Passover One Week Away

[todd_vetter33]

I came here to the debate table to discuss and debate the information which I share at this link.

[url="http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf"][color="#284b72"]http://www.thedeatha...20catholics.pdf[/color][/url]

Instead of debate on the topic presented, I am greeted with indignation and opinions with out receiving any evidence to support the view that goes contrary to what I have come to share and debate. How can one claim that what I have come to share is false if they do not take the time to review it and illustrate any area of testimony that is not presenting a truth based on the evidence presented? [u][b][color="#0000ff"]I'm only asking for a page number and the illustration of testimony on a single page that is presenting somthing false[/color][/b][/u].[color="#0000ff"][b][u]This has yet to be provided to me yet it has recently in this thread been claimed that I have been profided this![/u][/b][/color]

"dominicansoul, on 26 March 2010 - 04:34 PM, said:[color="#0000ff"]you have been given ample instructions and comments from those here[/color], but you absolutely refuse them. I don't think anyone on this phorum should waste any time giving you anymore if you absolutely refuse to accept what has already been given to you. You are very stubborn, as all your threads and posts have displayed. You don't want to know the Truth. You are convinced you already possess it. So, why should any of us bother feeding what is holy to the dog? You have only shredded and spit on what has already been given to you. Sorry, but our Faith is way too precious to be wasted on swine."

Though Domincansoul claims I have been given ample instructions, have I been given truth? I know I have been provided information that dances far off from the topic presented. To make it clear for what i am asking, [color="#0000ff"][u][b]illustrate any page 1-36 where I present an Error?[/b][/u][/color] This should be simple for the self proclaimed pillar of truth which claims Jesus was Crucified on a Friday and I clearly state this event occured on Wednesday. Only one of these perceptions gets to be the truth of the Matter.

How can anyone make a better case for truth regarding this topic with out providing evidence of greater truth and illustrating my Error with more than opinion since we are using the same Catholic Doctrine (Bible)?

Will there be a real debate that will lead to the discovery of truth for me or for you; or will we simply see more animated graphix and opinion? You are group of people self proclaimed to be the pillars and source of truth. Please show me the truth by illustrating where I am not preseting a truth on pages 1-36 of this shared study. help me see the light of truth that God has given you. In the name of truth for the love of truth is ask this of you.

[color="#0000ff"][u][b]I have yet to be given the instruction I have asked for. If I do not posses the truth for the topic of this thread please illustrate the page number and the testimony which is clearly false from the link provided at the beginning of this post.
[/b][/u][/color]
God Bless

Edited March 26, 2010 by todd_vetter33

[todd_vetter33]

I just have one last question for the Self Proclaimed pillar of truth community.

[color="#0000ff"]Why is it physically impossible for any member of this thread to illustrate a page number from 1-36 where a lie is bing told?
[/color]
[url="http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf"]http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf[/url]

If this could be done, surely by now it would have been done. Some have claimed the opinion that I use fictitional references. All references are part of Catholic Christian history and I give ample evidence of this in the study shared. They have provided no evidence for their claim of Fictitous writings or why the current Catholic perception of Catholic Bible NT testimony is greater than any other ancient work.

God Bless

[Winchester]

[quote name='todd_vetter33' date='26 March 2010 - 05:11 PM' timestamp='1269637917' post='2080883']
Please provide evidence of your statement.
[/quote]
I explained it already. Go read it again.

[todd_vetter33]

[quote name='Winchester' date='26 March 2010 - 10:07 PM' timestamp='1269659275' post='2081078']
I explained it already. Go read it again.
[/quote]

I missed the page number from the study you specified in your reply.

[HisChildForever]

Can we make font color requests? I want to see you use pink.

