HisChildForever Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1334602691' post='2418831'] But I would bet her chastity (and love of Christ) (and that of her bf) makes a very good one barrier. I see what you are trying to say FP. I think I do. I find it a little 'offsetting' that a 15 year old is attempting to pontificate on something he really knows nothing about, experientially at least. But I can respect the fact that you love and trust our Church through her traditions, saints, and holy men and women of old; and our bishops and priests; and are using what little you have and still try to speak the truth of the Church. This is admirable, in attempt. And this is where I am having issues as well. I know HCF a little, and if I know anything it is her love for Jesus Christ and His Church. I have had many opportunities to 'read' her thoughts (not through clairvoyance) lol... and perhaps, just perhaps an upstanding person, such as her, can be perfectly chaste in the situation she mentioned. Dare I say many of my sisters and brothers in Christ could as well. While I find this to be true; on a personal level, having 'succumed' to these temptations personally, cannot help to think of it as a bad idea...a near occasion of sin.. but not sin, in and of itself. [/quote] Thanks for the compliments, they're appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 (edited) [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1334602691' post='2418831'] But I would bet her chastity (and love of Christ) (and that of her bf) makes a very good one barrier. I see what you are trying to say FP. I think I do. I find it a little 'offsetting' that a 15 year old is attempting to pontificate on something he really knows nothing about, experientially at least. But I can respect the fact that you love and trust our Church through her traditions, saints, and holy men and women of old; and our bishops and priests; and are using what little you have and still try to speak the truth of the Church. This is admirable, in attempt. And this is where I am having issues as well. I know HCF a little, and if I know anything it is her love for Jesus Christ and His Church. I have had many opportunities to 'read' her thoughts (not through clairvoyance) lol... and perhaps, just perhaps an upstanding person, such as her, can be perfectly chaste in the situation she mentioned. Dare I say many of my sisters and brothers in Christ could as well. While I find this to be true; on a personal level, having 'succumed' to these temptations personally, cannot help to think of it as a bad idea...a near occasion of sin.. but not sin, in and of itself. [/quote] Thank you for this great post. But here's the thing: Why must I have experience in it? Isn't the whole point of the Church's message not to sin and instead turn to Christ? Wouldn't Jesus be happy if I never experienced these things? It just seems like there's a rush and urgency to experience these things so I can understand, but the whole point is not to experience it. What would we say two generations down if not one person on earth experienced these things and there were chastity speakers that had no experience in it trying to teach kids to make sure it stays this way? "You shouldn't talk about this since you have no experience in sleeping in the same room with a woman"? I realize what everyone is saying, but it seems they're telling me to sin. Edited April 16, 2012 by FuturePriest387 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 no prob.. I missed you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='Papist' timestamp='1334602589' post='2418830'] Yes. There are many different scenarios of sharing a dwelling....too many to detail. I do not advocate that all be reduced down to the lowest common denominator. However, each decision should be preceded with thought and prudence. In HCF's example, I could never have done b/c it would most certainly caused my godchildren scandal...that's me and not a commentary on HCF and her boyfriend. [/quote]Exactly. "each decision should be preceded with thought and prudence." It's not always okay, not always a no. There are multiple factors to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1334602692' post='2418832'] But you said there was no problem with it. I asked Father John Flynn for the heck of it on both of the arguments (Both cohabitation and bed-sharing) so we'll see how this all pans out. Chances are, I'm wrong on some things and you're wrong on some things. We're very rarely 100% correct.[/quote] Sharing a hotel room is not the same as sharing a bed. My stance is that this is situational and something couples need to discuss. [quote]Yes, we are faced with temptations every day, but there's no need to put yourself in a situation where you might be very tempted. This is like saying "You know, I think I'm going to walk on a rail at the edge of the Grand Canyon. It's not necessary, but I may not fall, so it's fine." [/quote] Temptations don't have to be as extreme as, say, being naked in the same bed as your boyfriend or girlfriend. Sheesh. Sometimes just SEEING your significant other is a huge temptation. [quote]I'm not one-sided. In fact, I am a very big believer that these things occur the opposite way very frequently and sometimes more frequently, but I'm always afraid to share an opinion such as this on here. [/quote] You should be more even because otherwise you appear bias. