The World Is Full Of Sheep

[Jesus_lol]

[quote name='Luigi' timestamp='1329167464' post='2386524']
As a union member, I must strongly object to your stereotyping of union workers.


Nuance, my boy, nuance.
[/quote]

Its ok, as a 15 year old none of his opinions are really informed yet.

[PhuturePriest]

[quote name='Jesus_lol' timestamp='1329185952' post='2386670']


Its ok, as a 15 year old none of his opinions are really informed yet.
[/quote]

My opinions are quite informed. Unions keep demanding more pay, more pensions, and an earlier retirement age. When someone asks them to razzle dazzle it and to lower things just a little bit like the governor of Wisconsin did, they flipped and sent him death threats. There are some Unions that are fair, but most are breaking this country.

[eagle_eye222001]

[quote name='Luigi' timestamp='1329167464' post='2386524']
As a union member, I must strongly object to your stereotyping of union workers.


Nuance, my boy, nuance.
[/quote]

Fair point.

[quote name='Jesus_lol' timestamp='1329185952' post='2386670']
Its ok, as a 15 year old none of his opinions are really informed yet.
[/quote]

Right, have to wait until the magic age of 16 and THEN your opinions are informed. Heck, it takes some until 23 years old to get a better informed understanding of Catholicism.

[quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1329193423' post='2386746']
My opinions are quite informed. Unions keep demanding more pay, more pensions, and an earlier retirement age. When someone asks them to razzle dazzle it and to lower things just a little bit like the governor of Wisconsin did, they flipped and sent him death threats. There are some Unions that are fair, but most are breaking this country.
[/quote]

teacher unions.....

Edited February 14, 2012 by eagle_eye222001

[Ice_nine]

Wow, from ages 15-18 I pretty much had the world and the universe entirely figured out.

oops.


I'd take a chill pill bro. You'll thank me for this advice in a few years.

Much luv

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='rhetor4christ' timestamp='1329021545' post='2385772']
Yeah, okay.

But the real question is: What kind of bear is best?
[/quote]

Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica.

[Selah]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' timestamp='1329225928' post='2386816']
Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica.
[/quote]

Bears do not...what's going on here?? WHAT ARE YOU DOING???

[rhetor4christ]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' timestamp='1329225928' post='2386816']
Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica.
[/quote]

Yesssss!

[quote name='Selah' timestamp='1329226377' post='2386818']
Bears do not...what's going on here?? WHAT ARE YOU DOING???
[/quote]

It's from The Office

[Selah]

[quote][color=#282828]It's from The Office [/color] [color=#282828] [/color][/quote]

You know what, imitation is the most sincere form of flattery, so I thank you.

[arfink]

I find it interesting that you believe that unions are only capable of demanding more pay, more benefits, and better working conditions. You're basically right, but that is actually the only reason they were founded. They make demands collectively on behalf of workers, it's what they DO. Don't expect anything else from unions, you're just kidding yourself if you do. Everybody wants more pay and benefits, and the unions are just voicing the request/demand of the workers who are part of it. When the union stops being the voice of the workers, then there is a problem.

As a union member of BCTGM Local 22, I can honestly say that I am disappointed that my union hasn't pressed for higher wages. My union recently allowed all of us to receive wage cuts and freezes, and I am currently working at minimum wage as a result. If not for the union caving in I'd probably be making closer to $8.55 instead of $7.50 an hour. They allowed our seniority system to be scrapped by the company. They allowed the company to take away our sick days. They did this so that the union would be allowed to continue working for the company, and thus continue to collect union dues. It makes me a little sick that my union actually agreed to do this, instead of making a ruckus.

But hey, what do I know about unions?

[arfink]

[quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1329193423' post='2386746']
My opinions are quite informed. Unions keep demanding more pay, more pensions, and an earlier retirement age. When someone asks them to razzle dazzle it and to lower things just a little bit like the governor of Wisconsin did, they flipped and sent him death threats. There are some Unions that are fair, but most are breaking this country.
[/quote]

Oh yeah, and he didn't tell them to "razzle dazzle it." He attempted to disband their union and take away their right to collective bargaining.

[Winchester]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1329237437' post='2386903']
Oh yeah, and he didn't tell them to "razzle dazzle it." He attempted to disband their union and take away their right to collective bargaining.
[/quote]

So you were okay with the whole involuntary union dues deduction thing. That's what the real fight was about.

Collective bargaining isn't a right. I'm in a union, we were given collective bargaining by a direct vote from the citizens in the city. They are the employers. They choose to take that agreement away later, oh well. It's not a right.