[Winchester]

[quote name='todd_vetter33' date='26 March 2010 - 11:13 PM' timestamp='1269659594' post='2081085']
I missed the page number from the study you specified in your reply.
[/quote]
Another book for you.
[img]http://csbookstore.com.au/images/Basic%20Reading%20Skills%20Years%201%20-%202.jpg[/img]

[Tridenteen]

[img]http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51A1Y5JGXYL.jpg[/img]JMJ

Edited March 27, 2010 by Tridenteen

[todd_vetter33]

[quote name='HisChildForever' date='26 March 2010 - 10:21 PM' timestamp='1269660074' post='2081090']
Can we make font color requests? I want to see you use pink.
[/quote]

The color pink was used on Page 27. God Bless

[url="http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf"]http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf[/url]

Edited April 12, 2010 by todd_vetter33

[todd_vetter33]

It's been almost a month since I came here to the debate table to discuss and debate the information which I share at this link. This debate should be simple since my request is simple. Illustrate a single page number where a lie is being told based on the historical references given from pages 1-37.

[url="http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf"]http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf[/url]

Instead of debate on the topic presented, I am greeted with indignation and opinions with out receiving any evidence to support the view that goes contrary to what I have come to share and debate. How can one claim that what I have come to share is false if they do not take the time to review it and illustrate any area of testimony that is not presenting a truth based on the evidence presented? [b][u]I'm only asking for a page number and the illustration of testimony on a single page that is presenting somthing false[/u][/b].[b][u]This has yet to be provided to me yet it has recently in this thread been claimed that I have been profided this![/u][/b]

[u]"dominicansoul, on 26 March 2010 - 04:34 PM, said:you have been given ample instructions and comments from those here, but you absolutely refuse them. I don't think anyone on this phorum should waste any time giving you anymore if you absolutely refuse to accept what has already been given to you. You are very stubborn, as all your threads and posts have displayed. You don't want to know the Truth. You are convinced you already possess it. So, why should any of us bother feeding what is holy to the dog? You have only shredded and spit on what has already been given to you. Sorry, but our Faith is way too precious to be wasted on swine."[/u]

I have been given a great deal of pictures and flowery statements that have nothing or little to do with the topic presented and the statements that almost appear to engage the topic of conversation offer nothing more than opinion.

Though Domincansoul claims I have been given ample instructions, have I been given truth? I know I have been provided information that dances far off from the topic presented. To make it clear for what i am asking, [b][u]illustrate any page 1-37 where I present an Error?[/u][/b] This should be simple for the self proclaimed pillar of truth which claims Jesus was Crucified on a Friday and I clearly state this event occured on Wednesday. Only one of these perceptions gets to be the truth of the Matter.

How can anyone make a better case for truth regarding this topic with out providing evidence of greater truth and illustrating my Error with more than opinion since we are using the same Catholic Doctrine (Bible)?

Will there be a real debate that will lead to the discovery of truth for me or for you; or will we simply see more animated graphix and opinion? You are group of people self proclaimed to be the pillars and source of truth. Please show me the truth by illustrating where I am not preseting a truth on pages 1-37 of this shared study. help me see the light of truth that God has given you. In the name of truth for the love of truth I ask this of you.

[u][b]I have yet to be given the instruction I have asked for. If I do not posses the truth for the topic of this thread please illustrate the page number and the testimony which is clearly false from the link provided at the beginning of this post.
[/b]
[/u]God Bless

[Nihil Obstat]

One lie: Use of the KJV. Your use of this translation is inherently flawed because the KJV contains errors that constitute lies.

Another lie: "This study will show with clarity how blah blah blah blah blah." There is no clarity in your "study".

Next lie: Never mind. After that my eyes started to hurt from that formatting we've all been complaining about since you joined six months ago.

[todd_vetter33]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='12 April 2010 - 01:14 PM' timestamp='1271096090' post='2091609']
One lie: Use of the KJV. Your use of this translation is inherently flawed because the KJV contains errors that constitute lies.

Another lie: "This study will show with clarity how blah blah blah blah blah." There is no clarity in your "study".

Next lie: Never mind. After that my eyes started to hurt from that formatting we've all been complaining about since you joined six months ago.
[/quote]


The Errors that I point out in the KJV are also Present any any Catholic Version of the bible you should choose too use from any Catholic Bible translation. The Errors That I have clearly illustrated are shared by all Christian bible versions. Any bible you choose is Catholic Doctrine based on Catholic Doctrine. Christian denominations are simply a branch off from current Catholic recognized doctrine.

