That's All, Folks! Or So I Thought...

[PhuturePriest]

I've been thinking about this a lot recently because not only my Prioress, but also two priests I have spoken with recently (a spiritual director and a Confessor) have brought up the fact that they think I have been 'wounded' by past experiences in religious life. Each one of these wonderful people has been helping me with the healing process but they have done more than that.They have made me think about how easy it is for human beings to want to find someone to 'blame' for anything that goes wrong. 

 

Of course a community is going to blame the person who leaves - it justifies their own behavior and takes away any feelings of guilt or responsibility or a need to change. But guess what? The same thing can happen in the person who leaves - only they usually have to face one of two options - either accept all the blame themselves and feel like a worthless failure, or put all the blame on the community to ease their pain and feelings of rejection/failure.

 

But the truth is that relationships are complex and no two people handle the same situation in the same way. Sometimes when I talk to my biological sister about her work environment I don't think I could handle what she puts up with, but to her it is almost like water off a duck's back - because she has a different temperament than I do, different expectations of her work environment, and different factors in her life that make it possible for her to put up with what sounds like sheer insanity (she works for the public service and there is a lot of dysfunction and lack of common sense there). But she tells me that she feels like she makes a difference and she actually enjoys the work she does, if not all of the nonsense. She is a plodder, putting one foot in front of the other and enduring whatever comes her way.

 

If we understand the fact that some communities are basically just dysfunctional (like some families), then people like my sister have the nature, temperament, personality, or skills to put up with a this kind of environment and to actually grow from it (St Therese springs to mind), and to focus only on their work and their end goals.Others, perhaps a bit more like me, find some situations almost unbearable and can't make it through any kind of perceived 'insanity'. I tell my sister how much I admire her and wish I were more like her. But she tells me that there is no way she could have lived the life I have, with its adventure, challenges, obstacles, abuses and rejections etc. She calls me courageous and passionate and ready to give everything of myself whereas she sees herself as more timid and fearful because she would rather put up with the difficulties in her job that she already knows, than face the uncertainty of trying to find a new job where there might be other problems that she would have to cope with. God gave each of us our own strengths and weaknesses so we can live the lives that He has given us.

 

Trying to find someone to blame for the breakdown of a relationship between a community and a candidate is really counter-productive to moving forward (for both sides). When communities blame the candidates who fail - it is often so that they don't have to face their own shortcomings or make changes to what has always appeared to work in the past (even if they haven't had any vocations enter or stay in ages). But sometimes it is because they have actually been through quite a lot themselves by previous candidates and they try to develop a self-defense mechanism on behalf of the whole community. Some of the stories I have heard about candidates who enter and then either end up doing a 'fly by night' (disappearing without a word to anyone) or telling a Prioress that they have just phoned someone to come pick them up as they are leaving that day (with no prior warning) or going insane (one sat on her window ledge and threatened to jump) or simply refusing to accept the psychological evaluation for entrance (one had her father phone up and threaten the psychologist with legal action if he didn't change his negative evaluation), etc etc. Let's face it, there are a lot of 'weirdos' in the world (expert psychological term :) ). And communities have to deal with their fair share of them.

 

But it is also easy for candidates who leave to try to deal with their own pain by blaming everything on the community instead of accepting that the relationship is just not working out -- and perhaps due in part to their own nature and temperament they are simply not suited to cope with the eccentricities (or defects or dysfunction - choose your word) of that particular community. In my opinion, honesty helps. It's good to analyse the failings of the community, but only from a distance and stripped of their emotional impact on the candidate - which can't be done immediately after a painful separation. But eventually the candidate needs to examine their own expectations and try to determine whether these were realistic given the lack of knowledge/information prior to actually living the life with that community, and more importantly, taking into account their own nature and temperament, strengths and weaknesses.

