is antecedent to the State and which possesses certain unchanging characteristics that the State is required to legally recognize and protect. As a consequence, any law passed by the State that tries to equate a relationship that is contrary to human nature with the natural and supernatural institution of marriage is by definition an abuse, and no one – Catholic or non-Catholic – can legitimately support that type of legislation because it is contrary to right reason.[/quote]

[rckllnknny]

[quote name='Veridicus' post='1560935' date='Jun 6 2008, 11:07 AM'][/quote]


o i kno. can you believe how mad everyone is gonna be when we get there and have to deal with that???

[Veridicus]

[quote name='rckllnknny' post='1560944' date='Jun 6 2008, 10:11 AM']o i kno. can you believe how mad everyone is gonna be when we get there and have to deal with that???[/quote]

Well I hope the angels are nice animals...or at least they are imbued with nicer attitudes than my mom's cat.

[rckllnknny]

or better attitudes than we have. lol.

[rckllnknny]

i meant tho when we get there and we find out everyone and everything is there forever in perfect love and harmony.

[PadrePioOfPietrelcino]

[quote name='Lisieux Flower' post='1559219' date='Jun 5 2008, 01:39 AM']that's your opinion based on your religious beliefs. what about my friend who has differing beliefs, religious and otherwise, who is gay? are we going to base the law on your religion and ignore him? is separation of church and state something we actually put into practice?[/quote]


YES!!!
The values of a society, in a political sense is created by the society, not the individual... If your religious views are truely important to you then you have an obligation to yourself to let your view be known in the formulation of your societal values. If the society as a whole disagrees with a certain action, in this case homosexuality. That society has the RIGHT to define it's values as such. The person who feels slighted has three options, 1) Move to a society that holds their view, 2) TRY to change the minds of those in the society
(doesn't mean it's gonna happen, or 3) Deal with the fact that something they want to do is not something they get to do legally.

Seperation of Church and State IS NOT LAW! It was someting that was debated by the writers of the Constitution, thought to be wrong and left OUT of the Constitution. It was then put in the majority decision of the Supreme court, but it is still not LAW. So NO we should not put seperation of Church and States into practice, since it is not the Value of the United States, sincce to society has never put it in their Constitution.

[prose]

Rick, do you have me on ignore??

[Winchester]

It doesn't matter what the laws intend to say or what theory goes into making them, we Catholics are to pursue social justice as it is understood by the Church.