Death Penalty

[StColette]

[quote name='rckllnknny' post='1557467' date='Jun 4 2008, 12:56 PM']okay alyc i dont want o take your qoute out of context.. but was that just assuming that if someone did a horrendous crime they would prolly not reconcile to God anyway?? so we mite as well give them death instead of life???
lmao r u kidding??[/quote]

Just for clarity sake, you did take her quote out of context. It's a quote from the Catechism which states that punishment of death penalty is very rare if not non-existent given the resources that we have available in control dangerous criminals.

[rckllnknny]

an eye for an eye would make the world go blind.

[goldenchild17]

[quote name='StColette' post='1557484' date='Jun 4 2008, 12:00 PM']I'm going with the Catechism you can go with whoever you want lol[/quote]

okay . though if the Catechism contradicts earlier teaching that's not so good either.

[StColette]

[quote name='goldenchild17' post='1557495' date='Jun 4 2008, 01:03 PM']okay . though if the Catechism contradicts earlier teaching that's not so good either.[/quote]


lol I see this heading in a different direction. Going to stop before this thread changes topics lol

[goldenchild17]

not a problem. There already was a death penalty thread not too long ago and I don't really care to rehash the same shiznit anyways. This isn't a topic phatmass is too open to discussion on apparently, which is odd because PM is most often a pretty level-headed place. So no reason to mess with it again.

"shake the d[i]u[/i]st from your feet" and all that good stuff

Edited June 4, 2008 by goldenchild17

[Jesus_lol]

[quote name='rckllnknny' post='1557491' date='Jun 4 2008, 11:02 AM']an eye for an eye would make the world go blind.[/quote]


you arent really listening to what people are saying, are you?

[Alycin]

[quote name='Jesus_lol' post='1557537' date='Jun 4 2008, 01:28 PM']you arent really listening to what people are saying, are you?[/quote]


Obviously not, since the quote that I made huge is saying that...
[size=3]
The church can think of only extremely rare, if not non-existent, reasons that the death penalty should be implied.[/size]





and yet they took from that, that I said we should kill them because they can't reconcile with God.

[rckllnknny]

no but now i do.

Edited June 4, 2008 by rckllnknny

[CrossCuT]

[size=1]I believe that in extreme cases the Death Penalty is acceptable.
[/size]

[CatherineM]

I don't personally believe that we should be executing people, but I do understand that the Catechism allows for it is certain limited circumstances. Having been witness to an execution in 1989 that went badly, I can't imagine that I will ever be comfortable with the idea. I like how John Paul viewed it from conception to natural death, and what I witnessed was far from natural. I understand that makes me in the extreme minority on phatmass, and I'm not saying the church doesn't allow members to believe in the death penalty. I'm just saying that I don't, and can't.

[geauxsaints26]

[quote]Pope John Paul II, health concerns or not, has not lost his charisma. For 30 hours he was among us, January 26-27, on a stopover pastoral visit en route from Mexico City to Rome. During this brief, seventh papal visit to the United States, he not only exchanged the vibrancy of faith, but also delivered a clear and challenging message to America.

The pope implored his audiences that protecting the dignity of life is America's deepest calling. In five speeches he returned repeatedly to the theme, decrying abortion, racism, poverty and euthanasia, unambiguously proclaiming the death penalty as "cruel and unnecessary." He persuaded Missouri Governor Mel Carnahan to commute the death sentence of Darrell Mease, who had originally been scheduled for execution on the very day of the papal visit. Himself a doctor of philosophy, the pope called upon Americans to remember the philosophical foundations of our nation: protection of the individual in a free society. [url="http://www.americancatholic.org/Messenger/Apr1999/feature1.asp#F6"]Link[/url][/quote]

[quote]"Increasingly, our society looks to...increased reliance on the death penalty to deal with crime. We are tragically turning to violence in the search for quick and easy answers to complex human problems. A society which destroys its children, abandons its old and relies on vengeance fails fundamental moral tests....

"We cannot teach that killing is wrong by killing....This cycle of violence diminishes all of us—especially our children."

—Confronting a Culture of Violence:
A Catholic Framework for Action
(U.S. Catholic bishops, November 1994)[/quote]

[Socrates]

Apparently, God has no problem with lawfully executing murderers:

"Whosoever shall shed man's blood, his blood shall be shed: for man was made to the image of God." (Genesis 9:6)

"He that striketh a man with a will to kill him, shall be put to death." (Exodus 21:12)

[url="http://www.newadvent.org/summa/3064.htm#article2"]Summa Theologica: Article 2. Whether it is lawful to kill sinners?[/url]
[quote]I answer that, As stated above (Article 1), it is lawful to kill dumb animals, in so far as they are naturally directed to man's use, as the imperfect is directed to the perfect. Now every part is directed to the whole, as imperfect to perfect, wherefore every part is naturally for the sake of the whole. For this reason we observe that if the health of the whole body demands the excision of a member, through its being decayed or infectious to the other members, it will be both praiseworthy and advantageous to have it cut away. Now every individual person is compared to the whole community, as part to whole. [b]Therefore if a man be dangerous and infectious to the community, on account of some sin, it is praiseworthy and advantageous that he be killed in order to safeguard the common good, since "a little leaven corrupteth the whole lump" (1 Corinthians 5:6).[/b][/quote]

[Socrates]

[quote name='rckllnknny' post='1557474' date='Jun 4 2008, 11:57 AM']okay where in the bible does it say kill people. in psalms or proverbs???[/quote]
There's quite a list of sins to be punished by death in Leviticus.

[url="http://www.newadvent.org/bible/lev020.htm"]Leviticus: Chapter 20[/url]

[Brother Adam]

If you give a scale of 0 - 100, 0 being utterly against the death penalty and 100 being utterly for the death penalty up until a month ago I would have put myself at about a 90 on that scale. After listening to Russell Ford's testimony though (He is still serving a 25 year prison sentence) about the death penalty and conversions to the Catholic faith I would put myself now at a 50. He has some powerful points to make and uses all real life examples the perspective of someone who is a convert to Catholicism himself and now runs a Catholic non-profit ministry to prisoners from prison.

[goldenchild17]

I am fully in support of the death penalty but I do believe one should be spared if they have demonstrated full repentance. I don't know that guy's story, but I think that might apply to him.