Jutty1224 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 I voted No on all 3. I am a Eucharistic Minister in my parish. I usually serve every Sunday. We usually have 10 EMs serve along with the priest at each Mass, 4 of those 10 serve the precious blood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laudate_Dominum Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 10 EM's!!?? Yikes! Must be one massive congregation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resurrexi Posted January 21, 2008 Author Share Posted January 21, 2008 [quote name='Jutty1224' post='1448849' date='Jan 21 2008, 12:02 AM']I am a Eucharistic Minister in my parish.[/quote] No you're not. Only priests and deacons are Eucharistic ministers. You're an extraordinary minister of Holy Communion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 [quote name='StThomasMore' post='1448921' date='Jan 21 2008, 08:53 AM']No you're not. Only priests and deacons are Eucharistic ministers. You're an extraordinary minister of Holy Communion.[/quote] thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oik Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 IN the Melkite Church, only Clergy with major orders (Bishop, Priest, Deacon) are allowed to distribute Holy Communion. THere is no such thing as an extraordinary distributor of Holy Communion I do not say minister, because only those who have recieved orders (acolyte, reader, subdeacon, deacon, priest, bishop) are referred to as clergy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
journeyman Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 I don't necessarily disagree, but . . . to mix ecclesiology and rubrics . . . We are the body of Christ, receiving the Body of Christ, from another member of the body of Christ . . . maybe there are some who want to check the box for a magic cracker this week, but what I'm hearing on this thread is those who respect the real presence respect it regardless of who they are standing or kneeling in front of. To probably misuse some scripture, the mouth can't live without the feet and hands and eyes . . . I don't know about the rest of the country, but in our diocese, we are already 15-20 priests shy of being "short" of priests . . . with about twice as many retirements in the near future as there are seminarians. Parishes are being clustered, whether they like it or not. Many priests will be traveling from one parish to another . . . whether they like it or not. Retired priests are not going to be driven into the ground (which I'll admit I can see happening as parishes try to keep a "full" Mass schedule . . . and small parishes (like ours) try to keep a "Sunday" Mass . . . period) Sunday celebration in the absence of a priest is already happening, but the Bishop wants to prevent it from being a "norm." Distant rural parishes are learning that Sunday can be on Wednesday as their priest travels the circuit. There is a potential future that could come to resemble the underground church (or the persecuted church) or the frontier church. . . where a Mass with consecration of the Eucharist and reception of the sacred body (and blood) becomes the exception, rather than the rule . . . or a slightly different future where a new class of ministers are ordained - for the sole purpose of delivering consecrated hosts to the outposts for use in a community prayer service with Eucharist . . . but no priest. Who are your EMs? Elderly? Middle aged? Married? Single? How about youth (loosely defined as 17-25)? Instead of complaining about the use of EMs, encourage them to (pray for them too) keep traveling the path of ministry and seek ordination . . . pray for priests . . . pray for deacons . . . pray some more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Reminds me of this article I read in The Catholic Herald, of Britain... [url="http://goodjesuitbadjesuit.blogspot.com/2007/11/expansion-of-traditional-latin-mass-and.html"]http://goodjesuitbadjesuit.blogspot.com/20...n-mass-and.html[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffpugh Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Briefly, can someone summarize the duties of the Deaconate? Also, what exactly an acolyte is... Thanks... Btw, I'm interested in the former as a possible future vocation... long story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatherineM Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 We have to import priests from Africa and India here. Due to a previous Archbishop, we have no deacons. There are some in the pipe now, but they aren't ready yet. I think there are a couple who have moved here from elsewhere, but none of them are headed to our parish anyway. We use 9-12 extraordinary ministers, but it still takes two full communion songs to get through everyone. If we used our one priest to handle body and blood both by himself, it would take an hour or two. Back home, we had one priest and one deacon who handled the body, and 