LouisvilleFan Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 In response to the poll: I don't get the point of classifying this as venial or mortal sin. For one, there are varying degrees of grinding depending on just how much two people want to mess around, so I could see some not being a sin at all and others being close enough to sexual intercouse that it may well be mortal sin. All I can do is use some common sense and my conscience to judge each situation on its merits (or lack thereof). Second, the more serious grinding can be very objectifying of those involved. That makes the question of marriage irrelevant.
StColette Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='LouisvilleFan' date='10 September 2009 - 10:17 AM' timestamp='1252592266' post='1964408'] It's the other way around... the physical contact, not love or even physical attraction. Arousal is a purely physical response certain stimuli, like sneezing is to an itch in your nose. Sometimes it happens even with close relatives where there is (hopefully) no romantic attraction whatsoever. Men just learn to ignore it. Of course, this is why we become pretty good at ignoring women we are actually attracted to [/quote] So you're saying love and physical attraction aren't stimuli? I'm pretty sure my husband would beg to differ.
Jaime Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='txdinghysailor' date='10 September 2009 - 07:50 AM' timestamp='1252583457' post='1964387'] Some girls I know grind their hips into you when they hug [/quote] That's what happens when you have to pay for hugs
Jaime Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='StColette' date='10 September 2009 - 10:57 AM' timestamp='1252594665' post='1964425'] So you're saying love and physical attraction aren't stimuli? I'm pretty sure my husband would beg to differ. [/quote] To be fair, Micah has had to beg for most things in his life
Sojourner Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='LouisvilleFan' date='10 September 2009 - 10:17 AM' timestamp='1252592266' post='1964408'] It's the other way around... the physical contact, not love or even physical attraction. Arousal is a purely physical response certain stimuli, like sneezing is to an itch in your nose. Sometimes it happens even with close relatives where there is (hopefully) no romantic attraction whatsoever. Men just learn to ignore it. Of course, this is why we become pretty good at ignoring women we are actually attracted to [/quote] [quote name='StColette' date='10 September 2009 - 10:57 AM' timestamp='1252594665' post='1964425'] So you're saying love and physical attraction aren't stimuli? I'm pretty sure my husband would beg to differ. [/quote] Yeah I would say my husband would agree with Micah. Perhaps for some guys it is just the physical contact that does it, but for others it is a more complex response involving emotional and physical attraction. Not being a guy, of course, I cannot swear to this, but it has come up in conversation from time to time.
Nihil Obstat Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='hot stuff' date='10 September 2009 - 10:23 AM' timestamp='1252596212' post='1964431'] That's what happens when you have to pay for hugs [/quote] [quote name='hot stuff' date='10 September 2009 - 10:43 AM' timestamp='1252597430' post='1964436'] To be fair, Micah has had to beg for most things in his life [/quote] Double zing! Unfortunately I have no free +1s at the moment.
Slappo Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='StColette' date='10 September 2009 - 07:57 AM' timestamp='1252594665' post='1964425'] So you're saying love and physical attraction aren't stimuli? I'm pretty sure my husband would beg to differ. [/quote] You don't even need to grab Micah. I would beg to differ.
rachael Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='hot stuff' date='10 September 2009 - 11:23 AM' timestamp='1252596212' post='1964431'] That's what happens when you have to pay for hugs [/quote] [quote name='hot stuff' date='10 September 2009 - 11:43 AM' timestamp='1252597430' post='1964436'] To be fair, Micah has had to beg for most things in his life [/quote]
StColette Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='Terra Firma' date='10 September 2009 - 01:08 PM' timestamp='1252602522' post='1964471'] Yeah I would say my husband would agree with Micah. Perhaps for some guys it is just the physical contact that does it, but for others it is a more complex response involving emotional and physical attraction. Not being a guy, of course, I cannot swear to this, but it has come up in conversation from time to time. [/quote] Yeah, I would say for some men it's more of the physical contact that does it, but from the men that I've spoken with it's more of an emotional level and physical attraction. I can't swear by this either, but like you said it has come up in conversations with other guys and my husband. [quote name='Slappo' date='10 September 2009 - 01:12 PM' timestamp='1252602754' post='1964473'] You don't even need to grab Micah. I would beg to differ. [/quote] lol glad we have a man that agrees.
Slappo Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='StColette' date='10 September 2009 - 10:22 AM' timestamp='1252603337' post='1964481'] Yeah, I would say for some men it's more of the physical contact that does it, but from the men that I've spoken with it's more of an emotional level and physical attraction. I can't swear by this either, but like you said it has come up in conversations with our guys and my husband. [/quote] Yes, the thing is it doesn't require physical [b]touch[/b]. Vocals, and visual stimuli are physical though. They send sound waves and light streams through the eyes or ears to the brain giving the brain a message. And when it is a woman who they are hearing or seeing, especially a woman they are attracted to and have deep emotional feelings for, the sense of sight and hearing become all the more pleasing (I'd rather hear my fiance's voice then my dad's for instance). Those pleasures even if they are sight and sound stimuli can cause arousal preparing a man for intercourse (even if logically it is impossible... I.E 500 miles away from each other). Of course this would be more common with someone he was romantically involved with or married to.