Edited April 12, 2010 by todd_vetter33

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='todd_vetter33' date='12 April 2010 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1271108665' post='2091868']
The Errors that I point out in the KJV are also Present any any Catholic Version of the bible you Choose from any point in Catholic Bible translations. The Errors That I have clearly illustrated are shared by all Christian bible versions.
[/quote]
Your "errors" aren't errors. The Catholic Bible contains no errors.

[todd_vetter33]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='12 April 2010 - 04:45 PM' timestamp='1271108736' post='2091870']
Your "errors" aren't errors. The Catholic Bible contains no errors.
[/quote]


So when the Catholic bible places the Anointing in Bethany Prior to the Crucifixion according to John, 6 days before the Passover while Matt and Mark place this same one time event two days before the Passover. This is not an Error? Can a single one time event occur on more than one day and still be truth if it only happend one time?

Matt and Luke place Jesus driving out the money changers from the temple on the same day as the triumphal entry while Mark places this one time event the day after the triumphal entry. John places this event in the second chapter of john implying that this event occured two years before it actually occured. Are these not Errors?

If these are Not Errors, how can you have a leg to stand on by claiming the KJV is riddled with Errors and not the Catholic version when these are the very Errors I call to question. If truth for a single event does not exist, how then can the Catholic church claim to be of the truth and the source of it if their Doctrine can't seem to produce the truth concerning signifigant events in the life of the one they claim to serve?

Edited April 12, 2010 by todd_vetter33

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='todd_vetter33' date='12 April 2010 - 04:56 PM' timestamp='1271109369' post='2091893']
So when the Catholic bible places the Anointing in Bethany Prior to the Crucifixion according to John, 6 days before the Passover while Matt and Mark place this same one time event two days before the Passover. This is not an Error? Can a single one time event occur on more than one day and still be truth if it only happend one time?

Matt and Luke place Jesus driving out the money changers from the temple on the same day as the triumphal entry while Mark places this one time event the day after the triumphal entry. John places this event in the second chapter of john implying that this event occured two years before it actually occured. Are these not Errors?

If these are Not Errors, how can you have a leg to stand on by claiming the KJV is riddled with Errors and not the Catholic version when these are the very Errors I call to question. If truth for a single event does not exist, how then can the Catholic church claim to be of the truth and the source of it if their Doctrine can't seem to produce the truth concerning signifigant events in the life of the one they claim to serve?
[/quote]
There are no errors in Holy Scripture.

[todd_vetter33]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='12 April 2010 - 05:07 PM' timestamp='1271110061' post='2091907']
There are no errors in Holy Scripture.
[/quote]


This is a point we can both agree on. Now define holy Scriptures. I define holy scriptures as that which proceeded from the mouth of God.

Which of these below sayings proceeded from the mouth of God? Both are a recording for the same point in history so only one gets to be a written reflection of Holy Scripture.

Matthew 16:21 From that time Jesus began to show to His disciples that He must go to Jerusalem, and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, [u][color="#ff0000"]and be raised the third day[/color]. [/u]

Mark 8:31 And he began to teach them that the Son of man must suffer many things and be rejected of the elders and of the chief priests and scribes and be killed, [color="#0000ff"][b][u]and after three days rise again[/u][/b]

You'll find that page 11 addresses this issue in concert with Matt 12:40 along with the scripture of Time as God defined it.

[url="http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf"]http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf[/url][/color]

Edited April 12, 2010 by todd_vetter33

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='todd_vetter33' date='12 April 2010 - 05:22 PM' timestamp='1271110940' post='2091938']
This is a point we can both agree on. Now define holy Scriptures. I define holy scriptures as that which proceeded from the mouth of God.

Which of these sayings proceeded from the mouth of God? Both are a recording for the same point in history so only one gets to be a written reflection of Holy Scripture.

Matthew 16:21 From that time Jesus began to show to His disciples that He must go to Jerusalem, and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, [u]and be raised the third day[/color]. [/u]

Mark 8:31 And he began to teach them that the Son of man must suffer many things and be rejected of the elders and of the chief priests and scribes and be killed, [b][u]and after three days rise again[/u][/b]
[/quote]
Holy Scripture is presented accurately in the texts used by the Catholic Church.