 

I am also discovering that it is more healing to admit that for whatever reasons, some relationships (between a candidate and a community) are simply not life-affirming for either side, and both sides are better off if it ends. That doesn't mean that there wasn't any value in the relationship for the period that it lasted. There are always things to be learned, especially through adversity. In order to move forward though, it is important (at least for the candidate in order to heal) to reflect on the experience - not the negatives of the pain and hurt or assigning blame - but on the lessons learned about oneself and the possibilities the future still holds. Of course, this is a lot easier to do when one is feeling good about things that are currently happening in their lives - that is why it is important not to get stuck - or to dwell any longer than absolutely necessary on one's 'woundedness'. It is easy to 'wallow' in self-pity and get stuck there if one is not careful - that's why anger (at God) is sometimes better (at least for me), because it doesn't feel quite as good as self-pity, so it's easier to want to get out of it sooner. But that's just me. Then end of any relationship involves grief, and we all deal with this in our times, and our own ways. But eventually, with any grief, it is time to let go, let God, and move on again.

 

So the sooner one gets out of the negative aspects of the past, the sooner one starts to move forward and to feel better about the present and the future -- and then glancing back at the past doesn't seem to hurt as much anymore. It just becomes a small part of the tapestry of one's life.

 

They say that what doesn't kill you makes you strong.I don't know if that's true, but I do like this quote that my sister keeps on her fridge.

 

"There is a crack in everything. That's how the light gets in."  - Leonard Cohen

 

 

I think this is officially the longest post in the history of Phatmass.

[marigold]

Say a prayer for me as I keep figuring out a good way to make my Mondays off work as some kind of retreat... while balancing it with shopping, bills and packing up the flat to move.

 

Cross-posting this here for my own future reference http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/topic/134334-a-thirst-for-deeper-prayer-versus-a-vocation-to-contemplative-life/

[Credo in Deum]

I think this is officially the longest post in the history of Phatmass.

 

Close, but no cigar.  IMO, Josh holds the title for longest post.

 

http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/topic/133972-agnostics-and-atheist/?p=2671392

Edited July 7, 2014 by Credo in Deum

[Nunsense]

Close, but no cigar.  IMO, Josh holds the title for longest post.

 

http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/topic/133972-agnostics-and-atheist/?p=2671392

 

 

You're right - I am nowhere near the record holder. In addition to the one you mention, BarbTherese does quite well with length on Transmundane Lane, but here on VS, I have to say that I think Granciandelamadrededios might be the record holder because she posts whole chapters out of the Constitutions and Paper of Exactions. In the Debate Table, I am outmatched by quite a few posters. I think this was just FP trying to tell me that my post was tl;dr.   :P

[cmaD2006]

Agreed Graciandelamadrededios I think would get the record on VS.

 

Nunsense -- post was good :).  FP just missed out if he thought "tl;dr".

 

Marigold -- when I get a chance I am hoping to post my own personal thoughts.  I have several, although I think I have posted my personal opinion in the past relating to my own experiences in religious life, so I don't think I will really say anything new (and I think some may disagree with my opinions -- and that's ok).  You're welcome to PM me too if you wish.

 

I will be praying for you.

[marigold]

Thank you!

 

I am very interested to hear your thoughts. I know you've been through a lot with leaving communities too. Whether you want to do that here or on PM is up to you - I don't mind.

[cmaD2006]

:)

 

One thought I will leave publically is this:  All things work for the good of those who love Him (Rom 8:28). 

 

I said this to a friend of mine this weekend:  if I had not gone through what I went through with my (most recent) former community, I would not have grown to what I am today.  That is grace.  Not that I would want to do it again -- but God deemed it necessary.

 

Note that I specifically did not say "God willed it" ... He permits us in our humanity to make choices, and He permits others to do the same.  So at times -- things happen that aren't pretty/pleasant, but because we have free will God allows it and God works through it.

 

[brandelynmarie]

^^^^ This. :) In His Permissive Will...yes. I have also been told by a certain someone ;) that God is the Great Recycler...He takes our rubbish & creates wondrous things out of it...if we let Him. :blush:

[cmaD2006]

great recycler.  Nice ;)

[maximillion]

I thought leaving the convent would pretty much finish me off as a person. I was wrong.

I thought I had failed God. Wrong again.

I wondered what on earth I could do to find my place and my vocation, since I had just given mine up. I was wrong on that score too.