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1334602894' post='2418835'] Thank you for this great post. But here's the thing: Why must I have experience in it? Isn't the whole point of the Church's message not to sin and instead turn to Christ? Wouldn't Jesus be happy if I never experienced these things? It just seems like there's a rush and urgency to experience these things so I can understand, but the whole point is not to experience it. What would we say two generations down if not one person on earth experienced these things and there were chastity speakers that had no experience in it trying to teach kids to make sure it stays this way? "You shouldn't talk about this since you have no experience in sleeping in the same room with a woman"? I realize what everyone is saying, but it seems they're telling me to sin. [/quote] wow, you really don't get it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1334603110' post='2418841'] wow, you really don't get it... [/quote] No poo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1334602940' post='2418836'] no prob.. I missed you. [/quote] O:] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1334603110' post='2418841'] wow, you really don't get it... [/quote] Yes, yes, you have experience, I don't, experience trumps knowledge, I get it. I'm simply asking what you would all say if in two generations nobody committed these sins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1334602692' post='2418832'] I am a very big believer ... [/quote] Did you just call yourself 'fat'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 no.. he called me fat. AGAIN! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1334602894' post='2418835'] Thank you for this great post. But here's the thing: Why must I have experience in it? Isn't the whole point of the Church's message not to sin and instead turn to Christ? Wouldn't Jesus be happy if I never experienced these things? It just seems like there's a rush and urgency to experience these things so I can understand, but the whole point is not to experience it. What would we say two generations down if not one person on earth experienced these things and there were chastity speakers that had no experience in it trying to teach kids to make sure it stays this way? "You shouldn't talk about this since you have no experience in sleeping in the same room with a woman"? I realize what everyone is saying, but it seems they're telling me to sin. [/quote] What?? No one is telling you to sin. The gist of MIKolbe's post: It's all well and good to read up on chastity and hear lectures about it, but when you're actually in the situation and when you have the experience of being in a mature relationship, it's not always so black-and-white as the books say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1334603235' post='2418845'] Yes, yes, you have experience, I don't, experience trumps knowledge, I get it. I'm simply asking what you would all say if in two generations nobody committed these sins. [/quote] In two generations, he will be saying: "Get off my lawn!", and "Where's my Aleve?"[quote name='HisChildForever' timestamp='1334603285' post='2418848'] What?? No one is telling you to sin. The gist of MIKolbe's post: It's all well and good to read up on chastity and hear lectures about it, but when you're actually in the situation and when you have the experience of being in a mature relationship, it's not always so black-and-white as the books say. [/quote] I am telling him to sin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='HisChildForever' timestamp='1334603285' post='2418848'] What?? No one is telling you to sin. The gist of MIKolbe's post: It's all well and good to read up on chastity and hear lectures about it, but when you're actually in the situation and when you have the experience of being in a mature relationship, it's not always so black-and-white as the books say. [/quote] I know it's not black and white. Despite popular belief, I have experienced great sexual temptations and, let's not forget, I was addicted to the sins of the flesh. I realize it's not as black and white as simply saying "No". Everyday I would think "Why don't I just say no? It's that easy." but it's not. There's more to it than that, unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissScripture Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 [quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1334602894' post='2418835'] Thank you for this great post. But here's the thing: Why must I have experience in it? Isn't the whole point of the Church's message not to sin and instead turn to Christ? Wouldn't Jesus be happy if I never experienced these things? It just seems like there's a rush and urgency to experience these things so I can understand, but the whole point is not to experience it. What would we say two generations down if not one person on earth experienced these things and there were chastity speakers that had no experience in it trying to teach kids to make sure it stays this way? "You shouldn't talk about this since you have no experience in sleeping in the same room with a woman"? I realize what everyone is saying, but it seems they're telling me to sin. [/quote] No, people are telling you that you view the world as a 15 year old, which tends to be very black and white. That's okay. That's how 15 year olds see the world. It's normal. The problem is when you start trying to push those views to fit situations that are not black and white. No one is saying you need to experience sleeping in the same room as anyone to comment on it. They're telling you that you need more life experience in general to see the world through a different scope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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