Jaime Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 ok negative points for being funny. This is an interesting system indeed
CatherineM Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 If it required physical touch to be stimulated, that would sure put a crimp into those who make their living off phone sex.
LouisvilleFan Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 (edited) [quote name='StColette' date='10 September 2009 - 11:57 AM' timestamp='1252594665' post='1964425'] So you're saying love and physical attraction aren't stimuli? I'm pretty sure my husband would beg to differ. [/quote] [quote name='hot stuff' date='10 September 2009 - 12:43 PM' timestamp='1252597430' post='1964436'] To be fair, Micah has had to beg for most things in his life [/quote] [quote name='Terra Firma' date='10 September 2009 - 02:08 PM' timestamp='1252602522' post='1964471'] Yeah I would say my husband would agree with Micah. Perhaps for some guys it is just the physical contact that does it, but for others it is a more complex response involving emotional and physical attraction. Not being a guy, of course, I cannot swear to this, but it has come up in conversation from time to time. [/quote] To make sure we're on the same page, we are talking about nothing more than arousal (because someone asked on the previous page about things like eye gazes and hand holding caused a guy to be aroused). Stimuli are received through our senses, so physical attraction obviously is, but not love is not something we can sense. A husband is not aroused by his wife because he loves her. He's aroused out of physical attraction, just like any other woman. Love is choosing to ignore the pleasure of arousal from other women in order to enjoy it solely with his wife. Arousal, for the matter, is basically the opposite of love: it's a bodily response outside of a guy's control. Arousal is hardly even connected with love; often it just means it's time to wake up. What we control is our choices: we know what actions and situations will encourage or discourage arousal. Love, however, is by nature a choice and it is a gift of the whole self, not just the body. Edited September 10, 2009 by LouisvilleFan
StColette Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='CatherineM' date='10 September 2009 - 02:35 PM' timestamp='1252607751' post='1964510'] If it required physical touch to be stimulated, that would sure put a crimp into those who make their living off phone sex. [/quote]
LouisvilleFan Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 (edited) [quote name='CatherineM' date='10 September 2009 - 03:35 PM' timestamp='1252607751' post='1964510'] If it required physical touch to be stimulated, that would sure put a crimp into those who make their living off phone sex. [/quote] Yeah, I didn't mean to imply physical contact is the only way for a guy to be aroused. Any kind of stimuli can do it, especially simulating real stimuli with imagination, and it can happen with women or girls with whom sexual attraction would be incestuous. It can be completely random. Biologically, arousal is caused by an increase in blood flow "down there," which sometimes happens without any stimulus at all. In all seriousness, love has nothing to do with it. Thus, is it obvious why discipline is so important to being chaste? Edited September 10, 2009 by LouisvilleFan
StColette Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='LouisvilleFan' date='10 September 2009 - 02:35 PM' timestamp='1252607757' post='1964511'] A husband is not aroused by his wife because he loves her. He's aroused out of physical attraction, just like any other woman. [/quote] Just making sure I'm reading this correctly because I think there might be a typo. "He's aroused out of physical attraction, just like any other woman." Did you mean to say "He's aroused out of physical attraction, just like toward any other woman" or "He's aroused out of physical attraction, just like any other man" or "He's aroused out of physical attraction, just like any woman." or something like that lol That sentence just reads a little funny, so I'm just trying to clarify.
XIX Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 [quote name='txdinghysailor' date='10 September 2009 - 08:50 AM' timestamp='1252583457' post='1964387'] Some girls I know grind their hips into you when they hug [/quote] Wow. Um. That's very very verrrryyy different from my experience. I hug all the time and I've never been close to having that happen.
txdinghysailor Posted September 11, 2009 Posted September 11, 2009 [quote name='XIX' date='10 September 2009 - 04:13 PM' timestamp='1252610027' post='1964526'] Wow. Um. That's very very verrrryyy different from my experience. I hug all the time and I've never been close to having that happen. [/quote] uhuh yeah well you more than likely don't hang out with the types of girls that i do.
rachael Posted September 11, 2009 Posted September 11, 2009 [quote name='hot stuff' date='10 September 2009 - 02:06 PM' timestamp='1252606011' post='1964498'] ok negative points for being funny. This is an interesting system indeed [/quote] I tried to plus ya. People cannot take a joke...
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