4 extraordinary to handle the cups. I was one of them for about a year. I began when I was only 27 years old. My age caused some raised eyebrows. I've chosen to not be one since then although I've been asked many times. I'm not saying that I don't like the idea of having them, I go to them every mass, but I just didn't feel comfortable being one anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oik Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 I can't speak on behalf of the Roman Catholic Churches. What I do know is that the Melkite Catholic Church is very tiny in the USA. There are only about 36 parishes here. We have at least one priest per parish. We have about 60 priests in the USA. There is at least 1 deacon per parish. We have about 45 deacons. There are about 28,000 Melkite Faithful. Now, recently, the NCCBUSCC released a document on lay ecclesial ministers. This document basically stated that there are 10 to 12,000 men who are either paid or volunteer in lay ecclesial minstry. These men are eligable for a vocation. The Roman CAtholic Church in the USA has something like 14,000 deacons. There are nearly that many elagible men not deacons or priests! Further, why it states in the norms for thr Roman CAtholic Church that the distribution of Holy Communion should not take an inordinate amount of time, please be very careful of quantifying this. At WYD 2005, it took me 45+ min. to recieve Holy Communion. Remember why we come to celebrate. While we have to be mindful of the length of timeof this, people also need to be aware of the awesome Mystery of Christ. I'm sorry, but if it is not worth waiting an extra 5 (or even 10) minutes to recieve the Body and Blood, Soul and Dvinity of our Lord God and Savior Jesus Christ, you're in the wrong place. As for the Roman Catholic Church in the USA's practice of Body and Blood of Christ distributed by different people, this is just silly! The Melkites DO NOT recieve Holy Communion with a spoon like other Eastern CAtholics. In fact, even though we use leavened bread, we recieve by intinction. The priest holds the Paten AND the Chalice with ONE hand! The Roman Church should use intinction, imo. There are even patens which have a small chalice in the middle of them for the precious blood. And a final note. The Roman Catholic Churches are seeing as normal these massive mega-parishes. This sad situation is increased by the reality of church closings. WHy is it that Eastern Catholic Churches, which tend to be much smaller (50 to 100 families, normally) can stay open, but a parish with 500 families can't pay the bills? Rencently, the Diocese of Phoenix has proposed a self-incorporation of parishes. This takes a lot of burden off of the diocese. IF the Diocese follows through on this, this means that a diocese getting sued will not mean the closing of Churches. This procedure should be adopted. Parishes need to take more responibility for thier finances. In the regard too, our clergy for our churches should come from our own parish. If every single parish in the US contributed at least 1 priest and 1 deacon every 10 years, think about how many we would have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oik Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 [quote]Briefly, can someone summarize the duties of the Deaconate? Also, what exactly an acolyte is...[/quote] I'm not sure about these orders in the Roman Church (which I assume you are interested in). However, in the Melkite Church, an acolyte is the normative altar server. THe acolyte is tonsured to assist as a server at the Divine Liturgy. This usually means carrying the candle or cross or fan during the two processions, lighting the candles of the iconostasis, holding the Gospel book, and distributing the antidoron. Antidoron is bread that is blessed before the Liturgy. A deacon has many liturgical functions. He indicates in the Liturgy (and chants) the litanies. He announces at times the need for attention. He performs several incensings of the Church. He assists at the Liturgy by chanting certain prayers. In the East, a deacon CAN NOT bless, perform baptisms, or officiate weddings. THere are several explanations of the role of the cklergy in the Eastern Catholic Churches of the Greek (or Byzantine) Catholic tradition at this [url="http://www.saintelias.com/ca/clergy/"]link: Saint Elias[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffpugh Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 [quote name='Oik' post='1449234' date='Jan 22 2008, 02:21 AM']I can't speak on behalf of the Roman Catholic Churches. What I do know is that the Melkite Catholic Church is very tiny in the USA. There are only about 36 parishes here. We have at least one priest per parish. We have about 60 priests in the USA. There is at least 1 deacon per parish. We have about 45 deacons. There are about 28,000 Melkite Faithful. Now, recently, the NCCBUSCC released a document on lay ecclesial