[Hubertus]

I don't know much about unions, but my friends went to do some volunteer work over the summer in Chicago and they were told they couldn't do anything, not even build a handicap ramp.. Just paint. And apparently you can't fix something in your house if it's broken, you have to call an electrician/plumber/etc to do it. They said it was because of so much union legislation(?) there. That sounds like an abuse to me... Can anyone else shed some light on this?

[BG45]

[quote name='rhetor4christ' timestamp='1329180585' post='2386609']
I'm also a grad student and we're one of the few universities that actually has a grad union (which has come in handy on several occasions).
But, let this not be read as power or extra funding. We still have little power, and the pay? hahaha hahahaha.
[/quote]

Oh amen. I just know that our pay is literally 1/3 of what my boss's daughter makes one state over at the same cost of living. And good point, not necessarily power or funding, but at least somewhat helpful...

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='Selah' timestamp='1329235983' post='2386893']
You know what, imitation is the most sincere form of flattery, so I thank you.
[/quote]
mehh...lil comment.

[Selah]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' timestamp='1329259679' post='2387108']
mehh...lil comment.
[/quote]

Spot on

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Hubertus' timestamp='1329244758' post='2386991']
I don't know much about unions, but my friends went to do some volunteer work over the summer in Chicago and they were told they couldn't do anything, not even build a handicap ramp.. Just paint. And apparently you can't fix something in your house if it's broken, you have to call an electrician/plumber/etc to do it. They said it was because of so much union legislation(?) there. That sounds like an abuse to me... Can anyone else shed some light on this?
[/quote]
Any work you do could take work away from !gasp! a union worker. That is why little kids are not allowed to clean up parts of my city, the last time they did it, a grievance was filed and won.

[Ice_nine]

the world is stupid

[Paladin D]

[quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1328840137' post='2384603']
I am a man that will fight for my rights as a citizen. I have been training in Goju Ryu Karate for eleven years and am a pretty good shot with rifles and Glocks, and I am not afraid to use any of these skills in a real fight. As a man that has traditional Catholic and conservative values, I find myself shocked and ask myself: Why won't anyone else fight?

The world mainly consists of people that act as sheep, simply doing what they are told. A prime example is WWII. I read books about it and watch movies like Schindler's List and think "Why don't they do something? There are thousands of them in the camps and only a few Nazis!" A more recent example is 9/11. If extremists hijacked my plane, I would be the first guy to get up and show them that they're not half as tough as they think they are. Especially since there's over a hundred people on the plane and only about five hijackers! What made only one out of four planes fight for their lives that day? What is wrong with the world today that people won't fight for their inalienable rights given by God? What makes people not stand up to the Nazis and the hijackers? Is it out of fear of getting hurt that people won't fight back? Don't people see the immediate logical error in that plan, that if they don't fight they're going to die anyway? What on earth is going on that made this happen? Did Americans not freely enlist (At least before the draft started a little later) in WWII just seventy years ago? Did all of this craziness start in the sixties, and simply escalate after the Vietnam war? And most importantly: how can we give people a backbone?
[/quote]

I read the entire thread, but quoted the opening post for a reason.

FP: The reason why people are critiquing you is because of your original opening statement(s). I understand that you corrected/clarified a number of your points now, but you shouldn't be surprised if people have had the initial reaction the way they did based on the original.

With this in mind and based on your latest replies, I applaud you on your motivation and willingness to stand up for what you believe to be injustices that happen in our world. The thing is, and *part of it is because of your age*, you do come off a little too niave. Don't take that as an insult, it's just being realistic. I was niave, and at times I still am, ESPECIALLY when I signed that Army contract wanting to be a Paratrooper.

A lot of people don't fight because there are times they think they can actually get away, so how can you blame them if they don't know any better? It's a lot easier to talk the talk, but not walk the walk. I do agree though that the general public can seem to be too cowardly when it should stand up for themselves.

[Winchester]

Paladin D has returned.

[Papist]

I am a little tainted re unions. When my dad was a young accountant, he worked for a company that was unionized. The plant workers went on strike and my dad had to work many extra hours outside his normal accountant responsibilities, driving forklift, loading trucks, etc. to maintain as much as possible production. He was violently harassed, having bottles, rocks, etc thrown at him. Union members would be standing in his driveway as he returned home threatening him. He was married with three kids and me on the way. His coworker was severely beaten at his home. My dad believes that if his pregnant wife was not standing at the door to the driveway, he would have been beaten too.

This was many years ago, but it still hits me emotionally.