Stop using colour tags.


Many people have already told you that these two passages mean the same thing.
Scripture wasn't written in English.

Do you actually understand the concept that other languages aren't just some weird code for English? They are actually completely different.

Edited April 12, 2010 by Nihil Obstat

[todd_vetter33]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='12 April 2010 - 05:24 PM' timestamp='1271111094' post='2091942']
Holy Scripture is presented accurately in the texts used by the Catholic Church.

Stop using colour tags.


Many people have already told you that these two passages mean the same thing.
Scripture wasn't written in English.

Do you actually understand the concept that other languages aren't just some weird code for English? They are actually completely different.
[/quote]


Were the text I shared any different from Catholic verses for the issues addressed? Many people have stated the two very different sayings mean the same thing but this is an opinion not backed by any facts. I do understand the concept that other languages aren't just some wierd code for English and it's for this reason that I can say with a truth that Jesus was crucified on a Wednesday. According to Jewish Law a preparation day does not always fall on a Friday despite English and Christian speculations regarding this due to lacking understanding of Jewish Laws.

If Holy scripture is Perfect and God defined time in holy scripture. How do you get three days and three nights out of a Friday Crucifixion to a first day of the week resurrection? Please illustrate the perfection of this concept by illustrating 3 days and 3 nights with this concept.

Edited April 12, 2010 by todd_vetter33

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='todd_vetter33' date='12 April 2010 - 05:31 PM' timestamp='1271111478' post='2091945']
Were the text I shared any different from Catholic verses for the issues addressed? Many people have stated the two very different sayings mean the same thing but this is an opinion not backed by any facts. I do understand the concept that other languages aren't just some wierd code for English and it's for this reason that I can say with a truth that Jesus was crucified on a Wednesday. According to Jewish Law a preparation day does not always fall on a Friday despite English and Christian speculations regarding this due to lacking understanding of Jewish Laws.

If Holy scripture is Perfect and God defined time in holy scripture. How do you get three days and three nights out of a Friday Crucifixion to a first day of the week resurrection? Please illustrate the perfection of this concept by illustrating 3 days and 3 nights with this concept.
[/quote]
Take it up with someone who has done a formal, scholarly study of Scripture, if you can find one who will take you seriously.

[todd_vetter33]

I was able to illustrate 3 days and 3 nights fulfilled in accordence with all the scriptures (words that proceeded from the mouth of God from OT and NT) showing that Jesus fulfilled this holy scripture. Why can you not do this?

I have clearly illustrated the prophecies (perfect holy scripture) as well as thier fulfillment on pages 2, 11, 18, 19, 23, 25, 28, 34, and 35.

Where is your evidence that Jesus fulfilled the perfect Holy Scripture of 3 days and 3 nights? This is what the holy scripture says is it not? I know it's not in Error but the friday crucifixion concept says this was not a truth spoken by God. Just ask any Jew. No matter how you want to bend human perception. You don't get 3 days and 3 nights from a Friday crucifixion concept.

Please feel free to check my referenced pages. I will be happy to view your portrayal of 3 days and 3 nights in fulfillment should you be willing to provide this information.

[url="http://www.thedeathandresurection.com/pdf/the%20death%20and%20resurrection%20for%20catholics.pdf"]http://www.thedeatha...20catholics.pdf[/url]

Edited April 12, 2010 by todd_vetter33

[Nihil Obstat]

[url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showforum=13"]My link[/url]

Raphael
Raphael, aka Micah Murphy, is a graduate of Franciscan University of Steubenville with a Bachelor of Arts degree in Theology and Catechetics, as well as a Latin minor. His theological interests include Scripture, Justification Theology, Theosis, Sacramentology, and the Holy Trinity.
StColette
StColette, aka Jennie Murphy, is a graduate of Franciscan University of Steubenville with a Bachelor of Arts degree in Theology. Her theological specialties include Biblical exegesis, Hebrew, and Mariology.