 

Of course, leaving of ones own choice is different to having been asked to leave, but ultimately it comes down to the same thing. 

He wanted me to do that, now He wants me to do this......

 

The benefit of hindsight is a wonderful thing!

 

It took time, distance, prayer, tears, anger, anxiety, friends, time, distance, prayer, effort, time, distance, and prayer!!!!!

It was ages before I realised we all have a vocation and I had not lost mine, it had simply changed to being outside the cloister. Finding a way of living my Vows in private was tough. (Still is) Finding my way emotionally and FINALLY seeing a therapist helped a huge amount.

How I wish there had been VS back then, so many wonderfully supportive, accepting and understanding people.......finding community here is wonderful - the best!

People here don't react when I say I was a nun, they don't act scandalised that I left. They even sometimes encourage me to reminisce (thank you!).

 

[Credo in Deum]

^^^^ This. :) In His Permissive Will...yes. I have also been told by a certain someone ;) that God is the Great Recycler...He takes our rubbish & creates wondrous things out of it...if we let Him. :blush:

 

I see what they did there. 

[brandelynmarie]

Yes!

[BarbTherese]

http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/topic/127339-thats-all-folks-or-so-i-thought/page-6#entry2684705

 

Excellent post, maximilion - and thank you very much for sharing your story. When I left religious life in my teens I was told "You have lost your vocation".  That really threw me for a while and then I thought "God will just give me another one" and happily I continued the dance and colourful journey that was to unfold and continues to unfold.  I was probably almost 17yrs old then and back then it was almost heresy in Catholic cultural thought to leave religious life and sometimes even in one's family.

 

Nowadays I know that the Love and Mercy of The Lord embraces absolutely everything without conditions or exclusions no matter how minor or major, negative or positive.  And that the choice of vocation is a choice made personally in complete free will and a commitment made.........and if it seems all wrong, one can simply move on in the dance free of all unjustified guilt and negativity with trust and confidence in Him alone............Mystery and The Dance.

Not to state that leaving a chosen vocation, for example, is always easy.  It can be accompanied by many doubts and struggles - emoting.......and that can be putting it very mildly indeed.  In other incidences it may not be so.

 

It took time, distance, prayer, tears, anger, anxiety, friends, time, distance, prayer, effort, time, distance, and prayer!!!!!

 

 

At 68yrs almost 69, I look back over my journey to date and the above (and all variations of) is what I call "the dance" and the hymn "Lord of The Dance" always reminds me of the process.....to my mind, we are always dancing with the whole gamut of emoting both negative and positive, concluding and deciding, falling and then rising, searching and then struggling with angels etc. and always with The Lord of The Dance......:

 

"Dance, then, wherever you may be;
I am the Lord of the Dance, said he.
And I’ll lead you all wherever you may be,
And I’ll lead you all in the dance, said he."

 

"I danced on a Friday and the sky turned black;
It’s hard to dance with the devil on your back;
They buried my body and they thought I’d gone,
But I am the dance and I still go on."

 

"They cut me down and I leapt up high,
I am the life that’ll never, never die;
I’ll live in you if you’ll live in me;
I am the Lord of the Dance, said he."

 

Full lyrics: http://www.hymnlyrics.org/mostpopularhymns/i_danced_in_the_morning.php

 

(For me "community" "unfold" and "journey" are important words and definitions......and probably fast creeping into my list is "Catholic cultural thought")

[marigold]

Excellent post, maximilion - and thank you very much for sharing your story. When I left religious life in my teens I was told "You have lost your vocation".  That really threw me for a while and then I thought "God will just give me another one" and happily I continued the dance and colourful journey that was to unfold and continues to unfold.  I was probably almost 17yrs old then and back then it was almost heresy in Catholic cultural thought to leave religious life and sometimes even in one's family.

 

Nowadays I know that the Love and Mercy of The Lord embraces absolutely everything without conditions or exclusions no matter how minor or major, negative or positive.  And that the choice of vocation is a choice made personally in complete free will and a commitment made.........and if it seems all wrong, one can simply move on in the dance free of all unjustified guilt and negativity with trust and confidence in Him alone............Mystery and The Dance.