ministers. This document basically stated that there are 10 to 12,000 men who are either paid or volunteer in lay ecclesial minstry. These men are eligable for a vocation. The Roman CAtholic Church in the USA has something like 14,000 deacons. There are nearly that many elagible men not deacons or priests! Further, why it states in the norms for thr Roman CAtholic Church that the distribution of Holy Communion should not take an inordinate amount of time, please be very careful of quantifying this. At WYD 2005, it took me 45+ min. to recieve Holy Communion. Remember why we come to celebrate. While we have to be mindful of the length of timeof this, people also need to be aware of the awesome Mystery of Christ. I'm sorry, but if it is not worth waiting an extra 5 (or even 10) minutes to recieve the Body and Blood, Soul and Dvinity of our Lord God and Savior Jesus Christ, you're in the wrong place. As for the Roman Catholic Church in the USA's practice of Body and Blood of Christ distributed by different people, this is just silly! The Melkites DO NOT recieve Holy Communion with a spoon like other Eastern CAtholics. In fact, even though we use leavened bread, we recieve by intinction. The priest holds the Paten AND the Chalice with ONE hand! The Roman Church should use intinction, imo. There are even patens which have a small chalice in the middle of them for the precious blood. And a final note. The Roman Catholic Churches are seeing as normal these massive mega-parishes. This sad situation is increased by the reality of church closings. WHy is it that Eastern Catholic Churches, which tend to be much smaller (50 to 100 families, normally) can stay open, but a parish with 500 families can't pay the bills? Rencently, the Diocese of Phoenix has proposed a self-incorporation of parishes. This takes a lot of burden off of the diocese. IF the Diocese follows through on this, this means that a diocese getting sued will not mean the closing of Churches. This procedure should be adopted. Parishes need to take more responibility for thier finances. In the regard too, our clergy for our churches should come from our own parish. If every single parish in the US contributed at least 1 priest and 1 deacon every 10 years, think about how many we would have.[/quote] Sweet post. Interesting thing on the finances... So here's the plan... Latin Catholics should remove most EM and see what happens... if people leave, then only those who want to receive will stay... and hopefully they'll be putting stuff on the plate (note, I think I'm being a little sarcastic here...) Interesting how there is the challice/patten combo. I think that's pretty cool. There's actually a law that says a layman can't intinct the Host in the Precious blood. Only a priest (or Deacon, If I'm not mistaken). [quote name='Oik' post='1449235' date='Jan 22 2008, 02:32 AM']I'm not sure about these orders in the Roman Church (which I assume you are interested in). However, in the Melkite Church, an acolyte is the normative altar server. THe acolyte is tonsured to assist as a server at the Divine Liturgy. This usually means carrying the candle or cross or fan during the two processions, lighting the candles of the iconostasis, holding the Gospel book, and distributing the antidoron. Antidoron is bread that is blessed before the Liturgy. A deacon has many liturgical functions. He indicates in the Liturgy (and chants) the litanies. He announces at times the need for attention. He performs several incensings of the Church. He assists at the Liturgy by chanting certain prayers. In the East, a deacon CAN NOT bless, perform baptisms, or officiate weddings. THere are several explanations of the role of the cklergy in the Eastern Catholic Churches of the Greek (or Byzantine) Catholic tradition at this [url="http://www.saintelias.com/ca/clergy/"]link: Saint Elias[/url][/quote] Thanks. I'm looking at the Latin Rite though. Help Most appreciated, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oik Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 [quote]So here's the plan... Latin Catholics should remove most EM and see what happens... if people leave, then only those who want to receive will stay... and hopefully they'll be putting stuff on the plate (note, I think I'm being a little sarcastic here...)[/quote] Thankfully you very easily notice my tongue-in-cheek commentary onf things. Sadly, you're one of the few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffpugh Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 Sometimes I have to watch for the right moment to make a tongue-in-cheek comment. Otherwise, it can be hazardous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 Heres a thought a friend of mine told me. "Why become a Priest, if I as a layperson can do almost all of what the Priest does, or use to do? Where is the incentive?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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