Not to state that leaving a chosen vocation, for example, is always easy.  It can be accompanied by many doubts and struggles - emoting.......and that can be putting it very mildly indeed.  In other incidences it may not be so.

 

 

At 68yrs almost 69, I look back over my journey to date and the above (and all variations of) is what I call "the dance" and the hymn "Lord of The Dance" always reminds me of the process.....to my mind, we are always dancing with the whole gamut of emoting both negative and positive, concluding and deciding, falling and then rising, searching and then struggling with angels etc. and always with The Lord of The Dance......:

 

"Dance, then, wherever you may be;
I am the Lord of the Dance, said he.
And I’ll lead you all wherever you may be,
And I’ll lead you all in the dance, said he."

 

"I danced on a Friday and the sky turned black;
It’s hard to dance with the devil on your back;
They buried my body and they thought I’d gone,
But I am the dance and I still go on."

 

"They cut me down and I leapt up high,
I am the life that’ll never, never die;
I’ll live in you if you’ll live in me;
I am the Lord of the Dance, said he."

 

Full lyrics: http://www.hymnlyrics.org/mostpopularhymns/i_danced_in_the_morning.php

 

(For me "community" "unfold" and "journey" are important words and definitions......and probably fast creeping into my list is "Catholic cultural thought")

 

Thanks BarbaraTherese, you've got that song stuck in my head now! We used to sing that in primary school, along with the amazingly depressing When I Needed A Neighbour. Strange choices for a really secular school :hehe2:

 

The dancing thing - one of the sisters at my former community told me about a Chinese image that had been interpreted as a type of Christ. A huge dragon reared up his head, and instead of fighting it, the warrior leaps up on his head and dances him to death.

[BarbTherese]

Thanks BarbaraTherese, you've got that song stuck in my head now! We used to sing that in primary school, along with the amazingly depressing When I Needed A Neighbour. Strange choices for a really secular school :hehe2:

 

The dancing thing - one of the sisters at my former community told me about a Chinese image that had been interpreted as a type of Christ. A huge dragon reared up his head, and instead of fighting it, the warrior leaps up on his head and dances him to death.

 

Hi Marigold

I don't know (and it sounds fortunately so) "the amazingly depressing When I Needed A Neighbour".  The other hymn besides Lord of The Dance that can stick in my head and just wont go away for days on end  is "Go tell everyone".  Gosh in a secular school there was no hymn singing and back in the days prior to half an hour weekly RI - and now efforts are being made to ban a school chaplain.

 

Leaving Mass in my previous parish one Sunday, it was our final hymn and right down the back near the door was a little girl probably 5 or 6yrs old standing on a chair, arms waving around, singing on top note:

 

"And go tell everyone the news that the Kingdom of God has come,
And go tell everyone the news that the Kingdom of God has come"

 

,,,,,,,,,, her absolute emphasis was on "everyone"............("At that time Jesus answered and said: I confess to thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them to the little ones.")

 

LOL Loved that 'Chinese anecdote'................warrior image interpreted as Christ -who "dances the dragon to death after leaping on its head".............. quite an image, quite an image! :bike:
 

Edited July 10, 2014 by BarbaraTherese

[Hemma]

I'm so sorry to hear that. It's so hard to know what to do, how to react. *hugs*

 

Well I knew what to do. I wrote my own report for the visitator. But it was hard for me to know what to think about the whole thing. She can't be lying, but in some parts obviously she is. What about the other parts? As it is my former community and not my future one, I decided not to think about it any more but to leave things open. What should I do? It's also sad that we can't be friends like this, because she's so full of her fighting against the community.

Edited July 11, 2014 by Senensis

[brandelynmarie]

:weep: :amen: Peace be with you...

[TheresaThoma]

Senensis I'm sorry. Prayers for you and for your friend.

[AveMariaPurissima]

The image of God as the "Great Recycler" reminds me of another image that a priest friend of mine used:  God is like a GPS: even if we mess up the original path He had planned, God will always "recalculate our route." ;)

[brandelynmarie]

Love it...yes!